Whispering_Jack

The Bombers have been winning the PR war by deflecting the issue away from what happened during the time their supplements programme was being carried out to the matter of the painstakingly slow progress of the investigation. They've had their victories over the AFL and even humiliated Vlad over the Hird pay issue. The AFL has simply lost the stomach to see this through because of the repercussions to the competition of the issue of infraction notices and possibly the matter of that phone call to Evans. But it won't go away, will it? I put my trust in Stephen Dank, retired Bomber Nathan Lovett-Murray says NLM received a series of injections at a preseason camp under the direction of Dank on the Gold Coast and he wants the anti-doping authorities to interview Dank. So it started on the Gold Coast and that's where Dank worked for the fledgling Suns which I'm sure the AFL would not wish to come under any scrutiny, would it?

Max King could be the answer for Melbourne against Richmond in the NAB Challenge What's the mystery about Max King? Do they think he arrived at the club in a UFO?

The modus operandi is typical Roos. Use the preseason competition to test things out, try different players and give as little as possible away. The Tigers aren't going to run out with their strongest team either so we have a true practice match. No prize money or sheep stations at stake and the result meaningless if we play half a side. The worst thing they could do on Friday is agree to have Paul Roos miked up for him to direct one of our forwards to not try hard to kick a goal which he did once at the Swans.

My information (from two sources) is that Little and the Hird family were seen dining together last Saturday night. If that's true then there seems to be another misinformation campaign in play. Don't believe everything you read in the media. (of course, if I'm wrong then you don't believe what you read here)

Thanks for the advice BarnDee. Thread closed.

The man's expressing his opinion and I'm fine with that. However, he should count himself lucky he doesn't live in the Democratic People's Republic of Korea where you wouldn't want to say those things about the country's equivalent of Paul Roos namely, the supreme leader Kim Jong-un.

Anyone else worried that Roger failed to report in today?

Over the two years when Neeld was coach, the club organised a number of information evenings for supporters during which those who were invited were given the opportunity to ask questions. The matter of training, conditioning and fitness was raised on more than one occasion and the responses involved explanations which indicated that fitness levels of all the levels were measured at various intervals and they improved gradually over time which we were told was as planned by Neeld and Misson from the very beginning. Since Dave Misson is still around, I'm sure the opportunity will arise to delve deeper into the issue in the future and to ascertain how fitness levels were measured and what specific programmes were used. The fact that someone with Misson's experience and reputation was able to measure the fitness of the players to the point where we were told they were following an upward trend satisfies me for the time being that our fitness improved during Neeld's tenure.

WYL - the footy starts this week. Not a good time for a holiday from the site. No further warning. Thanks. Please return to topic.

Not so obscure in parts of the USA where it's been a derogatory term applied for over 150 years. I remember reading stories in my school days (not as long ago as 150 yrs) making those sort of references. Thankfully, society is moving on from that but the reference would still offend people in many places.

Time has flown and here we are - a few days away from the footy and two sessions this week in the lead up to Friday's NAB Challenge. Training is on at the usual time at the Paddock tomorrow (Monday) and again on Wednesday. We should get some sort of idea as to who will comprise the 24 (?) who get to run out onto Etihad at the start of our new era. Bring it on.

Here's the full update from the ASADA website (bolding is mine) Investigation update - February 2014 What changes have happened in sport as a result of the investigation? The Australian Football League (AFL) and National Rugby League (NRL) are taking action to strengthen their governance arrangements, policies and guidelines. The Australian Olympic Committee has strengthened its anti-doping rules to require Australian athletes and officials in Olympic sports to fully cooperate with ASADA. Netball, cycling and swimming have proactively introduced, or are about to introduce, strengthened anti-doping policies, and other high-profile sports are following suit. Yachting Australia introduced a requirement of all athletes competing at the 2014 Australian Youth Championships to complete anti-doping education, achieving 100 per cent compliance. The importance of intelligence-gathering and investigations to anti-doping efforts has been acknowledged with the inclusion of these functions in the recently endorsed 2015 World Anti-Doping Code. What is the current status of the investigation 12-months on? ASADAs formal investigation (Operation Cobia) arising from the Australian Crime Commissions Project Aperio has entered its twelfth month. Operation Cobia is a complex and wide-ranging investigation that has so far involved more than 280 interviews, the review of 120,000 documents and the issuing of disclosure notices to 13 people. The pace of the investigation has always relied on the level of cooperation from individuals. Refusal to cooperate and misinformation circulating in the public domain have hindered the progress of the investigation at several key stages. ASADAs ability to now compel persons to attend an interview and to produce information and documents relevant to an inquiry has helped advance the investigation. For a number of months ASADA has been issuing disclosure notices to people it considers are important to the investigation. The completion of these interviews will help draw to a close the investigation that started 12-months ago. What happens once interviews are complete? For a number of months ASADA has been issuing disclosure notices to people it considers are important to the investigation. The completion of these interviews will help draw to a close the investigation that started 12-months ago. Australia has a robust process in place to determine if an athlete or support person has committed a possible anti-doping rule violation (ADRV). This process is legislated and at its heart is the notion of procedural fairness. The process will involve an assessment of the investigations evidence by ASADA, a review by the independent Anti-Doping Rule Violation Panel (ADRVP), and a hearing by a Sports Tribunal and/or the Court of Arbitration for Sport. At various points the athlete or support person can proceed to a hearing or waive their right to a hearing, or appeal decisions made by these bodies. Timeframes for the completion of this process can vary. Every case is unique and a number of factors can influence the direction and length of a case, including hearings and appeal periods. Only once a final determination has been made by the relevant sport or a Sports Tribunal (and pending any appeals), is ASADA permitted under legislation to publicly disclose information about a violation of the anti-doping rules. The sensitivity that surrounds allegations of doping can affect the reputation and career of an athlete or support person. It is for this reason ASADA will not discuss the specifics of a case or investigation until its legislation permits. Ultimately ASADAs investigation is about protecting player health and welfare, as well as ensuring Australian sport is free of doping. It is about ensuring the health of young people participating in sport and where experimentation with questionable substances does not become the norm.

The NAB Challenge and the practice game are only Mickey Mouse games. The coaches treat them as such and the players are fully aware of this. It's highly unlikely that any of the teams is going to be at anywhere near full strength or give away any of their planned tactics and strategies in full so I don't have many worries about losing confidence from these games. Carlton would year in year out, lose these pre season games and Sydney only ever won one of them under Roos. They're for practice and trying things out so the risks of destroying confidence or the benefits of gaining it are limited to say the least.

Me. I'm happy with Bob's response. I hope he's right. Now let's see what happens.

Surely, if we play good footy and still lose against the best, we've gained more than whipping the likes of GWS (notwithstanding that they beat us last time we met)? When I was learning to play chess I was told that if I played against weaker opponents, I would never learn.

1994 was close as well. We were on fire in finals against Carlton and Footscray but ran into a brick wall, also against WCE over there on a day when we were jumped at the start and couldn't get back into the game in windy conditions. The next year the Ox did his knee, we lost Jako, had a series of disastrous injuries (Lyon, Tingay, Prymke), Martin Pike went ape and we lost it for a few years.

Thanks for raising Robbo's piece. It's a disgrace."Twelve months on, it's virtually amounted to sweet FA." - Robbo in Blackest day in Australian sport: No winners at Essendon, while AFL still has plenty to answer for Sweet FA, really? I'm guessing that one of the by products of that day is that Essendon won't ever again adopt a supplements programme in that involves thousands of off premises injections of supposedly unknown substances for which players sign waivers referring to them receiving drugs banned by WADA. The Bombers were handed a $2 million fine, lost draft picks for two years, and had coach James Hird suspended for 12 months. That's sweet FA too. There's probably more coming in the future ... and one more thing ... after reading your article Robbo, I reckon that 7 February, 2014 was probably the blackest day in sports journalism at the HUN.

The NAB Cup is no more. The pre season competition that we've had in one form or another since the 70s has now fallen out of favour and been replaced by the NAB Challenge for which there is no winner but rather a series of random matches played on a daily basis over 18 consecutive days with every game televised by Fox Footy Channel. The competition kicks off on Wednesday night with Collingwood paying a rare visit to Simonds Stadium and Melbourne is up on Friday night against Richmond at Etihad Stadium. Our second game is against Geelong at picturesque TIO Traeger Park, Alice Springs on Friday, 28 February. For us, these games are followed by a practice match against Hawthorn at Casey Fields on Saturday, 8 March (not televised). I think this programme is a good lead up to the season. We take on the teams that finished 5th, 3rd and first after last year's home and away season so it's going to be a tough baptism of fire for Paul Roos and his new look Demons. We all know that the result doesn't count for anything but, after our last few years, we need to show something and we don't want confidence-sapping floggings. With three games and most players probably getting only two out of the three to impress, the competition's on for places in the team for the opening game against St. Kilda. Footy's back!

The important thing is the way in which a coach reacts to those things and how quickly he does it. I have confidence in Roos because of his knowledge and the depth of his experience. My problem with Mark Neeld was that he was so inflexible about his structure and methodology that he reacted to opposition strengths far too slowly and ineffectively (if at all), leading to long runs of goals that blew the team off the park. Contrast that with Mick Malthouse over at Carlton who actually did engage a Plan B from time to time in order to stave off big defeats but at the expense of the structure he was trying to set up. It actually worked on occasion (they came back from a long way in the opening round last year to almost beat Richmond) but I'm not sure that this is going to help him develop a consistent approach in the long run.

The world anti doping code was instituted to stamp out the drug cheats in sport. Often they go to great lengths to avoid detection and will do their utmost to prevent authorities from exposing them and imposing sanctions. I wish people would stop blaming the system in cases where you have a football club that by its own admission has no idea what drugs its employees/agents administered to its players and its employees/agents refuse point blank to reveal what happened. Certainly, there may well be deficiencies and/or inefficiency in the way ASADA operates due to poor overall management or insufficient funding but if people have concerns at the slow process then blame the Essendon Football Club and Dank. Had the Bombers maintained proper control over their own records in the first place then the players would have known their fate long ago. As to the question of whether the investigation might be "nobbled" by government embedding a judge to come up with a predetermined outcome to help the AFL or Essendon, I would hope that's not the case. We're talking about an eminent jurist with a first class reputation dealing with a situation that is coming under scrutiny from powerful international sporting bodies. A whitewash here would create a horrible precedent for world sport and a scandal for this country's sporting reputation which would, in the end, cost us very dearly.

Sums it up pretty well but it won't prevent the next gloom and doom merchant from telling us that Clark's career is all but over if he ends a training session early because he's feeling a bit tight in the hammy or there's even a slight grimace on his face when next he trains.

True on most of those points but given our parlous financial state when Jimmy came in, we needed the measures he implemented such as the debt demolition, mending fences with the AFL & MCC etc just to survive to see the day of our move to AAMI Park. And the final decision to secure the Bentleigh Club had to be made by the administration that was in situ when the time arose. And yes, Joe did in that way save the club, an accomplishment for which few would give him credit.

Cost cutting measures are often implemented when things get tight financially as they did when, a few weeks into the season last year, it became clear that we weren't going to reach our budgeted incomes. This was mainly due to our poor on field performances as well as our failure to get sponsorship from a Chinese airline company with which we had been negotiating for two years. This made it necessary to bring in the razor gang but it doesn't necessarily mean that the expenditure in those areas had been wasted in the past. It was expenditure without which we had to make do because of the new circumstances. Our sponsorship money also went into greater spending in the football department with which PJ is continuing and which is just as well as you recently pointed out when Dean Bailey first coached the club, the conditions he worked under were truly appalling. Thankfully, the debt demolition and other measures undertaken in the interim by the Stynes/McLardy administration sees us sharing a state of the art facility at AAMI Park. As PJ pointed out, our balance sheet is strong and so it must be given that we're paying an arm and a leg for our new coach. I'm optimistic, keen and excited by some of the things that are happening at the club but appreciate that success won't happen overnight and I wouldn't get carried away yet by anything our new leadership says at AGMs. In addition to the talk I would like to see runs on the board.

Rhino. Had it been a telephone call, then it would have been easy. The protocol with telephone enquiries to ASADA is that the caller gets a receipt number for the call. Dank told Age investigative reporters Baker & McKenzie that there was no call but that he received his information from "inside the bowels" of ASADA. He has provided no proof of such advice which, as I said above, is irrelevant because under the AFL's drug code such information would not be sufficient to provide a player with an excuse for taking a prohibited substance. The irony here is that Dank is not denying that AOD9604 was administered but rather that it was legal which it was not. The other major prohibited substance is TB4 which Dank also admitted in the interview with B & M had been administered to Essendon players but he later recanted claiming he meant something else. The final ASADA report will be interesting.

I think I've covered this at least twice before on this thread. WADA has already stated that AOD9604 is prohibited and was, at all material times, prohibited. Under the AFL drug code, it doesn't matter if ASADA told Dank the drug was OK (for which there is no evidence), if Watson took what he has admitted to taking them it's goodbye Jobe.