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They should give him a licence to do that into the 50 more - I would bet Garlett would get to the footy first.

That is definitely true. There are some so invested in Jack being 'the reason' we are where we are that they can barely admit he plays a good game. That Dr.D that Ethan dissected so well before would be one such individual. There are a few 'investing' themselves in Oscar's failure too, and now there will be more.

Thank you for that, now I understand what you and I, presume, @Stretch Johnson were saying. You are essentially saying that whatever Watts does or however his replacement performs has no bearing on whether the decision to move Jack on was the right one. As a person who loves a semantic argument, I couldn't agree more. However, as someone who lives in reality, I can say that you will yourselves be caught up in threads dedicated to doing what you have stipulated cannot be done - query the merits of the decision. You better have that link ready, for the next 3/4 years? You should use Sticky Notes or OneNote - for easy access!

Classy.

I read a social experiment that had those that paid to see a movie, rate it higher than those that didn't have to pay - the investment made the person wedded to the movie more and made it desirable to make it worth that investment. In this case, I don't think it is the investment of the first pick in the draft, but the emotional investment of this bloke from 1) the thousands of starved and desperate Dees fans wanting so badly to believe that he will help deliver them back to finals and hopefully a flag, 2) that he could one day be that elusive 'star,' and 3) that he is such a ripping bloke...

I can't comment on D. But the club controls C and they are keen to move him, they will accept a deal perhaps below what his 'market' is.

Worth explaining. What would affect the merits of this decision?

He won't be 'gone' yet I wouldn't think but for all intents and purposes... He will be essentially saying goodbye from what Connors has said.

Lever has already publicly said he is willing to 'go into the draft' if the Crows stonewall. I have never heard a player be so frank about going into the draft - so he is obviously aware that the Cows are the ones playing funny buggers.

Thinking of the Bluey and moving past this, now moot, debate - I was wondering what kind of speech I would make as a coach to that group and with that platform. Jack will the there of course, and there will be those bidding him farewell and there will be those still smarting from the end of the season. The message from Goodwin and Mahoney has been that Watts is being moved on for a lack of commitment and preparation to being a professional footy player. The merits of that message are not for debate here - that is the message. So when it comes to Goodwin's speech he doesn't need to make an overt statement about that, and it would also be overtly 'on the nose' to make any more references to it with Jack in the room. If I was Goodwin, I would go a different route and try to thread a needle on a message of thanking Jack for his service, and making a point to the players that remain that they are officially out of excuses: '...and that was my thoughts on this season. Which brings me to tonight, tomorrow, the summer, and the future; to the sometimes brutal honesty we deliver each other, the tough decisions we make, the effort we put in when no-one is watching and the reward we get for that in the future. We will be saying goodbye to a few Demons tonight; (naming all delisted Demons)... and the incredibly loyal Demon Jack Watts. A few words on this impressive young man; Jack will soon start a new chapter in his career and all of us in this room want to see you succeed and want you to know how thankful the Melbourne footy club is for your contributions to the club over the past 9 years. Jack put up with a lot over his time at this great club. A few years ago, when the club was not-so-great, Jack was placed on an unreachable pedestal. He was lauded as the saviour of a club that one player could never save. When things didn't go well, the first and last Demon that was criticised and dissected was number 4. He unfairly drew the attention of a rabid media and a disappointed and angry fanbase over most of the ills of the club. This has struck me the most since becoming head coach was the amount of attention afforded to the tall, blonde role playing flanker with the killer right boot... Moving forward into the future without Jack, my message to the players, footy department, and admin that remain is that we won't have that convenient distraction anymore, the scapegoat to all our problems won't have that burden - we will all have to shoulder that burden ourselves. There will be a renewed focus for this club on those that deserve such inspection and attention - starting with me, Peter, Glen, the Leadership Group, and our on-field performances will no longer be seen through the lens of 'Jack Watts and the Melbourne Football Club' - we will all now share that burden. I hope you are all willing to work hard this off season so that you are ready for that bright light of inspection come next season...(pause for effect, and I would look at a couple of players in the eyes) Thanks Jack, and we all wish you the best in your next chapter.' That's the kind of address I would make...

Became our only 'creator' and teams shut him down and us in the second half of the year. Really good player though, has trouble hitting spot up kicks but with Hogan up the ground next year will have more room to work with.

This deal will be dissected and judged by fans and media - and, as you allude, one of the arguments will be the effect on the Demons' culture and professionalism once he leaves. So you actually agree with me...

I hope most don't agree. We always eat each other alive when ever there is something that divides the club. If you want the club to be mature then shouldn't we mirror that? It isn't mature to react by 'microwaving your membership' or threaten to leave the club, but equally it isn't mature to tell those that feel aggrieved to 'eff off' and that their club doesn't want them. We are too small a club to be so petty. There is a line in the sand for you.

Any hope that targets will be made available next week?

When Lever said - 'I will go into the draft' - we gained leverage. When we found out about how the Crows acted when meeting with Mahoney and Viney we gained leverage, with him being disinvited from the B+F we gained leverage (perception in press only - makes it harder for them to stonewall), and when he polled outside the top 10 we gained leverage. ND10 and ND45 or a pick swap in the second round. We acted in good faith with offering a fair trade and their petulance should not be rewarded.

I don't like that trade - we can discuss it in the Lever thread but we have leverage (no pun intended) and ND10 and change (ND45 or a middle finger machine will do).

He wants to play up the ground and now he definitely can - in fact he will need to. I hope they give him a consistent role and allow him to settle into some running and leading patterns and get the team used to it to. Because if this bloke is leading into space on centre wing then you really don't need that extra handball to a completely free bloke on the halfback flank - you need to kick the ball onto his advantage side and get numbers to his feet and running past him.

I was wrong with Hunt - but I barely saw the kid. I hope my gut instinct is wrong here.

I agree (cautiously). He is tracking very well for his age. If he continues to improve at the rate he is - he will be a very good role player. Especially if he can be a gorilla tamer. Lever to help from a third tall position. Frost to provide run (if he can beat his bloke as his first job) so Oscar is just directing traffic and not much more. PS. He is going to find life a lot tougher with Watts going, he will immediately be the ire of fans of the resident whipping boy. Come next week, the eye of sauron will be fixed on Oscar.

The irony of the plethora of comparisons to Pendlebury? I can't think of one player drafted since, that actually effing plays like him...

I don't rate Howe. The perceived pedestal I have put Roos on is earned in my opinion. One of the greatest coaches of modern times. I feel like I have criticised his final year as I heard first hand he was distant and not involved and I shared as much here. With Goodwin I have seen a couple of things this year that frustrate me, but even then I would preface it with two things; he has an exciting brand of footy, and he managed great buy in from those talented enough to execute his plan. Getting back to Howe - there was a period where I didn't post much and that was effectively during and after that trade, but nevertheless, it was a trade that I was not that interested in because I didn't rate him as a HFF or a HBF. Howe also didn't play, in 2016, to the level he has this year and that was my reference to Hibberd - if we are to judge that trade now - where we would put him in our current team would have to shape that argument. And I also realise that the coming Watts trade will not be judged for years - so we are in agreement there too.

I won't want the FD sacked - what posting history would make you think that? But to argue that 'how Watts goes at his new to club is irrelevant' is a fairly weak argument. If we can criticise the Howe trade, we can criticise this.

Was that even the trade? Happy to castigate but it isn't black and white these judgements. Where would Howe have played with Hibberd at the club etc. I really don't think my point is controversial.

Especially when Roos did get something out of him for an entire season. Of course this trade will be judged on how he performs and how the asset we get performs. To think otherwise is naive.