nutbean

You see, this is what irks me. You posted earlier that you pray the Liam gets justice. You have shown a complete lack of understanding of the word "justice" as justice in this country carries the presumption of innocence so to enlighten you on this is "sticking to the topic" and is not petty. So if as you posted you want Liam to get justice then I presume you want Liam to have a trial and let the jury decide his innocence or guilt and you agree with this process irrespective of him being found innocent or guilty. Or is your argument that you dont want justice - you would just like to skip the trial process and punish him on untested evidence to hand ?

Again, I'll wait for the outcome of the trial. A decent lawyer can tear that apart ? Im not even a decent lawyer and will pick giant holes in it. - for police to suggest that Jurrah was caught red handed you would ask the question caught red handed by whom ? If everyone there was beyond drunk then you would assume the police werent there when it happened ....they were called to the scene...so...in summary...Liam Jurrah was caught red handed by people, not the police, that were beyond drunk....(the last person the NT police caught redhanded was Lindy Chamberlain) I will not condemn nor defend Liam until the "process" has run its course I will only defend the process.

ok.ok...sheesh...no need to ram it down my throat...

umm no...defending his right to innocence until proven otherwise. you are not quite getting this concept. Julian Knight was innocent up until the finish of his trial where he was found guilty by a jury of his peers. All some of us are doing is defending Liam Jurrah's presumption of innocence until a jury determines otherwise. You do not need any facts to be afforded the presumption of innocence under the law until a trial determines otherwise.

seriously ? going with lame New Zealand sheep humour ? Ewe should know better....

I dont see a great many defending him without the facts - i see a whole lot of people suggesting that justice should take its course and whilst not to get too pedantic - he actually should be defended because right here and now he is innocent - thats how our justice system works - innocent until proven guilty.

I dont know why I am trying to make you see "reason" - except drink driving you do understand that he hasnt been found guilty of anything yet. It is not proven that he has belted anyone - man, woman or child - you do realise this dont you ? That is what this little thing called a trial is going to determine.

Exactly - let's deny them all justice I say......

Your outrage ( warranted) is getting lost by your classification. Attack the education, level of ignorance and intellect of the poster and the only thing you can be accused of is being smarter.

Why even have courts ? [censored] I say, [censored] - lets skip the whole justice process, just pronounce him guilty as anybody that has done what he done is and then do your worst arrrrrr ( I have gone a bit pirate and Im not even sure why...)

its actually all over the ground and makes for very slow ball movement and kicking to congestion or to flat footed players.

and your choice is ...?

It amazes me that not many see Swans disposal - agree 100% on his disposal and I think the commentators are dazzled by the continual 40 plus output and dont look at what he does with the pill.

Me too - My squeeze is a dirty filthy Collingwood supporter so I take her to some games. I use the committee room during the week taking clients to lunch there ( highly recommend it) and I like to go to finals and at this stage they dont include the team I support.

Love it - Can i use that ? "you're a bin searching skip digger"

I think it was pointed out last year by some commentators that somewhat know their stuff that one of our problems is that we took Neeld too much at his word and had too many going about getting the contested footy. We had too many contesting the footy as opposed to good midfields who will back their one or two tough midfielders to get the footy and have others work themselves outside to receive or be there for a loose ball get. Our contested footy was too high overall when compared to our uncontested. That translates to too many chasing the contest and not enough backing your teammate in to get the ball and you presenting as the next easy target. Jordie is a prime example of that.

This is where I think you may get lots of differing opinions - our real problem is that we have had far too few "greats". We have had plenty of big sky rockets that flew high into the air gave us moments of brilliance and fizzled just as quickly and we have plenty of honest servants who given their all but have a look at, for example, Hawthorn over the past 30 - 40 years and I can count a couple of dozen greats and we have had one only that could hold their head in their company. But I also agree with you that this is only part of the problem and every part of the club comes up short over the years.

why is easy..its called ego and they love themselves ( their own self importance and sound of their own voices) more than the club. If they thought for a moment about the "club" instead of themselves they would realise they damage that has and can be caused and could be avoided by taking criticisms, complaints and gripes in a discrete manner to the right people.

Its not that difficult If you are an ex player, ex coach, ex board member or ex president OR current of all the former 1/ if you have something positive to say about the club sing it from the highest rooftops 2/ if you wish to be critical and after examination understand that publicity surrounding your gripes could damage/hurt the club then take your gripes to the current managments only (quietly) its not the difficult

I dont go to pick out mistakes and I support the team through thick and thin but as it stands now I think we need some realism and understand that our midfield in particular is thin. Whilst I dont like to think of players as crap can you point me to a less credentialled midfield than ours ?

I think the key is we need two midfielders to step up to elite. That wont be Jordie or the likes of Magner but what will happen is they will improve and be better contributors on the coat tails of the "stars". The closest we have to elite is Jones and he has a waaay to go. I am not "married" to Jordie being in the team but the good teams have the likes of Swan and Pendles and they bring their second stringers into the game. I see Jordies limitations but at this stage I see limitations with all the midfielders.

Jordies real worth will only unfold when our midfield improves - I dont think he will ever be our number one go to midfielder but as your 3rd midfielder getting clearances he could prove his worth. He needs to be 1st in the chain which is his strength not last. He needs to be giving it off to a finisher.And what is required is instant spread the minute we get the ball - even if his next option is only half a metre clear he needs that option. Its a bit like criticising our kick outs from full back - the kicker is not the problem - it is the complete lack of movement and clear options that is the undoing of us. Jordies kicking is not up to it but it is not too hard to imagine him progressing to sitting in a Carlton midfield setup with Judd and Murphy - getting the first clearance and handing it off to those two who make extraction look easy. He actually reminds me of an early Cameron Ling (not just the hair) who was definitely behind your Abletts and Bartels but he came to the fore by becoming more damaging because of him getting some loose ball due to the concentration on the more credentialled midfielders. Lings disposal improved as Geelongs midfield did. It is amazing what a little less pressure and a few more options can do for your disposal.

Im more optimistic than you OD. I think we will be tearing it up by the third half of the year.

I look optimistically at recruits to take the club forward but like you mentioned Billy, the drafting under Bailey was meant to be the fix and everyone was massively excited at the time and look how thats turned out. So whilst I am excited about the likes of Viney, Toumpas and Hogan I will keep my powder dry. What does give me optimism is Neelds ( and by extension the FD's) approach to the football club. I have no idea if he is a good "game day" coach or not but I cannot recall a coach of ours who has dropped Ex Captains, best and fairest winners and club favourites. Whether his approach is ultimately successful or not remains to be seen but I am really excited to have a professional football department that thinks nothing of reputation or past performance or "bleeding red and blue" - all that matters is to perform on and the off the field the way the FD want or be gone. I believe this approach will bring success.