While I am a big wrap for Barty's courage on the field and obviously wish him all the best with what his family is going through his form this year has hardly been sensational. He beat Brent Harvey in round but really I think Brent Harvey was having a shocking year before he got injured really only dominated one game before his injury (I cannot remember who. Anyone?). Then at the weekend he spent a fair bit of time on Cooney, who is a match winner but is making his way back from injury and an interrupted pre season and I don't think Bartram blanketed him really at all. And when he has the ball he panics and his kicking is horrific. He coughed it up twice really badly on Saturday. He really needs to be put on Mitchell or Sewell this weekend and see what he can do as these players are matchwinners and in form. If he fails he needs to go back to the reserves.

I personally think Daniel Bell should be brought in for this game and put on Mitchell or Sewell with a view to earmarking him for this defensive midfield role. (Sorry to steal another poster's view in another thread) He has obviously played well in the VFL at the weekend and I think he is a better option than Bartram at the moment.

Bartram has never really got back to his 2006 form before he was injured. Have a look at the supercoach points from the weekend. Bartram is down the bottom of our team's individual point totals.

There is no room for Bell down back anymore and I am fine with this. The dees core backline group of Garland, Warnock, Rivers, Martin, Frawley, Bennell, Whelan, Cheyney is exciting and needs to play together as much as possible.

Bell when he was drafted was regarded as having a beautiful kick and I hope he can get back to this been a strength at AFL level.

What do others think of Bartram's 2008 form?

Is he in our best 22?

Very underrated player, our Barts.....

Is given a job every week and IMHO does it quite well..... He may be down a little bit in confidence, but can you blame the bloke.... Has had a crap start to the year off-field and is an absolute trooper for carrying on without a stutter.... Mad respect to him I reckon!

Bell is not really high on my list of people to bring into the 22.... He tries hard, but should keep trying hard in the VFL for a little while longer in my eyes

Very underrated player, our Barts.....

Is given a job every week and IMHO does it quite well..... He may be down a little bit in confidence, but can you blame the bloke.... Has had a crap start to the year off-field and is an absolute trooper for carrying on without a stutter.... Mad respect to him I reckon!

Bell is not really high on my list of people to bring into the 22.... He tries hard, but should keep trying hard in the VFL for a little while longer in my eyes

Belly for Dunn.

Belly for Dunn.

Would not argue a trial of this change in a few weeks if Dunny's form doesn't improve.... Cannot question Bell's effort and courage, it is just the awareness that I have a problem with (or lack of)

Very underrated player, our Barts.....

Is given a job every week and IMHO does it quite well..... He may be down a little bit in confidence, but can you blame the bloke.... Has had a crap start to the year off-field and is an absolute trooper for carrying on without a stutter.... Mad respect to him I reckon!

Bell is not really high on my list of people to bring into the 22.... He tries hard, but should keep trying hard in the VFL for a little while longer in my eyes

I see where you are coming from but he is hardly a Jones at St Kilda a Ling or a Kane Cornes?

I think the desperation Bell will show to avoid delisting is worth a chance at AFL Level.

Second on belly for dunn..

Bartram has been very underated. did a very good job on cooney who had little influence. Pace is very good, will get better and better with decision making. Just needs to learn his limitations (as a few players do!)

Belly for Dunn.

Dunn is on thin ice too I reckon.

Does not do enough and does not stay in the game and keep his possessions ticking over like other players.

Move him forward for a whole game and if still battling to have impact back to the VFL.

the one thing that Dunn has which many keep overlooking, and it's something that I'm sure everyone here agrees we need more of, and that's skill by foot... He isn't getting enough of the footy right now, but when he does have the ball in his hands, he's one of our better users...

Bartram's disposal isn't up to scratch, but he seems to do his job each week... Type of player who will continue to get games for the moment, but will struggle to get a game when we're a better side in a couple of years time...

I see where you are coming from but he is hardly a Jones at St Kilda a Ling or a Kane Cornes?

I think the desperation Bell will show to avoid delisting is worth a chance at AFL Level.

Dw bell will get his chance again just aa matter of when. Most likely sooner than later.

I really admire bartys courage and will, i honestly recon he has played some good games this year.

i remeber putting himinmy best 6 atleast twice.

at the weekend he spent a fair bit of time on Cooney, who is a match winner but is making his way back from injury and an interrupted pre season and I don't think Bartram blanketed him really at all.

Cooney was BOG the week before. Cooney's stats flatered him. Bartram done a good job. He is in our best 22.

Bartram is still very young, and missed a season/pre-season with injury. He's also, as mentioned, had a [censored] of a year off-field and I don;t care how courageous he is, that'll be affecting him.

He's ok and does his job right now. Give him the time he deserves and he could continue to grow the way McDonald did.

He's certainly ahead of Dunn right now. And I'm not a Dunn-hater or anything, but he needs to make some changes between his hears. And not the haircut, even though it's not great either.

All that said, if Moloney is rested/sore this week I'd be interested in giving Bell a ring. If things continue on their current paths, it would then be Dunn who makes way for Moloney's return.

Bartram is still very young, and missed a season/pre-season with injury. He's also, as mentioned, had a [censored] of a year off-field and I don;t care how courageous he is, that'll be affecting him.

He's ok and does his job right now. Give him the time he deserves and he could continue to grow the way McDonald did.

He's certainly ahead of Dunn right now. And I'm not a Dunn-hater or anything, but he needs to make some changes between his hears. And not the haircut, even though it's not great either.

All that said, if Moloney is rested/sore this week I'd be interested in giving Bell a ring. If things continue on their current paths, it would then be Dunn who makes way for Moloney's return.

Very nice work..... Maybe they could give Dunny the flush

While I am a big wrap for Barty's courage on the field and obviously wish him all the best with what his family is going through his form this year has hardly been sensational. He beat Brent Harvey in round but really I think Brent Harvey was having a shocking year before he got injured really only dominated one game before his injury (I cannot remember who. Anyone?). Then at the weekend he spent a fair bit of time on Cooney, who is a match winner but is making his way back from injury and an interrupted pre season and I don't think Bartram blanketed him really at all. And when he has the ball he panics and his kicking is horrific. He coughed it up twice really badly on Saturday. He really needs to be put on Mitchell or Sewell this weekend and see what he can do as these players are matchwinners and in form. If he fails he needs to go back to the reserves.

I personally think Daniel Bell should be brought in for this game and put on Mitchell or Sewell with a view to earmarking him for this defensive midfield role. (Sorry to steal another poster's view in another thread) He has obviously played well in the VFL at the weekend and I think he is a better option than Bartram at the moment.

Bartram has never really got back to his 2006 form before he was injured. Have a look at the supercoach points from the weekend. Bartram is down the bottom of our team's individual point totals.

There is no room for Bell down back anymore and I am fine with this. The dees core backline group of Garland, Warnock, Rivers, Martin, Frawley, Bennell, Whelan, Cheyney is exciting and needs to play together as much as possible.

Bell when he was drafted was regarded as having a beautiful kick and I hope he can get back to this been a strength at AFL level.

What do others think of Bartram's 2008 form?

Is he in our best 22?

Yes he is in our best 22 players because every team needs a tagger in their side. If he had played on Judd on the weekend and Judd had got the same possessions as Cooney did you would have said " Oh he did an okay job". He panics when he is under pressure and is at the bottom of the super coach points because he is not supposed to get the ball. I understand the quotes about Ling and others who are taggers but Geelong have the propensity to use Ling in that role because they have artillery of talent to let him loose on occasion and he he the body to be an inside midfielder when needed to get his own possessions. The general operation of the game plan is to not have Bartram put in situations where he has the ball backward of the centre square because he does cough it up on occasion thus you see the terrible turn overs because he doesn't know what to do. He like al players has been scoped a lot with other clubs doing their homework on how they can best use his tag on their position guns to make it into a win for their club. The answer to this is get him into positions where he has to kick the ball, make him accountable take him back to the goal line and make him kick out of defense. Cooney had a few yards of pace on barty at the weekend and the dogs exploited that, run and carried and put the ball in Cooneys hands to enable him to break the lines and run destructively. This is also achieved with great blocking of the ball, which the dogs also did beautifully to cut Barty out of the contest.

I dont think it is Clint who is being beaten week in week out I think it is poor tactics which continually have him kicking out from full back and to point kick ins. If we are the drop him for Bell I think the problem is only going to be magnified even more for Bell has endurance which is great, but its not endurance we need this week its hard nosed aggression and determination to win at all costs which he doesn't have. I would much prefer Bartram to Bell plainly on desire alone. Everyone used to say the same about Godfrey but Godfrey had a role to play to and that was to negate the oppositions best on baller a role I think he did very well when we were successful and had the midfield to be able to help him out a little. I can recall walking out of the ground when we had won against the top sides and people saying to me " How bout Godfrey's job on such and such. The thing was he has the artillery to back him up, to cover for him and to give him a rest when he got burned. In our side atm we have two maybe three midfielders who try manfully each week but they are not stars and we dont have the rotations there to be able to nulify these champion players of a Cooney, a Judd, a Kerr or an Ablett. When we played Geelong they had five guys running through the centre square, each of them bouncing of each other blocking for each other and making it tough for Barty.

Give the guy a break and how bout target some of our other senior players. In fact I might send Yze magic a message and get him back on the bruce bandwagon.... accountability and disposal hey well I never.

Very nice work..... Maybe they could give Dunny the flush

Oh the pain, make it stop!!

Of course, there's still a selection decision or two left, but we'll cross that Rivers when we get to it.

At least we know there wont be any change near Davey/Jones lockers.

I can't believe I replied and kept going. I took the Bate in, and now I'd better Bail out.

I'm clearly not a Wellman, but nobody knows Watts wrong with me.

Yes he is in our best 22 players because every team needs a tagger in their side. If he had played on Judd on the weekend and Judd had got the same possessions as Cooney did you would have said " Oh he did an okay job". He panics when he is under pressure and is at the bottom of the super coach points because he is not supposed to get the ball. I understand the quotes about Ling and others who are taggers but Geelong have the propensity to use Ling in that role because they have artillery of talent to let him loose on occasion and he he the body to be an inside midfielder when needed to get his own possessions. The general operation of the game plan is to not have Bartram put in situations where he has the ball backward of the centre square because he does cough it up on occasion thus you see the terrible turn overs because he doesn't know what to do. He like al players has been scoped a lot with other clubs doing their homework on how they can best use his tag on their position guns to make it into a win for their club. The answer to this is get him into positions where he has to kick the ball, make him accountable take him back to the goal line and make him kick out of defense. Cooney had a few yards of pace on barty at the weekend and the dogs exploited that, run and carried and put the ball in Cooneys hands to enable him to break the lines and run destructively. This is also achieved with great blocking of the ball, which the dogs also did beautifully to cut Barty out of the contest.

I dont think it is Clint who is being beaten week in week out I think it is poor tactics which continually have him kicking out from full back and to point kick ins. If we are the drop him for Bell I think the problem is only going to be magnified even more for Bell has endurance which is great, but its not endurance we need this week its hard nosed aggression and determination to win at all costs which he doesn't have. I would much prefer Bartram to Bell plainly on desire alone. Everyone used to say the same about Godfrey but Godfrey had a role to play to and that was to negate the oppositions best on baller a role I think he did very well when we were successful and had the midfield to be able to help him out a little. I can recall walking out of the ground when we had won against the top sides and people saying to me " How bout Godfrey's job on such and such. The thing was he has the artillery to back him up, to cover for him and to give him a rest when he got burned. In our side atm we have two maybe three midfielders who try manfully each week but they are not stars and we dont have the rotations there to be able to nulify these champion players of a Cooney, a Judd, a Kerr or an Ablett. When we played Geelong they had five guys running through the centre square, each of them bouncing of each other blocking for each other and making it tough for Barty.

Give the guy a break and how bout target some of our other senior players. In fact I might send Yze magic a message and get him back on the bruce bandwagon.... accountability and disposal hey well I never.

"If we are the drop him for Bell I think the problem is only going to be magnified even more for Bell has endurance which is great, but its not endurance we need this week its hard nosed aggression and determination to win at all costs which he doesn't have. "

Are you kidding??? One of the FEW saving graces about Bell is his 'hard nosed aggression and determination to win at all costs'..

Not to mention he is quicker, and insurmountably stronger than Bartram. And a far, far better kick.

Go with bell for the defensive mid role.

No way Bartam is getting dropped. It's just laughable. He smashed Cooney.

Dunn, on the other hand, shirked a few contests, and I believe should make way for Bell. He just doesn't offer enough.

Belly is ready to take the next step. Get him in the team.

No way will Bartram be dropped. Bailey has said he loves the way he goes about things and his game is not determined on posessions he gets. He has a spot as long as he plays his role so EVERYONE start looking for someone elses head to put on the chopping block.

[Not to mention he is quicker, and insurmountably stronger than Bartram. And a far, far better kick.

Uh uh, no way. Bartram is one of the quickest at the club, IIRC only Flash has beaten him.

He has also been measured as being one of the strongest pound-for-pound at the club.

I'm not trying to pump up his tyres, everyone has already said he's had a rough patch, still young etc... His confidence appears to be down, and he has every reason for it to be.

I for one hope he puts his hand up this week and tells Bails he wants Bateman or Mitchell, give himself a hard task to take on, and gain some encouragement about his game.

While I am a big wrap for Barty's courage on the field and obviously wish him all the best with what his family is going through his form this year has hardly been sensational. He beat Brent Harvey in round but really I think Brent Harvey was having a shocking year before he got injured really only dominated one game before his injury (I cannot remember who. Anyone?). Then at the weekend he spent a fair bit of time on Cooney, who is a match winner but is making his way back from injury and an interrupted pre season and I don't think Bartram blanketed him really at all. And when he has the ball he panics and his kicking is horrific. He coughed it up twice really badly on Saturday. He really needs to be put on Mitchell or Sewell this weekend and see what he can do as these players are matchwinners and in form. If he fails he needs to go back to the reserves.

I personally think Daniel Bell should be brought in for this game and put on Mitchell or Sewell with a view to earmarking him for this defensive midfield role. (Sorry to steal another poster's view in another thread) He has obviously played well in the VFL at the weekend and I think he is a better option than Bartram at the moment.

Bartram has never really got back to his 2006 form before he was injured. Have a look at the supercoach points from the weekend. Bartram is down the bottom of our team's individual point totals.

There is no room for Bell down back anymore and I am fine with this. The dees core backline group of Garland, Warnock, Rivers, Martin, Frawley, Bennell, Whelan, Cheyney is exciting and needs to play together as much as possible.

Bell when he was drafted was regarded as having a beautiful kick and I hope he can get back to this been a strength at AFL level.

What do others think of Bartram's 2008 form?

Is he in our best 22?

Two entirely different players are they not. Bell doesn't have the dogged persistence which Bartram displays week after week.Just can't picture Bell as an effective tagger.

I agree with another poster, that Bartram should NEVER be entrusted with the kickouts

Two entirely different players are they not. Bell doesn't have the dogged persistence which Bartram displays week after week.Just can't picture Bell as an effective tagger.

I agree with another poster, that Bartram should NEVER be entrusted with the kickouts

or should he be taking every one for the rest of the year?

No way will Bartram be dropped. Bailey has said he loves the way he goes about things and his game is not determined on posessions he gets. He has a spot as long as he plays his role so EVERYONE start looking for someone elses head to put on the chopping block.

Ahh thank you for that at least someone else knows something about the game plan and personnel we have.

or should he be taking every one for the rest of the year?

http://www.melbournefc.com.au/players/play...36&typeid=2

Refer to the above link and you can see Barty's clangers are 2.38 a game this year and god it was glaring on the weekend.

A pretty big handball trend in his stats too.

I agree with other posters. No kickouts for Bartram until we are on 3 wins. Then he can be one of our key point kickout players.

I know Dean Bailey loves him but I just think he needs a VFL spell otherwise he will just become another Godfrey.

I cannot really ever recall him been a great clearance player either, so he cannot really start in the centre square at the expense of a McLean or a Moloney.

That is where you want the dees to get to; like the Cats; where midfield rotations really do not hurt the side. Eg. the mid combo of Selwood, Ablett, Bartel is just as a effective as Ling, Corey, Chapman.

Dunn needs to be returned to the forward line. As another poster mentioned he is a good kick. No use forwards getting it and not kicking it through for a goal (Read Newton, Miller here)

Bell 13/04/85, 24

Dunn 14/05/87, 22

Bartram 16/02/88, 21

For this reason, but not just this reason I have Bartram and Dunn well ahead of Bell.

You have to congratulate Barts for the way he handled himself through a lot of personal trauma.

He is getting the best out his limited ability - but he has not improved since 2006 - and I think his days as a senior player are numbered. Quite simply, he turns the ball over too easily too often.

Belly is a hard nut - with pace and physicality. I am still hopeful that at 24 , his best is ahead of him.

I'd give him a game. Dunny might be first to go - but Barts will be next.