Macca

Yes, a monumental task chasing down this sort of total. Not confident but hopeful And I agree that we've been spooked by their batting approach. Our bowling plans accordingly have been poor and the field placements highly questionable We're going to need a big hundred from one of our batsmen and at least 3 other decent contributions of 50+ (or another big 100) And as you said, the pitch is playing well but the task is about concentration & temperament as we've got 2 days to get the runs But from an overall point of view, at the start of the series if you'd offered me the Ashes with a 2-2 result I would have taken it in a heartbeat Winning the Ashes to me is like beating India in a test series (home or away) or perhaps even winning the ODI world cup* (in a traditional sense) Not quite as good as winning a footy GF but if we'd won 4 or 5 flags since '64, all the aforementioned wins and the GF would have the same value (in my view) I'm a test cricket fanatic!! I'm excited about the world test championship too looking ahead ... another huge achievement whenever we can win that match But for now, we need to at least make a game of it tonight. We do not want to fall short by a big margin *The ODI World Cup is on this year being hosted by India ... begins October 5th

Match has got right away from us in that session ... bowling was poor right from the get-go Disappointing as the bowlers need to be ready to go - there are no warm-up deliveries at this level but as well as that, the bowling lacked penetration

The pitch might be a bit up and down by days 4 & 5 as well than suiting the spinners. So as you said, it's only Root that we have to be concerned about and not Moeen But in that scenario all their quicks come right into it with variable bounce being a factor (if it happens) Winning the toss and bowling first can always bring trepidation if you have to chase 250+ in the 4th innings To me being level after the first innings means the team batting second needs to be about 60 or 80 ahead But that's just my opinion @grazman

Yeah I picked up on what you think of bazball but there are any number of people who seem to like it (for now) But those who relish the battle between bat & ball are already questioning it's worth T20 cricket is already effecting 50 over cricket (not that that bothers me) so what chance has 5 days of a batathon got? It's the classic be careful what you wish for' Having said all that we dagged around way too much in the first session last night and we should have at least been pushing for singles But we managed to post a decent score so it's game on but advantage England as we do have to bat last Probably need to restrict them to under 300 but if the pitch starts playing up, chasing anything above 250 could be problematical

Good Bazball suits those with attention deficit disorder Can't stand it and it won't last (unless people want to watch another version of white-ball type cricket on flat decks with the bowlers being used as cannon fodder) Leave me out of that garbage #PrepareGreenTopsWithHeapsOfBounce

I see bazball as a threat to traditional test cricket. And I don't like it anyway We do not need another version of white-ball cricket played on flat decks In the end, people will get bored with all the runs (with very little in it for the bowlers) So are we going to see test cricket as a battle between bat and bat with the bowlers acting as cannon fodder as it is in white-ball cricket? Leave me out of that rubbish The tracks in England have all been roads and we've seen very little seam movement and not much spin The Poms seem to have an obsession with runs, runs and more runs. There's even another version of t20 in England called the '100' ... 16.4 over cricket. Why? India are the same with their obsession with more runs except their test match tracks are very difficult to bat on being spin friendly I'd like to see all our wickets in Australia revert back to the way they once were ... seam & bounce in Perth & Brisbane. Spin friendly in Adelaide and seam & spin in Sydney. As for Melbourne ... prepare a green-top with bounce Let's see how your bazball goes in those conditions! Make it harder for the batsmen, not easier. A top level batsman can still score a century in bowler friendly conditions

Now there's a great team ... not so strong in the forward line but the forward line's collective best was reasonably good to quite good (when comparing to great forward lines that we've seen across all the teams) You've had to leave some good players out too ... Sparrow, Jordon, Bowey, Hunt, Grundy, Hunter etc etc but the exercise illustrates the point that we've built from the backline & midfield with the current outfit But if one of JVR or Jefferson turns up trumps and we recruit a top quality KPF this off-season, we're going to be in contention for quite some time Replacing May down the track is the question ... but there's nothing stopping us getting a May type in the same way we acquired May himself (was it pick 5?)

Again, a very good team but premiership worthy? Can't see it and history tells us that we never really were a serious challenger for the flag So the Reverend did about as well as anyone could have given the lack of A & B+ talent The backline just wasn't anywhere near strong enough but as individuals, they ranged from solid to reasonably good to quite good Compare that backline to our current backline ... poles apart Midfield compared to our current 7 rotated midfielders falls short too. But the Daniher led midfield wasn't too shabby I'd have the forward line though .... easily better than our current set-up Put that forward line into our current team and I'm not sure we'd lose many games at all Talent is the key but before you have that talent you need a great recruiting team ... and that's what we have now So the future under Goodwin looks rosy. I like that we may be going after another possible future star in Harley Reid ... it tells the football world that we are not going to sit back. We aim to get better

Thanks Werridee, you've done well That's quite a good team and because we have fond memories of all the players you've listed, it's hard to do critical analysis All the players when playing at their best, were all very good But where we fell down was when we were up against other teams of similar ilk (you win some, you lose some) and then when up against teams who at their best, were superior For instance, in '87, Carlton was a tremendous team as were the Hawks In '88 we managed to get past teams around our mark but the Hawks were waiting for us in the GF Cats & Hawks were both really good in '89 and it all came together for the Pies in 1990 Hawks again (and the Eagles) were better teams in '91 So we were a very good team but not quite good enough But extremely well coached So ... if we insert May, Lever, Petracca, Oliver and Kozzie into that team, the team suddenly can take on all comers Who goes out, Werridee? haha

We were always 5 or 6 good players short of premiership standard during the Northey & Daniher era's so to play in so many finals series was quite an achievement We won our fair share of finals during both era's but made it to 2 GF's with a 14 & 8 and 13 & 9 records. A remarkable effort really Our midfields were never strong and the backlines were iffy We punched above our weight Go back and have a look at the Hawthorn lineup of the 80's and the Lions & Bombers line-ups in the 2000's Miles better talent wise. Streets ahead in fact Now with the current team our only real weakness is in the forward line ... but that can be rectified with a medium sized forward line (Petracca, Melksham, Fritsch) with Kozzie & Chandler buzzing about along with 1 of the 2 talls firing (one can do the bollocking work/decoy work) We'll need to hit up the forwards and the forwards will need to create separation but again, that's entirely possible Our backline & midfield is supreme And by the way, we had to play David Williams as a lead up forward as we didn't have anyone better ... as it was, he did very well, all things considered But Williams at FF wasn't the issue anyway ... the Hawks were just a superior outfit when it counted As were a few other teams during those 2 era's

How about we jump out of the blocks against the Pies and lead by 6 goals at quarter time 60 points ahead at half time, 90 at 3/4 time and then we go on and win by 118 Grundy B.O.G with 9 goals

@Neil Crompton I reckon Smith was a great manager of men so the coach being more like a manager in our sport probably goes back a long way Further to the comparisons ... Interesting stat from the Northey era ... over a 4 year period ('87 to '90) we defeated the Hawthorn powerhouse 5 times And they had the best line up of players I've ever seen ... super strong in all areas of the field Great talent and top level coaching wins big in any sport ... but what is more important? Can great talent win without top level coaching? Possibly and maybe even probably Can top level coaching win big with an average list? I'd so no but it may have happened

Another way to size things up would be to compare the best 23 from the 3 era's (Northey, Daniher & Goodwin) Not forgetting that the lists were set up in some ways by Barassi, Balme & Roos A task for @WERRIDEE who would no doubt relish such an undertaking

Ha ha! Apologies my good man! I do find it hard to seperate the 3 aforementioned coaches as they were/are excellent coaches And there's probably been any number of other excellent coaches that had the one thing in common - a lack of quality players Ridley, Skilton & Big Carl fall into that bracket Laurie Fowler for instance reckons that Ditterich was his best coach and he played under Hafey & RDB

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Northey, Daniher & Goodwin all excellent coaches A number of variables including the strength of our lists and the strengths of the opposition lists Hard to split them but the premiership might have Goodwin marginally in front The major difference is in the recruitment on an overall basis ... these days we're always looking to improve an already top class list Where as in the Northey & Daniher era's, we seemed to stop short once we got to a B or B+ level The Hawks team during the Northey years were a superstar outfit where as in Daniher's time, the Lions & Bombers were far superior to our outfit One could argue that we really only arrived as a fully fledged contender in 2021 so for that year and the following 2 years, we've been a genuine contender under Goodwin 2 more genuine years of contending (as well as this year) and with it, another premiership, then Goodwin will be well and truly ahead But Northey & Daniher got the maximum out of the teams they coached ... add 4 or 5 top players to those era's and we would have tasted ultimate success in those days, in my view

If the MC's thinking is '4th' then that thinking can permeate through to the players We can drop 2 games and still finish 4th but we also may not want to put pressure on ourselves this far out Beat Richmond and the rest of it is on our terms (to a large degree) We could get to 3rd but 2nd would require a lot to happen in our favour including us winning out

Hunter only has the one hater ... same bloke moves from player to player and then absndons the hate once that player proves him wrong The effigy in the garage requires a different head from time to time

It's official We've retained the Ashes! The last day washed out!

I hope it rains like hell Let's not forget than rain/bad light saved England in 2005 for a vital draw Reciprical rights thank you very much!! Just rain, that's all I ask!!

Just my opinion but I'm nearly convinced that Kozzie is a midfielder/forward rather than a forward/midfielder His first half was dynamic and for centre square stoppages especially, he's the man ... so is Oliver obviously, but Clarrie is currently unavailable

Not unimpressive but nevertheless, a bit meh. Would have been a shock if we'd actually lost We've got a hole at CHF that needs to be filled ... but if Grundy comes in and Brown goes out I'm still not filled with confidence But otherwise, our overall game was reasonable good but not excellent. To be honest, I don't know what to make of it when considering upcoming QF's and the like We've qualified for a decent finals spot as such (as the buffer protects us) but the issue remains with the forward line connection being a complex one with no easy answer We are certainly in the mix with our W/L ratio In the end, happy to get the win

There's a decent chance that the whole weekend could be washed out ... heavy rain is predicted for Saturday and light rain (all day) on Sunday Bring on the rain!! But if we get play on Sunday, we might be on and off the field a bit anyway Just need to hang on and the urn is ours

To be honest it looks like they've got our measure. We'll do well to hold on to the Ashes We don't know how to bowl or set fields to their bazball batting and when we bat, they seem to have good plans against our batting For instance, apparently Broad worked hard in the winter to develop a decent outswinger to bowl against Marnus & Smith. And even though he hasn't been picking up their wickets consistently, he has worried both players to a point where both players have never really looked set (apart from Smith's big 100) They've bowled a lot of short stuff to Head and that's worked. As for Davey, it's just been a matter of bowling around the top of off stump. He needs a big score in the 2nd innings (at least 60 or 70) But the defensive fields are just making it easy for their batsmen (especially the new batsmen) ... all they need to do is push the ball to point or flick it to the leg to get off strike. We've made it far too easy for them

In some ways we are in that Saints, Doggies & North bracket of teams Back 10 years ago I believe we played all the 8 interstate teams away ... might have been 2013. Could have been 7 times but the Pies for instance only ever travel interstate 4 times a year. And they never go down to Geelong And for a long time most of our home games were against interstate teams That's changed somewhat but we could well do with another blockbuster game/event A few years ago we tried the opening round vs Geelong but I reckon we should try again vs Essendon (round 1) Can't be Carlton but if it's Geelong again, we run the risk of getting them at Catpark again in a return fixture Effectively if we do that we come under the AFL's attention with 3 blockbusters in the first half of the season and they might then see us in a different light. Worth a try at least