hemingway

Thanks Bub , I had not seen Langdon's comments when I posted.

Truly interesting. Brinkmanship at its best. It is possible that Freo love Jessie and are just playing hardball as a negotiation stance. Most negotiators will stick by their ambit position for as long as possible. What they have put is only ridiculous if you think Hogan is a star. Unlike your stars of the game, he has not proved himself in a sustained way. More likely is that Freo would like Jessie but like others in the footy world (including the Dees) have their doubts about his value and longevity. Also Jessie may seem less than enthusiastic about joining Freo creating further doubts about the deal. Not good if you offering him mega bucks and he seems a little detached and not jumping for joy. They want him but are not prepared to sell the farm. If I was Freo, I would not change my position. See how he goes next season and if he does okay then come knocking. The Dees are the loser because they end up with a player that is not switched on, maybe on the side lines with injury, and is not going to remain integral to their game plan in the future. Unless, Jessie gets his act together, plays great footy, falls in love with the Dees and commits to a Demon future. Now that would be something!

including your good self.

Quite right Dragon. We do make assumptions but perhaps we are only trying to make some sense of it all. Given our performance in the last 4 games, it obviously raises questions as to Hogan's role in the team. Your proposition is valid and lets hope correct. When an employee is thinking of leaving an organisation it can affect commitment and motivation. At the moment we have 22 players who seem totally committed to the Club and each other. If Hogan came back switched on that would be fantastic. But the doubt is there and at very least will continue to be an unwanted distraction to player and club particularly toward the end of the season.

Love your last line, a line that most of us occasionally use or would like to use, until common sense prevails. And that common sense tells us that rarely do you get your wish, indeed, by using your famous last line, you may well get something but less than what you want at a cost or something that is even worse.....you get nothing. I like your spirit but I would much prefer a negotiated outcome that all parties including Hogan desire. That Flag tilt you refer to may not be assisted by Hogan's return particularly if he has not invested in the future of the team and the Club. .

Unfortunately it’s not that simple. Most would agree that he is a gun forward and can kick goals. But there are so many other considerations which posters have already discussed. Contract length and cost, the need to gain some players to fit gaps, the need to keep existing valuable players by paying them top dollar, team structures and game plan, injury, attitude, the potential cost and liability of him on a long term contract, the potential cost of him playing one more season and then walking. If it was just about ability, potential etc there would be no debate

My many years spent around negotiating tables with some of the toughest and best wheelers and dealers have taught me that there are some fundamental principles: -Every one recognizes that there is always "ambit"" -That successful negotiation needs to take place leaving personal egos aside. -That you need to place yourself in the shoes of the person on the other side of the table. You may not accept their claims or position, but you need to understand and accept that a resolution requires accommodation on both sides. -That there is no deal or successful deal without compromise. -Unless the person on the other side is incompetent, you never get your best outcome, but you get an outcome that you can live with. -Both sides need to feel that they have had a win and that the outcome is acceptable to their constituents.

Chook, you are being generous in referring to these guys as journalists. Footy journalists, you have to be kidding.

Can you change your name to Double Entendre. No perhaps Explicitly Opportunistic would be more accurate.

We are in a difficult position with Hogan. We have discovered that team success is not reliant on Hogan. Second, his foot is an issue. We all know about feet and that serious injury can not only seriously interrupt careers but end them. You don't want a bloke on $800 plus on the sidelines for a season or more. In terms of wise money management, a long term Demon deal with Hogan carries the risk that his foot remains an issue. Indeed, how many games can he string together without his body letting him down? We have a conundrum. We don't want Hogan hanging around for another season with an injury and poor attitude, yet we would not want to sign him to a long term expensive contract without being very confident that his foot injury is not going to impede his future. For me, there are too many ifs and buts with Hogan. Probably Freo and other clubs have the same concerns. Best that we plan a future without him, which means we need to compromise on the trade and accept less than what many feel we should get.

A bigger asset would be if he kicked with both feet, and at least kicked accurately with his preferred.

Definitely needs a tank. I don't think we have seen a truly fit Kent due to his injury. It's a pity because he has given us glimpses of what he could become. He remains very stiff and inflexible in the lower back often a cause or precursor of hamstring problems. Hard to see him ever having a fit body and having a tank that is needed to play 4Q of footy at the top level.

It really is a minefield in regard to total club salary management. A job for cool clear heads.

well I hope your right. and if you are, just don't brag about it.

I don't know why it is amusing, unless you think your cleverer than the next person. Like looking at someone's CV, you can form an impression or an opinion based on a person's track record. In the KK case, his injury history, lack of games, and GC's willingness to trade provides an uninspiring track record. The other reasoning relates to his untapped potential, which is always debatable. In the past, we have had a litany of names with potential on our list. And we all have opinions on those names.

Hope your right rjay so I will bow to your greater knowledge. Apropos of another post of mine, I should heed my own words and have confidence in our selection and selectors.

Underwhelmed by this guy given his track record. Unrealized potential is an unconvincing reason to buy him.

Remember these guys are not brain surgeons. Seriously, if they had any brains they would not be doing what they do. Sadly, the media is full of jumped up, second rate spruikers of bs. Its across all media covering all subject matter, it's just that sports media is at the bottom of the dung heap. They have a time slot on TV or radio or blog and have to say something that is supposed to be informative and entertaining. Hence the daily quest to bring an exclusive to the table or to break news. The media outlet is not going to give the guys a gig if they bring their mum's chocolate cake recipe to the microphone. Its about headlines and short grabs, and a quick opinion which is said to be an "analysis" of the daily trade talk. Its about these guys developing a reputation as a story breaker. Investigative journalism it is not, but its looking at [censored] bits from sources and twitter feeds. No skill required, its just having a pair of ears and eyes and an ability to build a narrative around the speculation. Until a club announces a decision, it is all speculation.

How times change. A few years ago, Hogan's departure would have been seen as a sign of failure by the club, of yet another star player leaving for the money and success at another club. Perhaps the Frawley departure is a case in point, and he was not even a star. Now most of us have confidence in this footy club and no longer see us as the whipping boy of the Victorian based clubs. We have tasted success and have confidence in the club and its decision makers. Confidence and belief is an amazing thing. We think the clubs decision makers will do the right thing and many now concede that losing Hogan may not be such a bad thing. Imagine the media's take on it a few years ago. No longer. I would love to see Hogan remain but I now have a different feeling about it all. No longer the sentiment of loyalty but a quest for success, whatever it takes.

Another ruckman is essential. And a ruckman that can more than hold his own against quality opponents. Have not seen Preuss and I will leave it to better judges than me to determine if he is the answer. We were very lucky this year that Max got through the season. Max will get injured, its not if, but when, and what will be the extent of the injury. Martin would be the ideal candidate but not likely to happen.

Trade talks can be destabilizing depending on the player and how long the speculation goes on. Regarding Hogan, going home is always the elephant in the room whenever his name is discussed. Unless he is prepared to sign a long term contract, beyond 2019, I would trade him and get the best deal possible. Clearly the clubs silence means that Hogan is seriously entertaining Freos offer and the Club is prepared to consider a deal. Its what makes sense for both parties. Get the best possible deal and do it as quickly as possible. I am well and truly over Hogan and want us to build an unstoppable team with a strong culture and team based behaviour we have witnessed in the latter end of the season.

Exactly, perfect summary of probable situation.

Kent has had his opportunities and seems prone to injury. He clearly wants out, so let him go. After 5 years, time is up.

Hogan and the club can easily put the rumours to bed by making a statement today. Deafening silence will tell it’s own story.

A timely retirement. Really good to see a player go gracefully when he knows father time is calling. Perhaps he chose retirement over being delisted, but still shows good judgement. Liked him a lot. Seemed to be a great club man and gave it his all. A real goer and competitor. .