bing181

Who will undertake it? Equally, isn't this or something like it standard at the end of every year?

People demanding that we "play the kids" can't now turn on them when they stuff up or are outclassed.

Did a lot right with who we had out there. To keep a top 4 team to 50-odd points is a credit to the coaches and players. Forward line still very much a work in progress and that coupled with our ongoing Achilles heel mid - forward connection was enough to do us in. Oliver again a shadow of himself, I wonder at what point they rest him? Playing Viney forward was a smart move, but we don't have enough mids to cover for him for the whole game.

Not good at all. There are always other players who are affected, even without realising it.

Too much logic.

Not what Burgess said in that lengthy interview he gave at the end of his time with us.

Putting aside the "question" as to whether or not a coach should be aiming to play finals (!) or manifesting a never-say-die attitude, there are plenty of coaches who try to finish off the season as strongly as possible to bring positivity and optimism going into the pre-season. "We may have missed the finals, but look at how well we did in the last couple of games, yadda yadda." I also would have thought that throwing everything at denying the Pies a place in the finals is a hill worth dying on.

Confirmation bias much?

"We've got so many good players and so many good coaches that it's exciting.” Ed Langdon

And to think he could have been ours ... Tom Scully, Jack Trengove, Dustin Martin. Easy in hindsight of course. Great player.

Reasons to be optimistic for 2025: easier draw.

People should look up regression to the mean - especially when the AFL has its finger on the scale in terms of access to high-end talent. Further skewed by Academy players (Sydney especially, but also the Dogs with JUH), and father-sons (looking at you Collingwood). But take all that out and teams will rise and fall. Always.

There are any number of studies out there that show that for teams performing poorly, changing a coach brings no long term benefit.

Other silver lining of a lower finish is an easier draw next year. Helped a lot in 21.

Messiah complex. Griffith knows what he's doing. Also, was head-hunted by Burgess and worked with him for a year in the changeover. How are Adelaide going BTW?

Not disagreeing, but two of the main reasons why fitness can be down are: - missed training/pre-season/matches through injury etc - younger players who have limited pre-seasons and haven't built up the deep stamina you need at AFL level There's not too many out there who don't fall into one of those two categories.

Kane Cornes: Goodwin just needs to shut it down. Put the players who need it into surgery to give them the best chance of recovery and the best chance of a long pre-season. Oliver needs the biggest and longest pre-season he's ever had. He's a shell of himself and clearly not fit enough to be playing at this level. Fix up Max Gawn, it's cruel that they're forcing him to play because they don't have any other options, and I don't know what's going on with Viney. But there are a number of players who are clearly affected by injury. They need to shut the season down and get the players fixed and come back for a big pre-season.

In 2023 he was 4th in the B&F and won the Leadership award. The players touch his helmet before every match. Huge out in terms of what he brought off-field and on.

A currently suspended player/son-of-a-gun, who in spite of everything was our best forward in the 23 finals (though forward line was decimated in any case, even Fritsch wasn't right after his injury). Spargo - who has his detractors here, but would have at least given us some options and is still our best I50 kick. Ben Brown - no reason why he couldn't have given us 40+ goals a year and been a foil for JVR if his body had held up. He's only 31, same age as (e.g.) Jeremy Cameron. And you look at players like Taylor Walker (34) or even Tom Hawkins (36), there should have been plenty more good footy there. Salem: was a key to our 21 premiership, his experience, leadership and disposal smarts are sorely missed down back. And having hm playing (decently) would have freed up Judd for more midfield time. Plus: Viney not right/carrying a shoulder. Bowey hasn't been right since his shoulder and missing so much footy. The team/list is completely shot, regardless of what the injury list says.

Would be catastrophic, especially Melksham. Reeks of getting rid of Junior McDonald. You have to have senior/experienced players around the club or there's no point bringing in kids.

That's just your opinion. Speculation presented as fact.

B&F 2023. 2 missing 2 injured/well down on their best Lever's the only one even close to 23 form.

Joel Smith, who in spite of everything was our best forward in the 23 finals (though forward line was decimated in any case, even Fritsch wasn't right after his injury). Sparrow - who has his detractors here, but would have at least given us some options and is still our best I50 kick. Ben Brown - no reason why he couldn't have given us 40+ goals a year and been a foil for JVR if his body had held up. He's only 31, same age as (e.g.) Jeremy Cameron. And you look at players like Taylor Walker (34) or even Tom Hawkins (36), there should have been plenty more good footy there. Salem: was a key to our 21 premiership, his experience, leadership and disposal smarts are sorely missed down back. And having hm playing (decently) would have freed up Judd for more midfield time. Plus: Viney not right/carrying a shoulder. Bowey hasn't been right since his shoulder and missing so much footy. The team/list is completely shot, regardless of what the injury list says.

Hunter was a good pickup, filled a hole in giving us a genuine wing opposite Langdon. Cruelled by injury this year, but for 2023 average 22+ disposals, a couple of clearances and a handful of I50's per game was more than decent. Same for Tomlinson, was very good until the knee injury. Other trades were cheap/depth - but once again, most trades are for not-required players and players who can't get a game. This idea that there's a pool of first-22 players just waiting to be traded is just a myth. As for midfield depth, perhaps, but we weren't to know that we'd lose Brayshaw, then Petracca, and that Oliver and Viney would be down due to injury and whatnot. Suspect also that there was an expectation that Sparrow would come on more than he has, even Laurie. But you can only plan for so much, and no decent or even half-decent mid was going to come to Melbourne to be backup to a stacked midfield - which is what we had back in the 23 trade period. The reason even players like Jordan and Harmes left was because they couldn't get games. Lots of Hindsight Harries on this and other threads.

The problem here is that it's not just adversity, losing Brayshaw and then Petracca and not having Melksham and on/off Salem available has ripped the heart out of the team in terms of leadership and experience, both onfield and off. Max and Viney being injured/down on form is then just the cherry on the cake. Teams can cope with losing star players (to an extent), but they can't cope with losing leaders and heart and soul players.