binman

9 minutes ago, Chris said:

It holds up if people reportes as fact that he injected the players with banned drugs and they forgot the allegedly part. 

Perhaps but only if he can prove he didn't administer a banned drug. However there is no way a civil court has the capacity to determine his guilt or innocence in this regard. How would they? They would have to repeat the entire investigation, which they simply won't entertain.

In any case he has been found guilty by the AFL and NRL and an independent body in CAS is comfortably satisfied (a similar standard to a civil case i would have thought) the players were administered banned PEDs. Surely a civil court would accept these findings, particularly in the absence of records proving otherwise.

51 minutes ago, Chris said:

It may well come down to his thought that he didnt inject banned substances. If he can prove he didnt then he could go after all who said he did as it was a lie and defamed his character. I would like to see him try as he has to prove they lied, not them prove they didn't.

I don't think that logic holds up, at least in terms of journo's as they are reporting by and large the accusations made against him and then the guilty findings. Perhasp Demitriou but my recollection is that his main criticisms were around the nature of program itself and given the EFC's own investigation famously called it a pharmacological experiment can't see how he was defamed.

In any case i doubt he can prove he didn't administer  illegal drugs and i also doubt a civil court hearing a defamation case is going to faff around and give Dank a forum to try and prove his innocence and attack his enemies.

Like so much Dank says it doesn't make sense. I cant see how running defamation cases will help in any way to clear the players names in so far as they are not going to be determining what drugs the players used, just whether he has been defamed. 

In any case given he has been banned for life by the NRL and the AFL,  chose not to defend himself in either instance and an independent tribunal has determined the EFC players were administered PEDs by Dank i can't see how a court would bother exploring the player's innocence.

Add to that he doesn't have any records that one assumes if he is telling the truth would exonerate both him and the players. Which raises another obvious question. He claims EFC erased those records. Apart from the fact that is simply not plausible that he didn't keep his own copies (i mean come on) why on gods good earth would EFC destroy records that proved the players innocence. 

I for one can't wait for his court cases. 

27 minutes ago, old dee said:

10 out of 10 Steve.

Full marks?

On 1 February 2016 at 5:04 PM, ding said:

Kent

Been a fan since the first time i saw him standing over one of his opponents on the boundary line with his chest puffed out.

Skill, speed, and a bit of See You Next Tuesday about him.

Exactly what we need.

 

Yep i'm with you on this one.

I reckon if Kent can avoid injury he is a huge chance for a break out year, in the true sense of the phrase ie going from an average to amazing.

He does have a nice touch of aggro and confidence and  has real X factor. His kicking is also really dangerous, love that he is a lefty and has great penetration. His confidence means that he has a crack at goals when he has a chance, which i love. 

Slots nicely into a half forward flank and with the Trac on the other flank we will have a formidable duo who both have a bit of a strut about them. 

24 minutes ago, PaulRB said:

The value of Frost playing forward and helping out in the ruck is that Maxy can then "rest" forward, providing another target up forward to stretch the opposition. Also like Frost as a defensive forward chasing and closing down opposition attempts to rebound, I think he'd be quite effective playing on Tommy Mac type CHB who wants to run and play on .  

Agree that they might use him up forward as both tall player that will need to be manned up by a big guys, making it harder to cover Hogan and Dawes but also as a run with player as he seems to be athletic enough for that role. That said i reckon they might use him as a bit of a swing man who can cover a tall down back when needed and of course spend some time in the ruck.

Where did Roos play him in the game agianst GC in round one last year?

14 minutes ago, chook fowler said:

the big problem about a watts being the third tall is that he would be useless in the ruck

He wouldn't be in ruck though, not as such. The role he played quite a bit last year was to come over the top as the third man, meaning you only need the 'ruckman' to take position, meaning the ruckman can be any biggish player.

I actually noted a couple of times last season how effective he was in that role, frequently setting up scoring chances with really deft taps to players, who often times were streaming towards goal. Two taps to Jones immediately come to mind, with both resulting in goals. 

His ability to hit the ball into the path of moving players is a skill no doubt honed by his years playing basketball. A variation was that brilliant bit of work where he jumped up on the goals line and palmed a ball down to Garlett who volleyed it through for a goal (against GC in the first round?)

5 minutes ago, PaulRB said:

I always thought we recruited Hunt with the understanding and likelihood of at least two years development before he'd be physically ready to step up, but he had the tools (pre-growth spurt) to be a genuine AFL player.

The club keeping him and now the good words on him only confirm that this plan is coming along nicely.

I thinks clubs (and Our club!) have realised that some kids take longer to develop and if you can see the talent and nurture the talent, they might not bloom till they're 20+, but when they do they'll be solid (maybe even more).

I put Smith Jnr in similar development strategy/category, where we'd hope he'd be ready in a year or two...

Yep, very much a Roos approach. And a sensible one at that given the physical demnads of AFL football. 

1 hour ago, chookrat said:

In horse racing would ASADA interview the horses?

Neigh

(sorry)

3 hours ago, rjay said:

Remember that Brayshaw played no NAB games last year because of injury. His form was so good in the Casey practice games he forced his way into round 1 so nothing is set in stone.

That's right and IIRC roos was saying much the same things about him, even suggesting he was unlikely to play early on. I reckon if Trac is fit they'll unleash him at the G first round

1 hour ago, stuie said:

I disagree. I think whatever happen over the next 5 years, at least, will be due to Roos. He's put the people in place, he's set the standards and habits, he's responsible for this whole setup and groundwork. How many coaches has this club seen off in the last 15 years? That's a cultural problem, which is what Roos has been brought in to fix.

 

I watched the Open Mike episode with Robbie Flower for the first time recently (brillinat TV btw) and he was asked about Barassi. Robbie said that even though they weren't successful whilst he was coach the success of the late 80's and 90s would not have occurred if not for his influence. Said he introduced a much more professional culture from preparation, training habits, mindset and game day.His legacy was the culture he built.  Said when he first arrived he stripped everything back to basics, for example doing kicking drills and using both feet. Sounds very familiar. 

Brilliant thread wj. DL at its finest.

Love the last extract. How brilliant is it that we ended up with both brayshaw and the trac.

3 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

That Jobe is one to 'throw down the gauntlet' is significant as he has been the glue that has kept the 34 unified throughout.  Really feel for the guy.  He has been a stalwart for three years now seems to have had enough.  

To a certain extant I have sympathy for all the players, including Jobe who seems like a nice person. But i do wonder about his culpability in all of this. He is (was?) the captain of the club and such the key leader among the players - the talisman really. Surely he, and other senior players but in particular him, have to accept some responsibility for not refusing to participate in the supplement program, or at the very least discussing it with their managers, AFPLA , parents or for that matter ASADA.

If younger players had reservations it would have been very hard to take a different path once the senior players gave the program their approval.

I have zero problem them taking Crowley and if i was an EFC fan would be annoyed if they didn't. I'm surprised a club didn't rookie him. He did the crime (which was was pretty minor compared to the supplements regime and IIRC the drug he used was not designed to improve his performance, more manage pain) and has done the time.

They have lost 9 senior player and 5 of their best 6. It is critical they get hardened AFL players playing for them or else they'll be cannon fodder. How many of them are floating around, who critically have done somewhere near an AFL standard pre season (Crowley apparently kept very fit during his suspension and has been training with a WAFL side). 

3 hours ago, chook fowler said:

Do tell - details please!

Well he says he he wasn't part of the management chain for the "supplements" program and was in the dark about what was happening yet also says he knows that the players didn't take anything prohibited.

• I really only wanted an excuse to put a link to an aussie glam rock classic! 

2 hours ago, Fifty-5 said:

Hird wants it both ways:

• I wasn't part of the management chain for the "supplements" program and was in the dark about what was happening
• I know that the players didn't take anything prohibited

Hird likes it both ways

5 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I can't see the problem with the "Essendon 34" organising their own training. If the AFLPA wants to be involved, so what? 

 

I tend to agree, though i wonder how the AFLPA could possibly afford to pay for something like that. I assume they get money from players and the AFL but also assume they are a not for profit and don't run up surpluses. So again how do they pay? Even running an AFL standard fitness program here in Australia would cost upwards of $200k you'd reckon, give you'd need to have a full time fitness person, pay for equipment and ground hire, insurance etc etc. Also not all 34 players live in Melbourne so you would need to sort relocation and accommodation costs.

I agree with Lucifer that a settlement will be reached with the players and that it will be relatively generous. In which case the players might pay for such a camp or more likely their own personal training regime with personal trainer etc. 

On the point of a settlement  if the players can't be paid for this year how does suing for lost income fit? I mean if they successful sue for the lost income and get an income they end up getting paid for the year! 

33 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

I was right on the money!

Just heard KB say the AFLPA is considering taking the 34 players to an overseas (high altitude) location to train at a (non AFL) club!  No mention was made of a coach but I suspect my prediction of a past AFL/VFL coach being included would happen. 

My thought is that the AFLPA are being very ingenious...34 players gives them the opportunity to play practice matches which not only keeps the players physically fit it enables them to stay match fit.

I have to agree with Patrick Smith response that he finds the AFLPA trying to find every avenue to get around the CAS decision (because they don't like it) as obscene!

Who would foot the bill for all of that? It would cost a small fortune

1 hour ago, daisycutter said:

wonder what oh&s would say about those contraptions. just looking for trouble

Melbourne's OH&S issues: players using wheelie bins as ice baths

EFC's OH&S issues: year long pharmacological experiment involving thousands of off site injections of god knows what

It's nice to not be the club in the news for all the wrong reasons.

 

 can't understand how someone would waste their time writing a blog on this. first world problem.

Or posting about it....?

I watched the last half. Where do you start?

A few random thoughts?

• I guess Hird only agreed to do the interview with agreed questions and no  follow up ones. Trick i guess if you were keen to get the interview but the ABC had the opportunity to knock back the offer and should have if they were not able to ask the necessary questions. Leave the charades to free to air
• Reflective of, for me, one of the more interesting elements of this saga - how poor sports journalism in oz has become. With a few honorable exceptions the coverage of this has been hopelessly biased and riddled with spin and agendas. Thiswas like the crowning glory of all of that.
• Unfortunately went just as everyone here predicted
• The most galling thing for me was Hirds repeated assertion that CAS had sacrificed the fine 34 young men for the sake of the anti drug message (a message Hird said is the right one - cue his media advice).
• This is a completely slanderous allegation ie that CAS (an independent body) were not in fact dispassionately considering and weighing the evidence put to them by WADA and the player's lawyers but rather were making a statement about drugs in sport and pushing the WADA agenda.  Not only is it slanderous for those 3 judges it is disingenuous to the extreme as it subtly conflates WADA and CAS, implying they are in cahoots and that CAs is not actually independent
• The one bit of new info, or at least for me (and interesting choice of a dorothy dixer) is that Hird could be pursued by ASADA if it all happened now but can't be as rules were different in 2013. Is this true?

Not as good as 666's but some good straining shots here:

http://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/2016-01-16/qld-preseason-camp-day-two-training

 

So what dribble was in today's paper? I don't buy the HS, only ever read it at work.

People not happy with the new La rams logo. Too similar to the St Louis one.

 

Max Gawn 500-1 

Jack Viney 151-1

Bernie Vince 80-1

 

Brownlow get on the Gawn train.

 

yeah nah?

Maxy no hope. Only mids are a chance which gives Bernie a decent shot if we can win 10 or more games. I might have a nibble. Betfair will give much better odds than 80s i'm guessing

 

You can browse the normal age website in icognito mode and they paywall doesn't trigger.

Clever. ta