binman

Good question. Yes, is the short answer. Using the theory the first third of the season gives us a more accurate read of form than the middle third, this was the ladder after round 8 (Note: we had a much tougher fixture and schedule than Freo. And it's also worth noting like us they also lost to west coast - but it was round six so mid season loads not a factor)

And like you, I'm happy for mcvee to stay at half back. One, he really is a brilliant defender. He reads the ball super well, backs himself in to beat his opponent to the ball, really good one on one and is surprisingly strong in the contest. But perhaps of most importance is how important his brilliant kicking is out of defence, one because it creates scoring chains but also he doesn't turn the ball over in our back half. Moving daicos on ball has hurt the pies I reckon. He is brilliant in the middle of course, but they have sorely missed his kicking out of defence and how calm he was in the back half. Def one of the factors as in their turnover, transition game falling of a cliff. Mcvee is our daicos. Use AMW as the lock down small defender, freeing Judd to be a dangerous high half back flankers.

TJ is a great comparison in terms of how he moves and his ball use. I reckon mcvee is a bit more hard at it than TJ. Judd's baby face belies his toughness.

That's the biggest load of old cobblers I've ever read. But illuminating - the penny has just dropped. Couldn't stay away huh? That's funny. Timing's right. Pop up when we start losing. Alas, like clock work the good form and wins return. So I guess you be leaving soon. In the meantime, see ya.

By the by, credit where it is due. Goody has embraced the transition model you discussed way back 2022. And iirc you also were strong on the physical challenge of the model we used week in week out - which I think is arguably the biggest factor in our changed method - keep the troops fresher for finals and not so banged up.

I hear what you are saying rp, but one of my major frustrations about the discussion is what I see as a complete myth that it was a 'binary fascination' and that those who were wanting to discuss were implying it was the only factor. People such as myself, and several others I could point to, have been at pains to clarify that it not an excuse and there are any number of other factors in the mix (for example tactics, method, psychology, form et etc) And besides such voices were, and remain, decidedly in the minority so were hardly shutting down conversation about the topics you note. But I do agree the discussion became tedious, and I am as much to blame for that ss anyone, so I'll go back to not discussing it.

It fits our form line for the fourth year in a row. When I first started discussing load management in 2021 it's fair to say I copped a fair bit. What's crazy is ive copped it every year since - so much so that I barely raise it anymore because I can't be bothered getting pilloried. (It's ironic actually because many of the posters lampooning and shutting down such conversations complain any criticisms of the club they make are policed and shut down - cue the face palm and vomit emojis) Crazy because you would have to actively ignore the evidence to be so wilfully ignorant. I recall mutiple posters, even in the face of iffrefutable evidence, say they won't believe loading happens (which morphed for many into, maybe a factor but.....) until a coach or ex player comes out and says it happens. Ok, well it's starting now to be discussed by such people. Good to hear Cameron Ling come out and discuss it. Del Santo alluded to it on the ABC in the early part of the season, saying it's all about playing your best footy in August and using the tapering for the olympics as an ananlogy Hopefully next season the discussion about high performance programs and load management can move from being a 'dirty word', or a running Demonland joke, to a nuanced discussion that factors in load management into the analysis of our performances. And as I've noted it might also open up discussions like the different high performance philosophies (manage and rotate, no rotation, squads, play through niggles etc) and an analysis of our high performance program. One benefit would be less of the hair on fire, the sky is falling, play the kids, we are a joke, sack goody, it's all about 2025 etc etc that dominates Demonland for a couple of months in the middle of every season. I mean, sure I skew positive, but some of the takes on where we were at coming into the bye, and even after our WIN against the Roos, have already proved to be utterly ridiculous - even if we don’t go on to push for a flag. Silly, vibes based, emotive stuff - but barely commented on, let alone anyone getting called on it Yet I make any reference to the impact of load management on performances like our last game against freo, and i'm ridiculed, with the subtext being, please no mote talk about loading - effectively shutting the conversation down.

Aka Skinner- Bell.

Disagree. Smash them off the park with high intensity pressure and contest. Do what we did against the bombers after the first quarter and: really press up on them to deny them time and space work super hard to cover their switches to make sure they can't play on and have to hold it up anticipate their handball chains and press up hard on likely receivers and smash them suffocate and discombobulate them Force turnovers and make them pay Easy week on the track into the Giants game and go again.

It's not really a theory as such.

As a generalisation, the form of teams in the weeks leading into their bye, and in the one or two weeks after their bye should be ignored. As a footy punter it is a treacherous period and I tread warily. But it does throw up some real value as many punters think of form in terms of week to week performances or blocks of 2 games. So port are great value against the Dogs because in their previous 2 games they got absolutely thrashed by the lions and scrapped in against the saints. And so are terrific value at the line at home against the dogs, who had been in good form. Port thrash the dogs and so people jump off the dogs and they are therefore great value at the line against the blues. But we are now passed that phase and form is now more trustworthy. The way to think about this game is not how we played last time we met the dockers but what our best football looks like versus their best football. The same can be applied to all matches from here on in. The first 6-7 rounds give the best guide, injuries notwithstanding. As I've noted, I don't bet on dees games, but if I did I would launched into us at the line against the bombers because our best football is better than that of the bombers.

And backing up week after week as a big marking target at AFL level.

The sad thing is I'm pretty confident there was almost exactly the same post in the DL game day thread.

Agree we got away with a couple in tge first. I'd be ropeable if I was a bombers fan with that non mark straight in front. A mark every day of tge week. It was crucial too because they were on top and really needed to take advantage of the momentum when they had it. Game would have looked different if they had a 3 goal lead at quarter time instead of one point.

Yes we had Omac and some other guns, but it is patently absurd to suggest out 2019 list was the best in the AFL. I don't mean to knock these blokes but we had the following fringe players in and round our best 22: Vanderburg, Weed, Jay Kennedy Harris, Hore, Oskar Baker, Corey Wagner, Jay Lockhadrt, Frosty, Billy Stretch - not mention players like Kade Kolodjashnij and Aaron Nietschke who couldn't get on the park) for the sake of argument lets say you are right. You may also recall that we had a horror run with injury in 2019 and went into full experimental mode early on - playing Fritter at half and developing the Goodwin contest territory game for example. But for the sake of argument lets run with your opinion we had the best list for five seasons (i'm assuming your posting history reflects this opinion). Strength of the list is absolutely a key factor in the chances of winning a flag. But injury and luck are arguably even more important. Given that, every single club would take one flag from five. Anyway cranky, i'm really not sure why I'm bothering responding to your silliness. I will go back to just reading your random troll bites and having a quiet chuckle. Keep doing you.

Some clubs absolutely do exactly that ie manage players, particularly older players - Geelong being the best example. The cats have done so in earnest since their premiership season. All their older players are rotated and managed. Burgess and Griffith seemingly have a different philosophy, and play the same core of players through the fatigue. Though goody did mention a few weeks ago they planned to rest maxy if they were in a position to do so. Funnily enough the decision had been taken out of their hands. It's worth noting that even if they did manage a senior player tbat player would still have to a full match load on top of normal training to ensure they maintained the right levels.

For sure, partic goals from turnover I'm not so sure we did run out of gas. Well maybe a bit (though not the to the same degree as against tjhe liuns and roos) - which i think we just have to accept with such a young team. And i was amazed the so called experts didn't point out that we were off a six day break to their 8 - Melk sure did in a post match interview when asked about recovering from his first game back after 12 months. I reckon we lost momentum with those two quick goals and couldn't get it back. The umpiring handed the bombers that momentum. I was quietly pleased we didn't give up any more goals.

I saw the ground ball stat and refected on your point about going from losing the differential to winning it in the last few weeks. In 2021-23 ground ball gets were one of key indicators. Seemed to be less significant in a transition game as were winning games early this season despite handily losing ground ball. Contest is key to both methods, and we really dialled up our attack on the ball. It looked liked our best contest footy of 2021-23, but much better on transition 2024 style. That's the hybrid goody is trying to develop I reckon ie a blend of the territory and transition games. I heard goody say the youth of the team is a factor in terms of how they want to play. Which makes sense given even with no gus or smithy we still have a core of excellent senior players who are strong in the contest and hard at. But also have young players like Mcvee, Windsor, Kolt, Bowey and AMW with good wheels we want out in space (though fortunately all are had at in the contest too). That said, even with the hybrid model being perhaps less contest heavy games are still super taxing. Particularly for the young blokes. Must be some challenge to get the program right.

I edited my original post. My first draft was little less diplomatic.

Not bad. I could recycle all my pet hates and bad jokes.

Not your best work cranky. I mean, not even I thought we had the best list six years ago! Stick to the surreally ridiculous. A question. Do YOU think we have had the best list in the last 4-6 years?

Really, playing one down at stoppages has only been made possible by having generational players in maxy, tracc, clarry and jack. And as you've noted the clever tactic of having a high half forward, usually nibbla sitting of the contest. I reckon Jones, who played in that system, meant even numbers not an extra. Again, what drives me nuts is their lack of explanation about the impacts of that decision. For one thing, we use the spare created by playing one down at stoppages behind the ball in an intercepting role. Which would help explain why we didn't do that well in terms intercept and intercept marks differentials, basically breaking even whereas in past seasons we routinely smashed teams for intercepts, particularly intercept marks.

Jones said we were doing so on the coverage. Maybe he meant an extra in the sense we are normally one down? That's to say even numbers. He also said the high half forwards were pushing up to to stoppages too. It drives me nuts they don't show graphics with the set ups and all ground structure. The coverage of afl feels as if it hasn't improved or changed in 20 years. That used to he true of cricket, but coverage of cricket is brilliant now with fantastic use of special comments graphics and video. It's adds so much to my understanding of a game I love and know well.

I'll steal that!

Watching the case game, I thought don't sleep on Benny Brown. Looked in good nick and did some nice thing's.