dieter

I agree about his body language. I feel sorry for him...

And less 'dirty'.

Let's just do one day at a time. Life is many days, to quote TS Eliot.

He was sensational in the first half, I gave my votes for 4 quarters of consistent footy. Admittedly, T. Mac's 4 first half goals were the difference. Lever, T.Mac, Jetta could have won votes as well. But don't you worry. Nasher, no-one on this site values the impact of T. Mac more than I do. He is the essential x factor in the Demon forward line. I'd love to now play Richmond, Hawthorn and Geelong with the T mac and the great Viney in the side...

I failed to see the funny side, wondered why they laughed. I wonder how they'd like to be punched in the balls...

I fail to understand the support for Tyson. He is a great ball winner, often in tight situations - a bit like Harmes yesterday - but more often than not, unlike Clarrie, he doesn't have the instinct or ability to get through or out of those situations. He also is a regular sinner in the turnover stakes. Now having said that, I understand how easy it is to sit in an off field armchair and criticize athletes doing their best. I recall speaking to an ex Demon player whose son now plays for us. I said, I'd like a dollar for every time Tyson kicks the ball to the opposition. The ex demon player clearly wasn't impressed with my comment and I understood this to mean, hey, sonny boy, have you ever played the game, do you understand the pressure these guys play under? Tyson is obviously a very gifted footballer. I wonder if, like Neville Jetta, for example, a switch to a less pressured position would suit him and the team more.

Well, hooray for Michael C, at least Day has been cited. About bloody time....

6: Gawn 5: Jones 4: Oliver 3: Salem 2: Hibberd 1: lewis

I'll watch the replay tomorrow. I like Tyson, but he breaks my heart to often...

cup half full man...

Looking at tucker makes me fatter...Carbs, Schwabs, it's all the same to the fat man...

Joeboy tells it like he sees it. Dom T is a turnover merchant. MFC pays him a fortune to kick the ball to the opposition.

Who needs Viney anyhow?

Brian Taylor certainly agrees with this assessment of the mighty Dom T. Amazing how frigging blind most commentators are: they see what they want to see...

They certainly took them to town in the pre-season game...

I did a trypo: it's dummkopf....

dumkopfs

What stage of what querater was that? I'd like to watch it to see how bad it was...

I'm in SA, been busy running wine business, finally watched replay and I am very impressed by the following: The new-found co-ordination and gelling of the back line. The intense forward pressure. The simply brilliant bonus that Tom McDonald brings to the forward line. Sign this boy up, offer him what he wants, he is worth a fortune in Prizes, to quote Iggy. I liked Hunt's wok. Neale Bullen is NOWHERE NEAR AS BAD as the tragics on this site make out. He is a huge behind the scenes investor. Jetta is worth his weight in gold. Brayshaw could be anything. St Kilda are not a bad side. Had they kicked straight... The SA Port Adelaide supporters have the same opinion of J.Watts that the Watts critics had when he played for us. There is good frisson between the forwards. Spargo, Hannan and Fritsch don't need to get thousands of possessions because they contest ferociously. Garlett is better than Harmes.

6:Oliver 5: Gawn 4:Brayshwaw 3; Hogan 2:Hibberd 1:Oscar McDonald

As an old Irish workmate once said, and I'll paraphrase: Fluck Tim Watson, and if he any relatives in America, fluck dem too.

Not all Nazi satellites complied, Nutbean. The Bulgarians didn't, the Danes didn't and the Albanians didn't. The French, the Italians and the Hungarians complied. It's the people of Denmark, Bulgaria and Albania who are/ were the heroes. My heart goes out to them. They showed the face of humanity and compassion. As did many Poles, Ukrainians, Germans, Italians and French people. They are the true heroes of the world.

I get your point, Nutbean and I understand it. My question is to do with the difference it makes to the ethnically cleansed/murdered whether it was a global policy or a regional policy. I speak from experience. My mother's family was ethnically cleansed in October 1944 by Tito's whatever you want to call them. The men in my mother's city were gathered in the sports stadium enclave, not fed or sheltered for 3 days then shot. My mother was put in a cattle truck like in the Spielberg movies, with all the German women under 40 from that district, a soldier's helmet in the center of the carriage to be used as a urinal/[censored] bucket, and after a train journey where no-one was fed, that lasted 6 days they disembarked on the outskirts of a city in the Ukraine, then called Stalino. They were taken to a bauxite mine where they worked 12 hours a day for 7 days a week and most of them died of typhoid and malnutrition and exhaustion. My mother was released in April 1947. She weighed 44 kilos.A few of my mother's fellow inmates weren't released until 1950. To my mother's credit she never blamed anybody, spoke glowingly about the kind Ukrainian farming families who showed them kindness and gave them food when they could.Most tellingly, from my perspective, the experience filled her with compassion for all the other people in the world who have suffered similar fates. She said to me once that she could not imagine how anyone who had survived what she had survived could treat other human beings in the way they had been treated.

I tried to post the letter yesterday> it seemed to have been censored. It's actually the letter which uses the word Nazi: I am only quoting. New Palestine Party. Visit of Menachen Begin and Aims of Political Movement Discussed. A letter to The New York Times. Saturday December 4, 1948 by Albert Einstein, Hannah Arendt, Sidney Hook, et.al.New Palestine Party. Visit of Menachen Begin and Aims of Political Movement Discussed. A letter to The New York Times, published in the "Books" section (Page 12) of Saturday December 4, 1948by Albert Einstein, Hannah Arendt, Sidney Hook, et.al.Source: Text from original microfilmTO THE EDITORS OF NEW YORK TIMES:Among the most disturbing political phenomena of our times is the emergence in the newly created state of Israel of the "Freedom Party" (Tnuat Haherut), a political party closely akin in its organization, methods, political philosophy and social appeal to the Nazi and Fascist parties. It was formed out of the membership and following of the former Irgun Zvai Leumi, a terrorist, right-wing, chauvinist organization in Palestine.The current visit of Menachem Begin, leader of this party, to the United States is obviously calculated to give the impression of American support for his party in the coming Israeli elections, and to cement political ties with conservative Zionist elements in the United States. Several Americans of national repute have lent their names to welcome his visit. It is inconceivable that those who oppose fascism throughout the world, if correctly informed as to Mr. Begin's political record and perspectives, could add their names and support to the movement he represents.Before irreparable damage is done by way of financial contributions, public manifestations in Begin's behalf, and the creation in Palestine of the impression that a large segment of America supports Fascist elements in Israel, the American public must be informed as to the record and objectives of Mr. Begin and his movement.The public avowals of Begin's party are no guide whatever to its actual character. Today they speak of freedom, democracy and anti-imperialism, whereas until recently they openly preached the doctrine of the Fascist state. It is in its actions that the terrorist party betrays its real character; from its past actions we can judge what it may be expected to do in the future.Attack on Arab VillageA shocking example was their behavior in the Arab village of Deir Yassin. This village, off the main roads and surrounded by Jewish lands, had taken no part in the war, and had even fought off Arab bands who wanted to use the village as their base. On April 9 (THE NEW YORK TIMES), terrorist bands attacked this peaceful village, which was not a military objective in the fighting, killed most of its inhabitants (240 men, women, and children) and kept a few of them alive to parade as captives through the streets of Jerusalem. Most of the Jewish community was horrified at the deed, and the Jewish Agency sent a telegram of apology to King Abdullah of Trans-Jordan. But the terrorists, far from being ashamed of their act, were proud of this massacre, publicized it widely, and invited all the foreign correspondents present in the country to view the heaped corpses and the general havoc at Deir Yassin.The Deir Yassin incident exemplifies the character and actions of the Freedom Party.Within the Jewish community they have preached an admixture of ultranationalism, religious mysticism, and racial superiority. Like other Fascist parties they have been used to break strikes, and have themselves pressed for the destruction of free trade unions. In their stead they have proposed corporate unions on the Italian Fascist model.During the last years of sporadic anti-British violence, the IZL and Stern groups inaugurated a reign of terror in the Palestine Jewish community. Teachers were beaten up for speaking against them, adults were shot for not letting their children join them. By gangster methods, beatings, window-smashing, and wide-spread robberies, the terrorists intimidated the population and exacted a heavy tribute.The people of the Freedom Party have had no part in the constructive achievements in Palestine. They have reclaimed no land, built no settlements, and only detracted from the Jewish defense activity. Their much-publicized immigration endeavors were minute, and devoted mainly to bringing in Fascist compatriots.Discrepancies SeenThe discrepancies between the bold claims now being made by Begin and his party, and their record of past performance in Palestine bear the imprint of no ordinary political party. This is the unmistakable stamp of a Fascist party for whom terrorism (against Jews, Arabs, and British alike), and misrepresentation are means, and a "Leader State" is the goal.In the light of the foregoing considerations, it is imperative that the truth about Mr. Begin and his movement be made known in this country. It is all the more tragic that the top leadership of American Zionism has refused to campaign against Begin's efforts, or even to expose to its own constituents the dangers to Israel from support to Begin.The undersigned therefore take this means of publicly presenting a few salient facts concerning Begin and his party; and of urging all concerned not to support this latest manifestation of fascism.ISIDORE ABRAMOWITZ,HANNAH ARENDT,ABRAHAM BRICK,RABBI JESSURUN CARDOZO,ALBERT EINSTEIN,HERMAN EISEN, M.D.,HAYIM FINEMAN, M. GALLEN, M.D.,H.H. HARRIS,ZELIG S. HARRIS,SIDNEY HOOK,FRED KARUSH,BRURIA KAUFMAN,IRMA L. LINDHEIM,NACHMAN MAISEL,SEYMOUR MELMAN,MYER D. MENDELSON, M.D.,HARRY M. OSLINSKY,SAMUEL PITLICK,FRITZ ROHRLICH,LOUIS P. ROCKER,RUTH SAGIS,ITZHAK SANKOWSKY,I.J. SHOENBERG,SAMUEL SHUMAN,M. SINGER,IRMA WOLFE,STEFAN WOLFE.New York, Dec. 2, 1948

Wasn't that the one awarded to Begin? I much prefer Einstein and Arendt's view of Begin- a terrorist who headed an institution which behaved like the Nazis. Yes, in a letter published in the New York Times in 1947 or 48, signed by about thirty other peace loving Jews.