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We'll just add him to the 19 other forwards on our list.

Goodwin has absolutely munted this list. Unless Gawn, Petracca & Oliver dominate every week we generally lose. They have no quality support around them. We have no midfield depth for regular rotation or to mix it up. The same predictable [censored]. Forward of centre we've been terrible since mid 2022. Goodwin has done nothing but flood our list with mediocre forwards (at the expense of our midfield) - not addressed the actual problem. We play slow because we are slow. If he comes out and says we didn't get the game on our terms I'll spew.

We're too slow between the arcs. Midfield has no depth, been saying this for 2 yrs. We have defenders, so so forwards, a whole heap of utility types and a very shallow engine room. The list is out of balance becaus it is too tailored to structure and control. Relying on Gawn, Trac and Oliver in the guts and May/Lever to intercept every week is not a gameplan. Win or lose today I think we're in trouble going forward.

What a [censored] win.

Mentioned last year our engine room was heading towards a cliff. Petracca is beast mode - when fit, but last year showed he can't sustain a full year in the guts (which is understandable given how intense he plays) spending some time forward late in the year. Viney - solid but getting on and at some stage will slow up. Done a lot of enforcer work over the years. Oliver - unknown as to how many games he plays. Sparrow - hasn't taken next step. The rest are either wingers or makeshifters from other positions or kids who haven't played a game. Jordon was not A-grade but he is a loss. Used mostly in guts and was building. He will be serviceable at Sydney. Hop on the Dees website and look at the players breakdown by position. 19 listed as forwards FFS. Sure, some might get some mid time like Pickett and ANB but Pickett will be managed timewise and ANB is not engine room calibre full stop. IMO we have flirted with the last two off-seasons trade and draft wise. Goodwin has ridden on the shoulders of Gawn , Trac , Oliver for too long and I think it will catch up with us in 2024. I'm not saying some of the players we've picked up over the last few years are no good but we are too short on specialist mids. If 1 of Trac, Oliver or Viney goes down we are getting chopped up week in week out.

Vale Ron Barassi Such a massive part of football. ICON and LEGEND.

We don't maintain intensity and focus like we used to over 4 quarters. I'm saying though that the mental side under Burgess was better as well. It's an observation. Our strategy, ball use and selections are obviously the big problem to be fixed though going forward.

No, you just misunderstand it. I'm not letting the players or coach off the hook, simply saying our standards have slipped.

It's very frustrating.

You underestimate him. In 2021 this team was so regimented and drilled. Discipline does that. Burgess was in their heads both at training and away from football. His game day input also significant. They're all over the place now. They try here and there but they're not the same team IMO. Our lack of professionalism is telling. I throw the coach in there as well, he leaves too much to chance, nort meticulous enough. Our problems go a lot deeper than losing Burgess though, no doubt.

I've said it once and I'll say it again. When Burgess walked out, it wasn't just our fitness but a whole lot of professionalism that left too. Goodwin is too close to this group. Too much warm fuzzy culture and complete neglect to the forward half. He has completely coached the attacking nouse, system and instinct out of this team with his stupid squeeze em up strategy. We squeeze ourselves up. We can't transition to save ourselves.

If this [censored] gets off, the AFL are essentially rendering players sitting ducks.

About a month ago when we lost (forget against who) Goodwin was questioned on our forward setup and transition and stated it was the least of his issues. The man is in complete denial about both our forward issues along with the 'efficiency' of his game plan. We will significantly regress over the next few years if this doesn't change.

At least 2 yrs of missing finals, maybe 3 before the club wakes up. By then it's rebuild time.

The Goodwin gameplan has rendered us a diabolical [censored] heap when transitioning and connecting with the forwards. His solution will be 'try harder'. Even when we win it is bloody arduous to watch. Thank [censored] I made it to Perth to see a winning GF because this era is over. Burgess, support coaches and the players themselves were the key drivers. Goodwin obviously played a role but he wasn't a catalyst.

All Carlton have to do is attack the footy and hold their marks and they win easily.

When Burgess walked out it wasnt just fitness but a whole lot of discipline and professionalism that went out the door too. Half the group are coasting atm. Goodwin's gameplan is hedged far too much to perfect structure and he's uninspiring as [censored]. Too slow. Too poor 1 on 1. Teamwork questionable. Easily outcoached. Play like gentlemen. Too much load on too few. Too predictable. Zero kicking game. Skills lacking. 7-4 flatters us. We will win a few more games here or there but 2023 is going to be a nothing year unless there is a fundamental shift in attitude, hunger and gamestyle. Unlikely at this stage because the culture is about being warm and fuzzy instead of calling 'a spade a spade'. Not wholesale changes but a mini clean out is required at end of year. The coach needs serious scrutiny as well. Fresh players, fresh ideas and fresh mindset required for 2024 otherwise the next 5 years will be dismal. The comp will leave us behind.

After we beat Richmond. Hardwick in his presser said he knew exactly how we would play and how to beat us. They executed their game style which was effective but they just had way too many good players out to get the job done. He was essentially saying he outcoached Goodwin. Whilst it has a sour grapes vibe, he was, essentially, right. Further, Goodwin's favourite saying is that we didn't get the game on our terms. Effectively he's saying we play in a comfort zone and if things aren't going the way we like it, we can't adapt in game.

Too slow and too predictable.

Moore rotates midfield does he? FMD Pies could handle losing a mid easily, they did quite well without Adams who you conveniently missed. It doesn't mean those players you listed arent good it means they have more good options for cover. That's the point.

I knew Dunstan was injured this week (wasnt sure how long though) but really, this week, week after it doesnt matter the point still stands. Re: Pies, if they copped injuries they have genuine options to swing quality players inside or out on gameday as well as week to week management. We arent in the same situation.

This. Gotta feel sorry for them because they play their hearts out every bloody week for this team whilst they slowly get grinded into the ground. The secondary issue is depth and it's going to catch up with us very soon. Now, Dunstan is a candidate for a call up next week but the bloke has hardly played a senior game in 2yrs. He'll get done by the pace of senior footy as well as a lack of real match practice of playing with Petracca, Viney & Gawn. He'll get hung out to dry and it's all due to those dopey bastards in the FD. Brayshaw (currently) is not mid standard, Sparrow tries but cant make an impact. Jordan needs work and isn't quite fit for purpose. I also wonder which youngsters we have in the wings who are genuine mid material. Last few drafts have been a bit underwhelming. Meanwhile Collingwood can rotate about 7 top mids. We're looking into the midfield abyss over the next few years.

Next month will be a shambles and a window into the next few years unless Goodwin wakes the [censored] up and recruits another top mid in trade period.

Petracca, Oliver, Viney... cliff. That's our midfield depth. Doesn't matter who we bring in for Oliver (if required), they will be substandard. A legacy of Goodwin riding the same players into the ground year after year and not developing our other mids. Dunstan can get the pill but not sure about ball use and speed - evidently, Goody recruited him to play for Casey anyway. Hope Clarry pulls up ok.

Rivers has had a very solid month. His attack at the contest and reading of the play has been impressive. Confident and has good vision. I'll allow the odd mistake here and there when he's having such a positive impact.