bing181

Don't bother then. I'm a proud Dees supporter, proud of what we've achieved, and prouder still of what we've managed to do in the last 12 months. Harden up.

Come on, every club, administrator, athlete in every sport pushes the boundaries to try and get a leg up on the competition. The club was only doing what other clubs were (in various guises) in trying to get the best out of a set of rules that were wide open for manipulation. Look at what GWS have done with the draft and U17 picks - the way they've used them is NOT in keeping with what they were designed to achieve (i.e., on-trade to bring in experienced players and "stars"). Look at what's happened with Adelaide and Tippett. Look at the criticism of MFC for taking Byrnes under FA - now that everyone suddenly realises that you're better off NOT getting players in under FA, rather waiting for them to be delisted - which goes completely against what FA was designed to achieve. Look at even what happened with Viney, where there has obviously been a 3 way deal so that GWS get 1, 2, 3, and the Suns were effectively offered a "sweetener" by GWS to not take Jack. Not to mention in regard to Viney, the number of posters who came on here and proposed (seriously) any number of dodgy and even blatantly illegal schemes to make sure we got him in the second round. Human nature. Like most of us here, I'd be disappointed if the Dees weren't looking to get the most benefit for the club out of every scenario, whatever it is.

But why? Schwabb (and presumably Connolly) must have realized that the direction the FD was headed was taking us nowhere. Everything that's emerged since ... that the players were effectively coaching themselves, that the levels of fitness were way under what was required, etc. etc. OK, not the job of the Admin to interfere in FD matters. But if they were in fact working to make changes and even get rid of Bailey, surely they were doing the right thing in putting the club first, as opposed to sitting on their hands and doing nothing?

If they don't post, how do you know what they like?You speak only for yourself.

a) no they haven't, they've done what many (most?) here have been asking for for a while B) question away, but then don't complain when you don't like the answers Gysberts and Martin - not a problem. A cheap way of delisting contracted players who didn't have a future under Neeld.

Phil Scully?

Yes yes and yes, though not just the young leaders, the young PLAYERS. Byrnes, awarded Best Clubman at Geelong last year. Rodan already working in development of kids and doing community work through his role as multicultural ambassador. Work ethic. Leadership. Standards. Culture.

Leaders on paper. Byrnes, Rodan and Dawes will show more genuine leadership and work ethic on and off the field than those 4 ever have. In any case "we" didn't downgrade any of those, excepting Moloney. Green retired, Davey is still there, Rivers took advantage of FA.

You've counted the same pick twice. We didn't use 3 and 13 on Hogan and Barry. We used 3 and 13 on Hogan and Barry AND Dawes. People should drop this obsession with Gysberts. He hasn't done nearly enough, and there are questions about his disposal, his fitness (endurance), and his attitude. Ball magnet?

I see it like this. Who would I rather Dom Barry was training alongside: Jordan Gysberts or David Rodan?

This injury issue with Gysberts keeps being brought up. Sure, he was injured - but not so injured he couldn't play 16 games in 2012. Evans was much more seriously injured, as was Taggert, yet they haven't been traded.

See: Sydney Swans. They won a premiership with a fair number of discards and hand-me-downs. You just watch. In any case, we had a list of players who couldn't get a game at any other club to start with. Morton for pick 88 pretty sums up where we are. Or were.

Gysberts 2012: 1 game, 9 disposals. Let's not kid ourselves. The only surprise here is that anyone was prepared to take him off our hands - he was certainly shopped around.

Compared to the plethora of experienced leaders we already have at the club, all of them.

I really don't understand why so few people get this. We need to get it right off-field before we can achieve on-field success.

Yep, just what we need. Rapt with the results. We haven't just made changes to the team and playing list. We've made changes to the culture and to the club. Much more important. The intra-club matches are going to be interesting.

Because in spite of what many here seem to believe, Gysberts is not a budding star. In his third season, he managed only one game for 9 disposals. Both Gysberts and Pedersen spent most of the year in the VFL, and played around the same number of games. While Gysberts did nothing of note, Pedersen won Werribee's best and fairest. In the previous year, Gys managed one Rising Star nomination - while Pedersen won North's best first year player. The exchange of picks reflects the reality that Pedersen is quite a way in front of Gysberts, at least at the moment.

Everyone must have known he was up for trade, and that's the best we could get. By definition then, that's what he was worth - disappointing as perhaps that may be.

Which we just did. Experienced players who know how to get the best out of themselves. Leaders and role models who know what it takes to perform at the highest level. If all Rodan does is help Dom Barry become who he could be, it's already a win.

I think that to be grammatically correct, that should be "Pants". Though in his case, Pant could be more appropriate.

Technically, it wasn't nothing - but the reality is we got what they were worth. I know plenty here think every Melbourne player is AA or potentially AA, but that's not necessarily an opinion shared by other clubs or their recruiting department. Lots of ifs and buts re Gysberts (fitness? attitude?), and he went for exactly where he should have gone.

And not to mention, moving on 2 players who we otherwise couldn't delist. Drafting and trading can't be separated from list management. It's not possible to bring in everyone you'd like, and keep everyone you want, especially in the case of project players.

Like who? In any case, how do you do a trade without letting your intentions known? "Hi, just calling to let you know that we're definitely not interested in Cameron Pederson".

Our 88 went to WCE, who then gave Stevenson to Port. So as previous, we could be effectively trading Morton for Rodan. Would be surprising, but stranger things have happened ...

Using pick 88 on Rodan has no impact whatsoever on whether we upgrade Nicholson or Evans. We still have 2 picks AFTER that available.