nutbean

To think otherwise is a romantic notion ? How about to think otherwise is factual. Whilst a percentage of footballers are fortunate enough to move into rewarding fields post football there are a lot of footballers left very short by the system. For this reason the AFLPA and the clubs are strong on trying to promote education for footballers whilst they are playing and are also strong on getting good financial planning so the way better than average money they are earning during their playing days can be invested wisely. Football is now a full time profession where you are basically finished by 34 ( if you are extremely lucky) - with training regimes a footballer does not have the same opportunity to gain post high school education unless they are very committed as it means part time study/university patterns which takes enormous discipline. I talked with an ex MFC footballer from the 80's on this very subject who said that players first priority must to be maximise their earnings as the fallout rate post football is very high and concerning for the ALFPA.

I find it a bit odd ( and not highly believable) that there hasn't been talk with Roos about a third year. From Roos media stuff I can't detect any reluctance to go a third year ( as opposed to his stated position of no 4th year) Without any facts I would have to take it as given that the club wants him for a third year. Would I be wrong in thinking that club would have said to Roos - we want you for the third - you tell us when you are ready to announce the third year to the world at large. It poses the question - when would be the best time for the club and Roos to announce the third year ? Wouldn't it be the sooner the better ? I am not sure why there is a delay.

Couldn't agree more. My point is simply there is a major disconnect between supporter expectation and player reality. You DC, acknowledge this but many on here don't. I am with you 100% but to keep my sanity I try (with varying success) to distance myself from the emotional love for a player especially when it comes around to contract renewal time. There is no doubt in mind that you and I and most supporters have much more love for players that don't wait until seasons end or explore FA options but sign up because they "love playing for the club". My affection for the game always gets worn down by players exercising this right because unlike players am 100% committed to the club - I can't be traded or tempted to by the lure of money or success elsewhere. What I won't do though is look at a player like Frawley and hang my emotional bias on his actions and declare him a meh footballer who is conducting himself poorly both on and off the field. This is just not the case.

I think what is not fully appreciated on here is there are two different sets of expectations - one, being us supporters and the other being the players. And many posters place ( or misplace) the emotional side of the equation back onto players. We, the fans, do bleed "red and blue" - we PAY for the privilege to see our team play and our loyalty ( for most) is set in concrete. The players on the other hand are professional athletes with limited career lifespans and in the main they are loyal to the team and teamates whilst they are contracted ( some have pointed out that Scully had departed mentally the year before he left). But the decision to continue to play for a club weighs up this loyalty against two major factors being finances and team success. So when I hear that a player delaying a contract has such a huge impact - it is,in my opinion, only something that leaves a bad taste in supporters mouths. Teamates understand the system and decisions that need to be made as to their futures, as do the administrators. I don't think it matters in the slightest to the teamates. The only person that can be affected is the player himself. I have seen claims that Frawley delaying his contract is a bad look for club and he is carrying himself poorly both on and off the field. Roos himself has said - welcome to the world of free agency, its the players right to do exactly what Frawley is doing - he gets it. Roos has said that Frawley has been ok both on and off the field. The only people who are really affected by this prolonged contract situation is we, the supporters. The only thing I will say is that Frawley not being too clever should have been coached by his manager to say the following when his contract was mentioned the first time and every subsequent time - " I will not be making a decision until I am ready - this is something between myself and the club and I won't discuss it any further". As much as this would still infuriate supporters I think that this is what he should say.

Maybe you do value loyalty, as most supporters do. Most footballers now value loyalty as long as all the other boxes are ticked as well - money, length of contract, prospect of finals ( with age of the footballer being a consideration - rivers leaving to play finals before retirement ) and even coach/player relationship (daisy left for huge dollars but was only ever going to the malthouse club) or Richetelli who had a falling out with Voss.

Just visit who we should be trading for thread - have a look at all the suggestions on who we should be trying to get out of GWS - the likes of Cameron, Sheils and Tomlinson. I would be furious if our youngsters were being targeted. But these guys aren't from our club so all's good.

and there we have it !

harsh (but accurate)

Why did I snort my coffee onto the table when I read this ?

You may not read too well. I think there are a few here who would be happy with pick 5 as compensation for Frawley but would prefer him to stay. That is a big difference from wanting him to go as long as we get pick 5.

He said he has put off contract discussion with us until the end of the year and of course his manager is fielding offers from rival clubs. Before you sit down with your current club you would want to know what is on offer from other clubs. And of course Chip will have input by expressing to his manager who he would like to play with and he wouldn't. Having said that - all recruiters who would want Frawley would have contacted his manager anyway so his manager would be telling Frawley who is interested. It's just a game they all play.

I don't like losing players we spend time developing and I do agree with David King also about the lower clubs becoming feeder clubs for the top clubs - especially on higher profile type players. I am not suggesting replacing Frawley with Malceski - I was pointing out that he is the next in a line get longer to wait until seasons end to weigh up his options. I don't like FA either - the trick is not to get to emotionally attached to any players which is easier said than done. This will become the norm.

I'm neither here or there on him staying. I think he has value for the club but equally I think we could possibly trade very well for pick 5ish ( a risk I know). I am just bemused by the hand wringing and character assassination that is happening over something that is now almost a common theme with all clubs. ( add Malceski to the list)

I get annoyed at players when the make mistakes too but not with same level of passion as when an umpire gets it so wrong. My major beef is that for so many years I have watched umpires in finals series get it pretty much right. Why can't umpires umpire with the same high levels as I see during the finals ?

It seems I have to keep coming back to your posts but I would suspect that very few people actually share your views and I am not sure where you are seeing these things you keep posting. Comparing Frawley to Sylvia ? Sylvia was a perennial tease on the ground - are you suggesting that over the course Frawley has been the same ? Off the field, Sylvia had a history of rumoured and actual indiscretions - to my knowledge Frawley has had nil. I'm also interested as to why it reflects badly on the club - does that mean any player who decides to put his contract talks on hold ( and there is a mounting number of those these days) are reflecting badly on the club ? Frawley is pea brain - I would agree that he isn't the sharpest tool in the shed. He doesn't carry himself well on the field ? Seriously ? He is just another player and a player that has plenty of strengths along with plenty of flaws. He doesn't drop his head and sulk and he is not petulant. Not sure where that comment comes from. He doesn't carry himself well off the field ? The only criticism you can make as to his off field behaviour is not signing a contract to a timetable that supporters would like. He is not the only footballer in the AFL delaying his contract neogtiations these days and will certainly not be the last. I think you will have to accept that this delaying of contractual arrangements is going to become the norm, especially with FA or you are going to become disenchanted with most of the list in coming years.

I am highly conflicted - umpires kill my enjoyment of the game but being horrifically inconsistent with their calls. Not only from week to week but with 3 umpires on the ground, they all interpret decisions slightly differently. - most of the players I love go at around 75% disposal efficiency and all have clangers - which means 1 out of 4 disposals is not going where they are meant to. My players occasionally miss tackles, drop marks, kick points when they are 30m out directly in front. I accept that - yet conversely I cannot accept when an umpire makes a mistake.

It's the changing nature of the game, made more so now with Free agency. You will find that there will be some footballers that refreshingly place loyalty, love of the club and mates as a priority over financial gain. They are the players that we the supporters love all the more. Unfortunately with a players limited career and opportunity to earn incredible sums of money ( or play with successful clubs) , and clubs trading out players without a moments thought about the player, club loyalty is a far less valued commodity for most players and will continue to diminish. I haven't lost a minutes sleep over any player coming or going since I got well and truly Scull-ified two years ago.

Nah...any higher profile footballer that comes into the FA window gets the same treatment. Daisy Thomas, Gibbs, Franklin all got the same hammering and gave the same lame responses.

You may think it is designed as wedge but to me it is simple business practice. When I am looking at my options for business, the incumbents are the last I talk to as I already have them on board and I know my current $ and terms position with them. So Frawley's management rightly would go out and talk to the interested party's and get the lay of the land. I would talk to the MFC last when I know I want to stay but I want them to at least match what is being offered.

You beat me to the punch. I think people are unnecessarily stressing out about something that in all probability will come to fruition but if it doesn't well...then we do what nearly all other clubs do...we go and get another coach. The one thing I am confident of is that Roos will leave the place in infinitely better shape that it has been since our glory days. I would like to think that coaching us in 2016 would be a very attractive proposition for any coach - be it one chosen as part of a succession plan or one that is chosen at the end of Roos reign.

Why exactly is it a mess ?

Not really - the key to a succession plan is the incumbent working with current coach for a period of time as an apprentice and then you have seamless handover. ( sounds good in theory). If there is no annointed successor, we just go to market and get the possible coach who is available or who we can poach one. There is a third alternative - there is no successor announced during Roos time at the club but at the end of the period Roos announces that "Jade Rawlings ( or Mathews etc) has shown a great ability and I will hand over to him as senior coach". This means We are not locked into a public succession plan ( like Buckley and Longmire) but the end result is the same. Out of interest - The Longmire succession plan was not put in place at the appointment of Roos as coach of the Swans - Was Longmire already an assistant before announcing the succession plan ? If my flawed memory serves me right - Longmire was already an assistant and it was announced at the beginning of Roos last year that he would hand over to Longmire at years end ?

FI cars go really fast for a year and are then burn out and are put on the scrapheap. My mate still has his 120Y going strong from the 80's. I like your analogy.

Umm - we will search for a coach in the traditional method and abandon a succession plan that doesn't exist anyway. It will be apparent by the end of this year if a succession plan model is in place as I don't think that a succession plan with less than 2 years under Roos will be contemplated. Then we have two years to suss out new coaches for when Roos time is up.

It has been said - get the defensive side of the game right first. It shouldn't be one or the other but with two way running, you can see that the boys are working hard to get back defensively but are still a bit shy in running off offensively to create. You can also see that unlike the best teams we are also a bit reticent to pull the trigger quickly for fear of turning it over. We have either been too slow or bomb to quickly to a 3 on 1. I am confident this will turn.