binman

Leaving any argument aside about the choice to trade him i feel really, really upset about jack leaving.

Actaully i reckon Leon Cameron might be the one. Arguably has struggled to embed a strong culture

One i don't know if Roos was criticizing Goodwin. Two i can't see how you can parlay my comment into a full blown rant about the BS having to stop and the club toughening up. Three it is a huge stretch to suggest out inability to put sides away is related to some soft cuddly culture roosy inculcated. Four, it is an even bigger stretch to suggest roosy focused on positives and had no interest in training standards and leadership (not to mention complete bollocks) Five, and with all due respect i value roosy's opinion more than yours (and i assume you value his more than mine)

Agree. By the same token - and along the same lines as him being subtle - i did wonder if there was a subtle criticism of how Goody has handled watts this year with his comments on the need not to focus on player's weaknesses. I found another comment really fascinating. He talked about the critical element of being a senior coach, as opposed to an assistant coach, is that you have to be a leader. He said there was senior coach who had been an assistant coach who he felt had not made the transition and become a leader. He said he wouldn't name the coach. Surely not Goodwin but then who (nb he seems to imply it is a current coach)?

You'd trade him on that alone? Out of interest are your critical of the FD for approving the trip?

Neeld didn't. He was about the process.

I listened to the Roos interview on deetales last night. Brilliant interview. One of the best and most expansive interview i have heard with anyone directly involved with the dees. Roos is relaxed and remarkably open, in a way i suggest is unlikely in a normal media gig. I recommend giving it a listen if interested in the last few years at the dees As has been noted in this thread he touches on Watts (from 5.23 min), but that is only a very small part of what of what is a very wide ranging discussion. That said Roos addresses many of the issues raised in this thread by posters on both sides of the argument. To be transparent in my position i agree with most of what Roosy says, with one exception. I''m not sure if its a mistake to trade him or not in so far as i fully respect Goodwin's right to make the call and i don't know what the basis is for the decision (Roos acknowledges the same thing). If Goody and the FD decide it is the right decision then that is good enough for me. That doesn't mean i agree with it, have to like it or that i won't be upset to lose Watts. But it is Goody's team and as someone pointed out the club is privy to data and other information (eg how well or otherwise jack approached his rehab or off season) that we - and Roos - are not. Also Jack may simply not fit Goody's game plan or type of player he wants (eg not intense enough). All that said, in light of the debate that is raging here on DL i did find Roosy's comments fascinating given who he is and how well he knows our team. Here are some selected quotes on three of the questions and issues that have been covered in this thread: Are you a Watts fan 'i'm a huge Watts fan' 'an outstanding player' 'a very, very good player' 'he elevated his game, certainly in my last year' 'an elite kick, an elite decision maker 'i'm a massive Jack Watts fan' 'he's got weakness and some of them are his responsibility to address' 'i would take Jack Watts over Jake stringer every day of the week' (this was in the context of what roos said was the unfair criticism of jack compared to a player like Stringer who has been dropped multiple times over the last 2 years, and who by the by some people are saying is worth a high first round draft pick) 'the perception of jack Watts is just crazy .......its completely unrealistic' Are they doing the right thing to trade him? 'i'd be disappointed personally but i don't know whats going on' 'i think its a big mistake to trade him but i don't know, i'm only basing that on what i saw last year and this year' 'you need a mix of players to play in your premiership' Roos finished the discussion on Watts with this unequivocal comment: 'i think it would be a mistake to get rid of him' Does he impact games enough 'the sort of player that wins you games, certainly in the last two years' 'he has won 6-8 games in the last two years, unquestionably' 'the sort of player every team needs' 'if i was another club and Melbourne rang me and said would you like Jack Watts i couldn't hold of him quick enough' 'i know there was some criticism of him this year but the games i saw him play he impacted'

No one suggested Macrae was coming. Someone just guessed/hoped that the rumored quality mid (big fish) Roost it said we were in the market for might be Macrae.

Good summary RJ. I'd add he is a smooth mover who has good vision. Is a good kick, but what I really like about his kicking is he is a surprisingly long and penetrating kick (looks effortless) who hits targets, which is something we really lack

Mcrae is exactly the player we need

Just what we need. .. ..

Good post PD (assuming it is the real PD - this new incarnation is very considered. Perhaps it is like Dr Who with each iteration being different to the last?). My thoughts on a couple of your points Could it be that he did the hard yards at the Bulldogs that helped set up Beveridge's success ? If only a small part ? Yes and yes, ridiculous to think otherwise. Macca has not received anywhere near the credit he deserves for their flag success and for mine i lost some respect for the the dogs for not publicly giving him any (that i saw - perhaps i'm wrong). Macca correctly predicted where the game was heading and was ahead of the curve at the dogs. At a time when the hawks slice and dice game plan based on precision kicking and deliberate ball movement was the go he implemented the total pressure and all team intensity game adopted by the last two premiers(not coincidentally both teams were not the most talented or skillful). A DL poster (sorry forgot who) compared this model to the Dutch 'total football philosophy', which i though is a brilliant analogy. Goodwins is a total believer in this total football philosophy - which goes a long way to explaining why he wants Watts gone and why he rates Macca. Could it be with what we're now seeing with Stringer and others such as Liberatore, that there was a core group at the Dogs with an unhealthy influence over aspects of their behaviour, or disenfranchisement with McCartney ? Absolutely. A real challenge for the total football approach is it needs total buy in with every player totally invested in the approach and their teammates. The tigers were a brilliant example of this being the case. The bulldogs were an equally brilliant example of what happens when a team using the Total Football system does not have total buy in and cohesion. I wonder if the Dogs will be able to get it back. I believe we're in excellent hands with Goodwin, et al. Could not agree more Will he be a better coach and media performer in year two or five than year one ? Yes. He has made clear personal development is his mantra and i have every confidence he will continue to get better in all facets of his role.

Say what you like about jack but he sure does generate pages on DL

G'day PD. Been a while. not much doubt that Goody shares your opinion on Jack. At least i can say i got his one really good season right!

And given Watts, just yesterday, has said he wants to remain in Victoria is likely to be another Nixon hallucination.

Agree, though i don't think it was designed as a wake up call. I think they expected him to seek a trade, which he may still do. As i have said before, despite the fact that as you say he has under performed, Jack is one of my all favourite players. But i fully respect Goodwin's position (and his right to ask Watts to leave) and it is crystal clear he has failed in meeting his coaches expectations - the key ones being intensity and attack at the ball i would think. All that said i am glad Jack has stuck to his guns and i hope it actually will be the wake up call he needs. To be honest i can't see him getting to level of intensity Goody demands so if he does stay he better get used to being wacked in the VFL and playing at windy casey. But if he can be the rare leopard that changes his spots i hope it is with us not another premiership contender.

Terrific first post. Welcome

yeah because you know what he is feeling and thinking and are also across how every vic club assesses the value of Watts. righto. Such talent on DL. Pink Freud where are you?

I think burton might not be the best person to be negotiating deals. I mean aren't most negotiations involving player's contracts financially motivated?

You have a contract with your girlfriends? I think that is something else......

How much do you charge per hour. Do you bulk bill?

Crying? He is doing the opposite. He's standing firm. He is being ruthless. As i have said all along he has the whip hand and to the surprise of people who have pigeon holed as a soft playboy he is using it.

Jack hasn't. He has a contract. Why should he be forced to leave if he doesn't want to. He has every right to stand his ground and not roll over like the club wants - and probably expected - him to. Good on him i say. Respect.

Blimey dl has a lot of amateur psychiatrists. Seem to know exactly what jack wants, needs, thinks, understands and most of all what is wrong with him. By the by does jack's comfort zone refer to a spot in his board shorts or perhaps a bar he plans to open?

We have a good range of feedback buttons now. That said we could use a HOW IRONIC one.