binman

The sad reality is the social media companies profit from hate speech. So why would they change? Profit trumps everything

Spot on deanox. It is hard to argue with contention that racism exists every where, in all countries and is part of the human condition and experience. But in some respects there are two issues being conflated in this thread. Racism and systemic racism. Inter related issues obviously but not the same thing. Impossible for someone to 'understand' systemic racism if your whole life and being, and that of your family stretching back centuries has not been poisoned by systemic rascism as it has for African Americans and almost all first nation people's. Sympathise? Maybe. Learn? Yes. Understand? No. The other important elements of systemic racism is that if you are white in say Australia or America regardless of your age or family history you have directly benefited from, and continue to benefit from systemic racism. Hard to be truly understanding or even empathetic when something has worked to your benefit.

We play hawks next Sunday in our traditional 3.35 time slot.

Totally agree with this. And id go further and make it a legislative requirement (I know that is tricky but it easier than making them pay tax as huge company like Facebook can avoid tax but has to operate somewhere). Even without legislation it should be an expected part of organisations like Facebook and Twitter's social contract. And they should be called on it. They might argue it would be difficult to do (ie hire online moderators and community managers to immediately delete and block these profile). But that of course would be complete rubbish. Facebook and Twitter could both employ an army of moderators if they so choosed. And the cost would be a drop in the ocean of the obscene profits they are hoovering up. Might also do something to help mitiage against the employment crisis caused by covid 19. A related area is the furphy of free speech ie people have a right to post abhorrent views on social media platforms. It is bollocks because the principle applies to media. Facebook and Twitter are not media as such. Dissemenators of media yes, but not media. Users elect to join their club, so to speak. That doesn't give them freedom of speech on that platform. Justv as demonanland doesn't. Facebook have the right to block anything they so choose. The real issue is why they dont exercise this right (and the answer is it is clearly not in their interest as the model is based on volume and nothing drives volume more than hate - a fact that trump mercilessly exploits).

No Gary, that's it for now. I'll keep you in the loop though. Actually while I've got you I tried listening to you and your oh so hilarious buddy Tim. But it was horrible. To be honest you are as bad at morning radio as you as a football commentator.

Cool.

Sorry can't agree. I could care less about his criticism. But what i want from people paid to do live commentary is to do that job properly. And Gaza is a terrible commentator. He does the job like he is doing his on the couch job. Lyon is lucky that brown is so bad Lyon look like a Rhodes scholar in comparison. On Brown his comment implying tmac staged contact (in the incident where his eye was hurt) was well out of order. Im not usually one to suggest the dees make noise about issues. But i think a behind the scenes word to fox and brown is called for.

On the scoring trend, yes it is down which is a reflection of the game adopting the soccer philosophy that if you have the ball your opponent don't. And when they don't they can't score. But the 16 minute quarters have a funny impact psychologically as you have to keep remembering there is 20% less playing time (so 80 points is equivalent to a 96 points). And the other factor with 16 minute goals as with 20 minute quarters the game opens up in the last 4 - 5 minutes as players tire. So more scoring opportunities.

Agree with all of the above. Who cares what we paid for him. It's done now. A big problem with his kicking, and yet another reason why it was folly to play Smith ahead of omac (as Smith has the same problem), is that he has zero confidence in his ability to cross the ball to the fat side with a 40 - 50 metre kick. And so rarely does. That creates an issue and that kick is an important tool to break a zone.and set up scoring chains And the alternative is often a predictable kick down the line to a contest.

Totally agree. I have been banging on about the camera angles for years, in so far as its inability to show the game properly. In particular the lack of down the ground shots as it is that angle you can see the running patterns, zones and structure and set ups. Its why I sit at the top of the ponsford stand when I go to the g. Interesting, but not surprising that is the angle fed into the coaches box. A bigger issue in many regards is how [censored] the commentators are and how dominated it is by thick ex footballers who once out of the game for more than a couple of years are clueless about what is happening in the game tactically. Watson is the latest in this long line of peanuts. Ling is the worst of the lot. For Pete's sake hire some proper experts and people who do their own research. There is only one decent player commentator and that is Daisy Pearce. And BT the buffoon is so obviously threatened by her intellect that he often dismisses her comments. Right accroos the footy media there is a ridiculous absence of actual analysis so your average fan dies not get to learn or understand the incredibly complex tactical elements of the game. Zones, tempo, structure, systems etc define how the game is played and looks. So much footy media. So little information. Stupid talking head pressers full of cliches and puerile gossip from the likes of sam McClure. Does my head in. The article below, also from ABC news, is a terrific example of an insightful article that helps build am understanding of the game, the sort of analysis that there should be way more of accross all mediums (abc seem to be having these analytical articles semi regularly. There was the one on the crows fall that was discussed in the lever thread): https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-07-02/the-gold-coast-suns-rise-in-2020-but-is-it-a-false-dawn/12409144

I half agree Smith was not the problem (in terms of Lever's form), at least not against the tigers. Why i say half agree is that whilst as you have pointed out Smith was Riewollt's direct opponent for the whole game (and played him close) he didn't play the same role as Omac. I can't recall the role he played against the blues the Cats but IIRC it was more of an intercept role and less directly accountable for one player? Omac plays deep and often sits back alone as a last line sweeper and lets his man push up the ground. Not all the time of couse and really only when the ball is moving up and down the ground (eg not from centre square or forward of centre stoppages). And sometimes as a result ends up taking another big (eg swapping with May who might be pushing up to cover omac's man), or other free opposition players or having to hit a pack and spoil (something he is really good at as evidenced by his high number of one percenters). It is why he sometimes looks like he is caught out as he has to make ground to get to a contest (as he is not directly standing an opponent), a challenge made more difficult by his lack of speed. The role Omac plays requires good defensive skills and ability to read the play in both directions to judge when, or if to drop back. And no doubt it is a position that has its challenges as the players are often left exposed. Smith doesn't have the footy iq yet to play the role. And didn't. And as result Lever played much deeper than he normally would and others filled in whn required (which is why Jetta ended up manning Mckay at one point), though they didn't really replace Omacs role as such. So it is more a structural, set up issue than being about Smith per se. And i think tonight you could see how that structure helps Lever. It enabled to him to play much higher and also push up the ground more as Omac can offer some protection if the ball gets past him and May. It meant he could be more mobile, more creative and more attacking. Which is how we need t him play - and why i thought it was a bad move to change their back six and adjust their defensive structure, All of which relates to Lever's marking. I agree with you three points, but i'd another. He is a much, much better mark when he is moving at pace toward the contest. He seems to read it so much better than when he has to prop and wait underneath it. Hence his ability to take intercept marks. And having a player like Omac, who as you say is appreciable, who knows how to play that full back, sweeper role enables him to be more mobile and on the move more.And mark it more often. A final thing about his marking. I had a chuckle when Lever at one point took a very simple chest mark 20 metres out from their goals.(though it looked as if it was wobbling in the air - coming off after the game he was laughing and seemingly pretending to take a chest mark, and i wondered if it was about that mark) and i think Brown said that is why we got him to the club. We want a bit more than simple chest mark!

Weiderman - not his name

But really Pennant you could be a bit more supportive. Jnr has had to deal with a lot of conflicted emotions of late. The season starts with bad loss but Omac plays a terrific game (some say his best) and kills Darling. Gets praise on DL - Sad. Sad. Confused. After the enforced break Omac gets dropped, seeming proof he is not in our best 22. And we win. But play poorly - Happy. Vindicated. Annoyed. Omac's replacement does not play well against the cats. We lose. Many demonland posters argue it is clear we need Omac back in the team - Ambivalent. Angry. Baffled. Omac's replacement does not play well against the tigers. We lose. Many demonland posters argue even more forcibly it is clear we need Omac back in the team - Ambivalent. Angry. Conflicted. The conflict grows as it dawns on Jnr that he may secretly believe we need Omac, that we will be a better team with him in the side, that he is in fact best 22. But denial is a powerful emotion. Omac is selected in the side. We are indeed a better team with him in the side. Omac plays well. The dees win = Confused. Confused. Ambivalent. So lets be kind. Jnr will have to watch Omac play next week against Frost. It might be too much for him. Or it might be his chance to finally embrace and fully support Omac.

No sorry you're wrong PSD, there's 23 rounds so ipso facto. Hold on, wait a second.....

Just a game for Oscar. But in all seriousness agree with your comment about looking like he belonged about his game and playing his role. On the former, i though this it was impressive he played with such confidence having come back from been dropped. Perhaps good coaching from Goody in terms of messaging, or perhaps he has been working on that aspect of his game. Mots likely both. That confidence showed on that play that set up the Harley to Weed goal. Hard to see on TV (the tight shots really annoy me) but he must have come well off his man and ran hard to provide an attacking option (and it was great that he was used). The other bit of play i thought showed his confidence was his mark on the line in the last. I was sure he was going to hit it through for point, but instead elected to mark it. Small thing but a good decision as it made it harder for the Suns to set up a zone. On his Omac's kicking, in addition to his general efficiency and reliability what i really like is that he is accurate over distance and can kick it 50 plus metres and the ball travels quickly though the air. He did that on that kick to Harley and combined with the fact it was kicked to advantage it allowed to Harley to win the contest even though he dropped the mark. Compare him to Oliver (and a number of others) who can kick 50 but it floats and is easily defended. On a related note i would rather Omac take the kick outs than May.

G'day DD. Any interest in revisiting this post and the related discussion: 'O Mac is good kick. Mostly under not much pressure. His decision making is still not great though. petracca is a far superior kick. I’m amazed I have to even argue this point' (just joking btw - sorry, not sorry, couldn't resit )

Important to manage him

Top work joeboy. I really enjoy this thread and appreciate your effort to keep up the tradition of posting it after every game. After our recent games i wouldn't be able to do it! But even when we play ok i find it hard to be analytical or objective straight after a game. So kudos I don't always agree with all of your assessments (which is part of what i enjoy abouyt the trads) but prety muchg agree with all of them this week. That said the two i have quoted above are somewhat open to interpretation. Did Viney demonstrate best practice bullocking (sic) or was he just bullocking, at best? Did the the class of Oliver rise, as it must or is your assessment that his class must rise?

Rednblueriseing - not three words

Terrific win. Yes we made any number of skill errors and poor decisions. But we got the job done. Top Rankine had a shot at goal that would have given them the lead with not that many minutes left and they had the momentum. We worked hard to arrest that momentum and critically scored against the flow, which is what good teams do. A three goal win is about what we deserved given we were the better side for most of the match. And a three goal win (in a game with 16 minute quarters) is nothing to sneeze at in a match that was even in the betting, meaning we beat our line by 18 points. I was furious after the blues win, not even relieved. After this win i feel both relieved and pleased. Incomparable. We were so much better that we were in the blues game and we played a much better team. Credit where credit is due for goody: in terms of selection he made the changes he needed to (though it is ironic that we ended up playing small forward line anyway) tactically we slowed things down a bit and looked for the kick on the angle much more and went down the line much less he made some interesting positional moves - Salem playing higher, Melksham the same, Max pushing back and May forward late i reckon he got in Weeds ear as he was much improved after half time in terms of intensity and defensive work. also clearly the message about looking for the right option inside 50 was heeded (if they miss a target so be it but that is so much better than kicking it to an out number) Maxy was huge as was Viney. That is leadership. I loved Oliver's effort if not his execution. I thought Weed slotting his two goals was huge. Great for his confidence after that miss last year in the Alice. VDB got the memo about impact players needing to have an impact and his tackling was a massive factor in that last quarter. Some very sore Suns boys And our second last goal was simply brilliant, on a few levels - Oliver making the right decision not to go long (which given the circumstances he would have been well within his rights to so), but instead choosing the hit up to Trac. The decision was the important thing but of course brilliant for him that he hit his target. And trac took a good strong mark and i loved that after a simply woeful kicking game he never looked like trying to give it off or look for a pass and instead took the responsibility. Again the decision making was what was most important. The fact that he executed was also brilliant, but in some ways a bonus. But obviously great for him to nail it in terms of his confidence. The last goal was fun. Clever kick by Kozzie (who i reckon would have been a bit challenged to be put in the shade by top Rankin, who played much the same role) And of course Harley was never going to miss it. He has such an economical, tight kicking action- it reminds me Wattsy's action. Unlike Tracc, very few moving parts. He didn't have an outstanding game but his class and balance shone. And how magnificent was the passion and emotion after he slotted it and the boys getting around him. This team is not going though the motions On that last point one of the players in the huddle who hugged Harley was a clearly emotional Hibberd (who was terrific again), as he was after kicking his goal and kissing his arm band and pointing to the sky in tribute to his brother (who by all accounts he was incredibly close with, his closest mate). It gave me a lump in my throat and reminded me that this is just a game. I was going to post some negatives but happy Garry Baker avatar told me leave it 'till tomorrow and enjoy the positives and the win for what it was. He also reckons i should watch the Goody presser now and enjoy Goody's sly smile and likely repeated reference to Melbourne footy and i think i'll take both bits of sage advice.

Happy Harry baker avatar just told me it was never in doubt. He also said we can both watch a replay for the first time this year.

That's demon football. Well done Mitch

Just a standard OMac game. And by the by i wouldn't mind revisit the discussion of who is better kick Trac or Omac!

Agrree. His kicks aren't penetrating enough either.

Plenty of learnings there