Maldonboy38

It's a tough one this week. A few things to consider:

Jamar cannot survive a full game on his own against Goldstein. Goldstein is in ripping form around the ground so we need an extra tall. Even though Dunn's fill-in-ruck work was much better than I expected, he will not be able to match with Goldstein. With Spencer going down Martin needs to be at least considered.

Grimes was tried in the middle, so it is possible his replcement would be a midfielder rather than a defender. Even so, Joel MacDonald will be considered but his kicking skills are questionable under pressure.

North play a very physical game and Bennell would get monstered. He does not cope with too much heavy work, so for mine he should not be considered.

Stupidly, Trenners will not get off. The MRP got this one wrong but stabnd by nad watch the tribunal agree!! This is going to be our gretest loss - this bloke is in outstanding form.

So,...

OUT Grimes, Trengove,

IN Martin, Jetta/Rivers (depending on whether they go for a mid or defender to replace Grimes)

.

Watts has given the ball off about 20 times in his short career so far when he should have had a ping. I loved it that he had the confidence to have a crack. I WANT our key forward to be hungry for a goal. He is really starting to lead aggressively and players are starting to look out for him. He is not far away from a little haul me thinks.

I agree Big Red. His awareness of the position of his teams mates is always really good, but sometimes he should not give it off.

3 things I love about Watts at the moment:

He is going to grouind less, and keeps his feet when tackling.

His decision making and awareness of where his team mates are.

His skills. Here's a question - are his in-game ball skills equal to or even the best we have?

And I loved when he ran into that open goal and didn't dribble it through - he kicked it into the 2nd tier. Jakovich and Shwarz come to mind here, although I doubt he will have the ego of either of these two.

.

Green - showed some leadership

Warnock - beat good opponent

Jones - strong and creative

Bartram - really good game

Watts - earning his place

Gysberts - always right position

Frawley - run out of defence (4 words)

Trengove - great midfielder's game

Sylvia - great second half (flat track bully???)

Dunn - did things well

Petterd - strong marking target

Grimes - hopefully only sore.

Maric - aware and efficient

Garland - inspector gadget lives

Moloney - hard, strong, skillful

Jurrah - more grunt required

Wonaeamirri - dangerous but unfit

Tapscott - strong and able

Davey - right foot kicks

Jamar - was simply outstanding

Bail - should clone him.

Bate - hard at it

Good.

20 of our 22 were good today, but special mention to:

Bail.

Watts. Very composed and efficient. And I loved that bit of arrogance where he kicked the ball into the stands. We need a bit of this.

Trengove.

Moloney and Jamar (if other teams target these two we may be in serious trouble)

Davey returning to running-bounces.

Frawley demonstrating his dash and confidence.

Maric. This was an important game for him.

Bad.

Grimes. It was great to see him start in the middle, though.

Those three dropped marks close to goal - Wonna, Jurrah and Watts.

Ugly.

Dunn's moustache. Yep, I still hate it.

Last quarter - Crows reading Jamar's ruck work.

.

6. Moloney

5. Sylvia

4. Bail

3. Trengove

2. Davey (he ran and bounced - how good is it to see this again)

1. Frawley

apologies to Jones and Petterd

.

This is the advantage of the Sub: rule, for regualar senior players like Davey. However I don't think you drop a leadership group player easily. Sylvia I think is frustration of not meeting his lofty expectations. Maybe Davey too. The loss of experience, multiplied by the higher hopes of our senior group, I think it's testing all of them, except the Russian who seems to be more realistic.

for Lake, his issues of fitness wouldn't suit the sub spot.

You have hit the main point in question right on the head, Deeluded. If some of the leadership group are consistently among the worst players, when is the right time to make a strong stance on ensuring that EVERY player must earn their place, including the leaders? Is it after 6 rounds, 8, 10??? Is it always wrong to drop your skipper ( I am not advocating this by the way. A lot more has to go wrong before a captain can be dropped).

Coaches can be sacked, so why can't leaders be dropped?

Personally, I don't think you drop a leader on form only, but leadership is influence and if their lack of intensity and grunt is a poor influence on the others in the 22, then combined with poor form this surely brings their place in the starting 22 into question.

.

I see in the news tonight that the Western Bulldogs have instructed Brian Lake to return to the VFL to find form and match fitness after a couple of bad games following his return from hip and knee surgery. I really like this from the Bulldogs. Lake is an AA defender but must earn his place and prove his worth, even though he has done exactly that countless times in the past. I am sure that Scully and McKenzie will be brought back via the VFL.

My question is, with all that is going on for the Dees at present, could this strong earn-your-place principle be shown, with Frawley or Morton being asked to follow this process?

And further, should the same line be laid down to Davey and Sylvia?

I know we can't ask four of these players to prove themselves in the VFL at the same time, but it must be a consideration. My only hesitation is that we are sitting on 2 wins, 1 draw and 2 losses and it might be a bit early to be this strong.

Thoughts?

.

Would you put Nathan Buckley in that same group ? I would.

Not quite. Don't get me wrong, Buckley was a gun but he lacked an important quality:

He was rarely creative. He did the regular things better than most and was strong in every skill area but he rarely produced those magic, creative things of Hird, Matthews or Judd.

.

Really hard to choose, but will go with Judd.

Judd is probably the best midfielder I have ever seen, with stiff competition from Leigh Matthews, Michael Voss, James Hird , Tim Watson, Robert Harvey and Gary Ablett jnr.

.

Heres a bit of fun amidst all the doom and gloom of this year so far.

1. Favourite Current Melbourne Player and why?

2. Favourite Past player and why?

For me:

1. Jack Trengove- Just oozes class and silky skills. Gotta love an up and coming young gun.

2. Adem Yze- Was a little bit different but everything about him just had class written all over it. The long sleeves, the white boots the freak goals. I sorely miss going to watch him play.

Favourite current player. Rohan Bail. He gets his own footy, can tag an opponent, is as hard as nails even though not huge in build and is amazing to watch at full pace. This kid could become anything.

Favourite past player. Robbie Flower. Class, skill, pace, leadership, footy brain, courage that robbed him of about 3-4 seasons of footy due to injury, and he could baulk and evade anyone. Even though the tackling skills these days are much more developed, I still reckon he could evade most of today's body players. I shudder what he wouild have been in quality team. One of my greatest footy memories is in the 1987 Semi-final against the Swans when he got his first touch after coming on from the bench and the whole crowd rose out of their seats and screamed "Robbiiiieeee".

.

After watching Casey today (and yes, I know it was against Frankston):-

OUT: Wonna, Frawley, Gysberts, Dunn

IN: Warnock, Petterd, Maric, Howe/Bate

Howe is a real shot in the dark but looked ready to play at AFL level and surely he couldn't be any worse than many from last week.

My four outs were 4 of the 6-7 worst players from WCE game, who have given little in past month.

Also, I know my opinions about Frawley needing some Casey time are outweighed by some serious man-love for him from many Demonlanders, but his form versus the Lions and WCE cost us goals and showed a lack of polish and intent.

.

I now have to recant my strong position on Frawley because I realised one glaring ommission. Morton MUST be dropped - his effort was really weak, and this saves Frawley from amuch deserved rest.

.

After watching Casey today (and yes, I know it was against Frankston):-

OUT: Wonna, Frawley, Gysberts, Dunn

IN: Warnock, Petterd, Maric, Howe/Bate

Howe is a real shot in the dark but looked ready to play at AFL level and surely he couldn't be any worse than many from last week.

My four outs were 4 of the 6-7 worst players from WCE game, who have given little in past month.

Also, I know my opinions about Frawley needing some Casey time are outweighed by some serious man-love for him from many Demonlanders, but his form versus the Lions and WCE cost us goals and showed a lack of polish and intent.

.

Evans = no. 71

Maric = no. 55

I asked a bloke with a footy record about these 2. I recognised most of the others. I do not know what number Nicholson wore so Iwasn;t looking for him - I was concentrating on the Dees players I could recognise.

I didn't ask about Blease's number because I saw him as I entered and he was clearly no. 47

As far as Frawley vs Warnock. Frawley is a great footballer in desperately poor form. No position is guaranteed just because of a previous year's efforts. I stand by what i typed - on Warnock's form he should replace Frawley.

Also, does anyone know who wore number 11 for Casey? This tall, gangly kid (I thought it was Cook at first) was a really good mark.

.

Apologies to Dan Nicholson. I didn't have a footy record and didn't know his face or number. Many people saying he played well - does anyone know his number from today?

Just got back from Casey fields after watching Casey annihilate Frankston. It is a bit difficult to assess the player's performances because Frankston were a level below Casey on every line. There was often a lack of defensive pressure so it was difficult to judge the Dees boys ability to play under pressure. But it was great to be back at local footy. Kids kicking on the ground between quarters. Hearing all the calling, abuse, umpire's decision making, and even being able to listen to the line coaches address the groups. Great day.

I don't know if I could tell all the Dees players but will do my best:

Lucas Cook - is no longer a stick insect and can take a good, pack mark. His defensive pressure was great at times but average at others. Great running, aerobic capacity for a big bloke.

Sam Blease. I cannot believe how quick this bloke is. In the last quarter he took on 4 Frankston boys at ground level, burnt them off and delivered inside 50 to Bate for a goal. His run and carry is good, but a couple of times he jogged after his opponent who got the ball and ran off him. His defensive game needs work but his offensive stuff is outstanding. Unfortunately, not worthy of a call up to the Dees IMO.

Matthew Warnock. Too good for all opponents and BOG. Marked everything, defended with skill, gut-ran to position at times, and his kicking was at least in the 90% efficiency. He is too good for the VFL on today's form and should replace Frawley against Adelaide.

Matthew Bate. Again, too good for VFL. I am unsure of he kicked 4, 5 or 6 but his second half was amazing. Hard running, pack marking, tackling - the works. Great game of footy. Often looks clumsy but effective.

Tom Macdonald. Didn't get heaps of it but is very good in the air AND on the ground for a big bloke. Positions well and knows when to mark and when to spoil. A lot to like but more likley to get a go in 2012.

Jeremy Howe. Again, not heaps of it but I really like the look of this kid. Is excellent on both feet and kicks it a country kilometre. With Frankston being so poor it is hard to get a read on Howe, but he looks mentally mature enough to get a go in 2011, if the right chance/position vacancy comes up.

Ricky Petterd. Again, too good for VFL level. Was played in the middle and forward and his attack on the ball at times is frightenng. His kicking sometimes was wayward, even when not under any pressure and at one point he was getting relly annoyed at himself. Must at least be considered for next week. His marking for a bloke his size is exceptional.

Addam Maric. Really good game. Ran hard, linked up for multiple handballs when in transition and smart around the half-forward line. If selectors reckon he can reproduce this at AFL level, then he must come in for Wonna.

Michael Evans. 2nd best on ground. This kid is super quick, very aggressive at the ball, runs all day and his skills under pressure were a highlight. He just kept on getting it. I am not sure but can he get a game with the Dees or do we have to wait for a long-term injury? For a team lacking intensity and ticker this kid could add a fair bit.

Max Gawn. Very raw, really quick and ran down some smaller players with tackling pressure. Looks a good prospect though as he is more than just a ruckman. 18 months off I reckon. His ruck work was a bit ordinary.

Jake Spencer. Great ruck work and took some strong pack marks. He ran forward of the centre boiunce at times and gave handballs to runners to deliver inside 50. It was a smart games but not a great one. However, he impressed me more than I expected. But THAT kicking action makes me shudder.

Juice Newton. I reckon having Fev next to him today stuffed him up because he was not great today. His tackling however was really good and he worked hard to keep the ball inside 50. Often, Fev would lead before him and he found himself the stay at home forward with 2 defenders hanging off his back.

Nev Jetta. At times looked good but only flashed in and out of the game. Ran hard at times.

Kelvin Lawrence (I think). It was a younger indigenous man who team mates were calling Kel. He was very fast but not much of a contributer.

Joel MacDonald. His first half was really good with smart, attacking football down back. I do not know if he got injured but he was not on the ground as much for the 2nd half, and the ball was in our forward line for most of teh gme. Will be considered for Dees versus Adelaide.

I believe that Jack Fitzpatrick played in the Casey two's and kicked 7 or so - but it might be rumour.

On the form produced this afternoon, at least 4 Dees boys from WCE game should be nervous, and wll have to work their butts off to ensure another chance at senior level.

P.S. No. 30 for Frankston, I think his name is Corea or Koria - outside player but super quick, very clean off the ground and can kick at full pace. Watch out for him at the draft for 2012.

.

Do you know what is really sad? I have almost become used to feeling like this.

Prelim final 1987

Grand final 1988

Final series 1992 - 1994 (still the best Melbourne side I have seen)

Final series 1998

Grand final 2000

Semi-final 2002 or 2004 when we killed Adelaide in the first half, and then they killed us in the 2nd and won.

round 16 2005 - top of the ladder. Did we win another game after that?

Aren't we all just a bit sick, tired and fed up of this?

I was born 6 months after our last premiership. For some reason this loss to WCE has cut deep and I am not sure how much longer I can have my hope and excitement dashed to pieces. I love red and blue. I bleed red and blue. And my 4 kids are learning to do the same. 2011, far from ever going to be a great year, was going to be one where we stood up and "Fought". Now it is, as Old Dee has said with such precision, just another "Melbourne year".

This sense of malaise has got so deep, I am actually enjoying the footbal played by Collingwood!! Enjoying watching Collingwood play!!!!!

AAAAgggghhhh!!!!

.

The story is told that when Dick Pratt got to Carlton, he asked the board and FD "who is the best CEO?" People began answering with "the best CEO available is..." and at this point Pratt interrupted, saying "No, not who is AVAILABLE, but who is the BEST?." the answer came = Greg Swan. Pratt said "Then go and get him."

If we replace Bailey, it cannot be any less than the best person. I don't care if is Todd Viney, Leigh Matthews, Malthouse, Roos, Hardwick, the Pope or Prince William. Just get the best. No more mediocrity especially not when appointing a coach.

.

1. Four quarter intensity. Enough said

Me too. I don't reckon we can change all the structure and strategy stuff we need to change in 7 days. But we can show a four quarter effort of grunt and heart. We need players putting themselves on the line for the red and blue.

.

If Bailey is farewelled in 2011 (and I think he might be, but near the end of the season) which players of our top 25 would face the axe?

I have given this some thought and have come up with the following, even surprising myself:

Sylvia. I don't reckon other coaches would accept the extensive periods of mediocrity he delivers. I love this bloke at his best and picked him to be our best Brownlow chance prior to season start. He has let me down - again!

Morton. Has not deliverd, and I don't reckon anothr club would offer us a top 20 pick in exchange.

Dunn. 7 years of inconsistency = not enough reasons to keep him.

Newton. see above re Dunn.

Sadly, Brad Green would not survive as Captain, at least not in light of what his leaderhsip has produced so far.

Thoughts?

.

I also wrote an email and sent it off to MFC this morning. I have never sent a negative email to the club before and was hesitant to do it, but the MFC need to hear our anger, disappointment and utter frustration at the level of effort. Recruiting, management, staff, resources blah blah blah.... yes lots could be written. But the club must know that spineless, heartless pathetic efforts like last night bring shame to the jumper. That was the main point of my email.

All of us despairing Dees followers have seen insipid performances and losses that should be wins - we have probably seen 50 to 80 of them over the past 40 years - but last night was shameful and humilaiting. Players, admin staff and coaches come and go but we can never tolerate the red and blue colours being a point of shame and derision.

Do NOT hesitate in emailing or phoning the club. If they hear this from even 10% of us, that is 3,400 poeople nad must be taken notice of.

Also, I think we need to attend en masse the AGM this year. And demand an open question time of at least 1 hour duration.

.

Dean Bailey is where the buck stops. He must stand up and say "these fellas are under my direction nad playing poorly". I have been a fan of his since his appointment but even I am now questioning his longevity as our coach. Our game plan (transition from half-back) is being picked off by all opposing teams, even the poor old lions. Under his watch our team has been robbed of intensity and ticker.

Skills can be blamed on young men and injuries.

Tackling and "press" can be explained by young men trying to get used to the rigours of modern defensive footy.

Leadership not leading is because we have only a couple of genuine leaders.

But Dean Bailey MUST be accountable for:

Our game plan, and especially our kick-ins from the opposition behinds are an absolute weakness, and by that I mean our plan here has no strengths. None.

Our absence of grit, grunt and ticker.

.

Green - poor leadership example

Jones - up and going

Bartram - good solid game

Watts - grit and poise

Gysberts - did he play?

Bennell - only plays outside

Frawley - Casey game required

Trengove - really strong game

Morton - physically, mentally weak

Sylvia - Casey wake-up required

Dunn - Casey game required

Grimes - move to midfield

Garland - continual super effort

Moloney - focus of tagging

Jurrah - very little opportunity

Rivers - OK I suppose

Wonaeamirri - very disappointing game

Martin - very dumb game

Tapscott - must be accountable (for opponent)

Davey - another soft game

Jamar - outclassed by superstar

Bail - good, hard work

Three word analysis of team performance

Totally lacked ticker

Three word analysis of leadership group

unacceptably heartless effort (Jones excluded from this)

Three word analysis of coaching performance

Show some aggression

.

Two certainties:

Dunn - did not contribute and is not providing the large bodied forward we need.

Bennell - does some great stuff but is the living proof of our softness.

Four possibilities. I reckon the selectors should be honest and hard, by dropping at least two of:

Frawley. Yes, big call but his form has been horrible. Needs a run at Casey.

Morton. Another big call but his game last night was timid, and his so-called skills absent

Sylvia. Needs his annual wake-up call. He is not getting the ball - he is waiting for it.

Maybe Gysberts. I love this kid but his game was only shadowed by Morton.

FOUR INS:

Warnock

Petterd

Blease (I think - unsure if this is too early)

Howe / Evans / McDonald???

Unfortunately, I think Strauss is injured.

.

1. I have been fan of Dean Bailey's since he was appointed and have stuck up for him in various places among Dees fans. In a previous thread this year I said that everything is in place, now we wait and see if our coach can coach. After last night I have changed my position. His coaching tenure is now to be fully questioned and investigated. No coach should be tapping encouragement on young footballer's butts when they come through the interchange gates after performing the way we did. Shows he is accepting mediocrity.

2. Game plan.

Predictable by oppositions, but not our players.

No pressure until opposition reach wing / half forward

Kick-ins after an opposition behind is the weakest of any team in my memory

Run-and-carry requires in close skills and confidence. We lack both.

3. Yes, at times, the Dees play soft. (I hate typing that about my beloved red and blue!!) Morton, Bennell and last night Frawley.

4. WCE are being coached by a premiership winning coach and are now on the rise again. We are down among GFC, Lions, North, PA.

5. Jack Watts is a gun. Hellcyonyears, you are mislead by emotion. He ran, tackled, marked, kicked in that fist 15 minutes when everyone else was still in their hotel room.

I also learnt:

As a team, our kicking skills when not under pressure are a disgrace.

Any game plan that requires Liam Jurrah to win possession on the half back flank is dysfunctional.

Melbourne supporters are too patient.

.

I don't want to give any merits to any player because as a TEAM - a single unit - it was weak as my wife's tea, but I have to admit that some players got in and had a go.

6 - Trengove

5 - Watts

4 - Garland

3 - Jones

__________________

honourable mentions but no votes:

Bartram

Bail

Jamar

.