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Bit harsh on Garland there Steve, he had a good season four years ago.

SC will go into meltdown.

This to me is an interesting one. You have people arguing players like Dunn and Jetta had their best year last year and they are 27 and 25 respectively, so based on that we need to give Grimes (25) Bail (26) M Jones (27) Garland (26) McKenzie (24) more time. Did Dunn and Jetta start playing their best footy happen because they reached a certain age or played a certain amount of games? Or did it happen due to Roos becoming coach and setting standards for the group and giving each player a role. I've said many times in the past Nathan Jones also had his best year last year under Roos/Stone because (a) he had more support and (b) he started to think his way through situations rather than try and barge his way through when there wasn't an immediate alternative. Other players games have also improved. With the addition of McCartney we have a formidable coaching group. We are now seeing some players fall behind from the main group in terms of skill/abilty/footy smarts, great clubs drop these players to the VFL, explain to them what areas they need to work on then give them the chance to do that. If players can't kick the footy/or grasp the gameplan under the current coaching regime will they ever be able to? Some posters on here seem hell bent on clinging on to these players. I would rather games be given to the likes of Toumpas, Mitchie, VB, Frost etc, whilst their output has been varied due to different reasons why can't these players be given the game time the others took for granted. Grimes is an automatic selection because he's in the leadership group? Garland had a good season 3 or 4 years ago, so what, if anything that may have warranted him selection the following season but injury aside there has been a slow decent in his form. The last two weeks has shown us we clearly don't have the depth many on here were banging on about. So we have two options, firstly continue to play people who have been in the system for years and still can't put it together or secondly give those same opportunities to the next batch coming through who may or may not have done enough to cement their spot but are deserving of the same opportunities given the potential they have. If they too can't cut they also can be moved on.

Yeah I'll give him that but curious to more detail.

In a initial urine test yes but once it goes to the lab all is revealed. If a player had a cocaine binge then took a pain killer with codeine in it, the lab would pick up both. Sorry are you suggesting he tried to mask it?

I understand your points but I can't agree with regards to Grimes. I say that because he has no attacking side to his game, I could of got a kick in the first half on Saturday. Would you consider Toumpas on the other flank in place of Grimes? Toumpas has shown he doesn't mind getting amongst it, he can lay a tackle but he can also dispose of the ball.

Yes and no Nasher, it's like champion team v team of champions argument. But let's go with that for this scenario, even if some of our key players were rested still would of thought there was enough quality out there to steady the ship once the Doggies had kicked their third straight. Practice match or not is has to be a concern.

Doesn't matter who was playing it what position, the concern with me remains that we 18 players on the field (debatable how many are AFL standard) and we couldn't stop the run on. Surely we have such a tactic such as get the ball and slow the play down or something.

In contention : Watts......lucky him. But Grimes is a walk up start. Amazing.....

Hutchy - Minson was one of the senior players involved in the review of McCartney.Pickers - Are you asking me? Hutchy - Well you're the only other bloke in the box.

Wasnt aware that was the format for next week. Interesting to see if the coaches share the thoughts of many on here as to who should be left out.

A suggestion for next week, many might not agree. Players like Howe and Vince are still injured and first year players are being overlooked. So we find ourselves taking hacks into games to make up the numbers. Why not next week stuff the extended bench and multiple subs and simply play 22 players against the Bombers 2nd's.

Says the video of the club website.

Exactly, anyone ever seen a Wayne Bennett press conference? When his teams won convincingly he would still manage to find numerous faults but when they lost or had a unconvincing win he would praise them.

would you like to revisit your comments from before the game??

And it gets worse

Hutchy is an idiot but I think he works well with Pickers. Their Saturday morning show with Dr Turf is quite funny.

Exactly, as Tmac alluded to, "we don't have the luxury of taking these games lightly"We need momentum, 8 day break since travelling west, no excuses anymore.

Sorry I will rephrase it for you. I don't care how Grimes plays as long as he speaks well.

So they've come out and said they are treating today's game as if it was round 1. If certain players consistenly produce simple errors against an undermanned Bulldogs side they need to have their papers stamped.

Id say Hawthorn is.

Fair enough, it could honestly go either way but at least it would seem we have given ourselves a better chance by the structures we have in place.

My only concern is that this year we are paying 100% of the cap for the first times in years. I would hope this is due to the recent signings of H and Garlett but more so we are front loading Jones deal. We have just witnessed what Cameron and Boyd commanded abc can expect Hogan will be there abouts assuming he stays on the park.

Please elaborate RJay.

Time for big game from Dawes.