Whispering_Jack

There used to be a time when it was de rigeur to say that at the pointy end of the draft you went for the best player available. I’m sensing that in the first instance, that might not be the case with some pundits who are thinking in terms of the prototypical best player at some stage in the future. That’s where some people are at before the best fit consideration kicks in. Perhaps this discussion should continue in The Mac Andrew Thread which we’ve designated for the purpose of looking into your question? The thread should have links to the full vision of the games that turned a young unassuming Sudanese kid into the overnight sensation that commands potential top ten status. You can decide all on your own as to whether or not the hype is justified.

Chris Doerre has put out his September Power rankings on ESPN (and on bigfooty where he’s known as Knightmare). AFL Draft - September's Power Rankings: Two father-sons in the likely first three picks Like most of the draft pundits, he has two father-son players in the likely first three picks and what follows reflects a diversity of thinking about the top prospects resulting in part from the interruption to a large portion of the season through the lockdowns.

That would be 60k more than attended their last game just a few weeks ago.

It was Melbourne’s first final in 23 years and the Demons came across the Kangaroos in the 1987 Elimination Final.

The AFL Draft Central Power Rankings for September, 2021 are out. The list goes down to #30. The player named in that position is an excellent young key position player Jacob van Rooyen who was close to BOG in the recent Under 19 national championship match for WA v SA. There are some handy players outside the 30 described as being “in the mix” so Jason Taylor should have plenty to work on come draft night even if a club snatched Mac Andrew out of our clutches. Draft Central Power Rankings: September 2021

Try this link

INDICATIVE DRAFT ORDER (before Week 3 AFL 2021 Finals) ROUND ONE 1. North Melbourne 2. GWS Giants 3. Gold Coast 4. Adelaide 5. Hawthorn 6. Carlton 7. Richmond 8. Fremantle 9. St Kilda 10. West Coast 11. Essendon 12. Sydney 13. GWS Giants 14. Brisbane Lions 15. Western Bulldogs 16. Richmond 17. Port Adelaide 18. Brisbane Lions ROUND TWO 19. Gold Coast 20. North Melbourne 21. Hawthorn 22. Gold Coast 23. Adelaide 24. Hawthorn 25. Carlton 26. Richmond 27. Fremantle 28. Richmond 29. West Coast 30. Geelong 31. Sydney 32. Geelong 33. Melbourne 34. Collingwood 35. Geelong 36. West Coast 37. Adelaide ROUND THREE 38. North Melbourne 39. Collingwood 40. Richmond 41. Collingwood 42. Melbourne 43. Gold Coast 44. Richmond 45. Collingwood 46. St Kilda 47. Brisbane Lions 48. Essendon 49. West Coast 50. GWS Giants 51. Brisbane Lions 52. Melbourne 53. Geelong 54. Essendon 55. Gold Coast ROUND FOUR 56. Hawthorn 57. Brisbane Lions 58. Gold Coast 59. Adelaide 60. Port Adelaide 61. Carlton 62. Hawthorn 63. Adelaide 64. St Kilda 65. West Coast 66. Gold Coast 67. Sydney 68. GWS Giants 69. North Melbourne 70. Western Bulldogs 71. Port Adelaide 72. Port Adelaide 73. Brisbane Lions ROUND FIVE 74. North Melbourne 75. Collingwood 76. Gold Coast 77. Adelaide 78. Hawthorn 79. Carlton 80. Richmond 81. Fremantle 82. St Kilda 83. West Coast 84. Essendon 85. Sydney 86. GWS Giants 87. Brisbane Lions 88. Western Bulldogs 89. Geelong 90. Port Adelaide 91. Melbourne

What a fitting article at this time and more so because it’s Father’s Day. Ron acknowledges the impact on him of the loss of his father (former Demon premiership player Ron Barassi Senior) when he was just five years of age. The story of how Norm Smith and family took him in and helped raise him is a legendary part of the club’s history. He was a legacy boy and the league introduced the father/son rule with him in mind. More than eighty years on, the legacy of his father’s death as a war hero still lives on at the Melbourne Football Club. When the club put on a function to celebrate Ron’s 80th birthday, opera singer David Hobson sang “You Raise Me Up” which I believe was requested as one of Ron’s favourites. I’m not sure if this was because it can be interpreted as being about the influence of fathers on young children but this is my contribution to Ron on this special day.

This has been reported elsewhere but the cancellation of NAB League finals and national under-19 championship games involving the Vic Metro and Vic Country teams represents a big blow, especially for Victorian talent as far as draft selection and development of the cohort of players in this state from mid to late teens is concerned. There’s a definite advantage to prospects from WA and SA who might still get another challenge match up if case numbers don’t affect their states. They might even get an Allies squad (minus NSW) if they’re lucky. And the race for individual state combines might run to the wire in the metro area in Melbourne which is going to make things tough for some of the hopefuls. Victorian draft hopefuls miss on-field chance to impress AFL recruiters

Norwood moves into 3rd place with a 7 goal win over Adelaide’s SANFL side.

So just before this thread makes it’s way into our Special Features section, I want to correct any misapprehensions about one comment I made, namely that Ron “didn’t have the smooth and silky skills of Robbie Flower”. This is in no way meant to detract from the fact that Ron himself, was a highly skillful performer out on the field. He was a brilliant kick, a great mark and his handballing was top class. You don’t become a “Mr. Football” without being highly skilled. His other skills were however, what made him so memorable - his toughness, tenacity and hard tackling. These are the elements that set him apart from the others and that made him integral to the six premierships that we won in that wonderful era for Melbourne that have kept so many of us thirsting for the next one which will hopefully come in three week’s time.

It was a truly memorable game at GMHBA Stadium GEELONG B: J. Henry 38 L. Henderson 25 J. Kolodjashnij 8 HB: M. O'Connor 42 M. Blicavs 46 J. Bews 24 C: S. Menegola 27 C. Guthrie 29 I. Smith 7 HF: B. Parfitt 3 J. Cameron 5 G. Rohan 23 F: B. Close 45 T. Hawkins 6 G. Miers 32 Foll: R. Stanley 1 J. Selwood 14 P. Dangerfield 35 I/C: T. Atkins 30 L. Dahlhaus 40 M. Holmes 9 S. Simpson 37 Sub: S. Higgins 4 Emerg: Z. Guthrie 39 Q. Narkle 19 E. Ratugolea 17 IN: T. Atkins G. Miers G. Miers OUT: Z. Guthrie (omitted) Q. Narkle (omitted) E. Ratugolea (omitted) MELBOURNE B: J. Smith 44 S. May 1 H. Petty 35 HB: T. Rivers 24 J. Lever 8 C. Salem 3 C: J. Harmes 4 C. Petracca 5 E. Langdon 15 HF: J. Viney 7 T. McDonald 25 A. Brayshaw 10 F: A. Neal-Bullen 30 B. Brown 50 B. Fritsch 31 Foll: M. Gawn 11 C. Oliver 13 T. Sparrow 32 I/C: J. Bowey 17 L. Jackson 6 K. Pickett 36 C. Spargo 9 Sub: J. Jordon 23 Emerg: K. Chandler 37 M. Hibberd J. Melksham 18 IN: T. McDonald S. May J. Viney OUT: M. Hibberd (omitted) J. Melksham (omitted) A. vandenBerg (omitted)

The kids who want to make it in that age group will put in the necessary work.

I also think that the perceived evenness of the draft is going to help Jason Taylor this year. However, I cant really see how we can improve our draft position without trading some players out at the end of the year. The are some benefits of finishing in the top four and that is that your team depth puts you in a position where you have some eminently tradeable players who can move elsewhere in the hope of getting games and progressing their careers. I would like to think we can end up with at least a selection in the first round. As to moving for a tall forward, if some of the drafts being put out by the experts are right, we might get a handy key forward prospect this year. There are a few in the WA under 19 state team that I like as future players.

No worries Dazzle. We all are entitled to our opinions and in that context, this is what this forum is about.

Wrong on a number of counts. I post updates on this thread which covers all prospective recruits. I update more on Andrew because he’s our NGA. Luke Jackson didn’t come to football late, he was talented at both football and basketball and made the choice of sport after excelling at both. He was in the WA Under 16 squad and academy in 2017 and played for WA Under 18s for two years in a row. That’s my point - the people who make recruiting decisions had plenty of opportunity to gauge his potential. My point is that this has not been the case with Andrew. Moreover, your claim that it’s unfair to draw comparisons with Jackson begs the question. My point is that he hasn’t shown enough to warrant a #9 selection on any basis. Was he BOG in his last game for the Stingrays vs Eastern Ranges? Scroll back a few pages to my post from August 4 where I referred to the NAB Boys League games played in the previous weekend based on a Herald Sun report - he wasn’t in the best five players (in fact he was way out of it based on reports I received). The state game was streamed on the internet and I watched the game. Vic Country was overwhelmed by Vic Metro and, irrespective of the comments of Doerre (he must have been having a knightmare) or Twomey, Andrew was beaten in the ruck. He wasn’t “commanding” or anything near it in my view.

I’m all aboard the idea that a player’s “scope of improvement” is really important but I remain highly skeptical as to what it is that makes the scouts believe that he has this enormous potential attributed to him given the very small body of work we’ve seen from him, the limited number of times he’s been named in the best players etc. or produced outstanding statistics and his tackle numbers are very low. The advantages of having a dominant ruckman or pair of ruckmen is well known and not novel. However, if you look at the ones picked up early in drafts in the past, Andrew doesn’t meet the comparison test. Luke Jackson had been recognised in junior ranks from a much younger age and represented East Fremantle Sharks and Western Australia at the AFL Under 18 Championships for two seasons, where he ended up winning under-18 All Australian selection in his draft year. Grundy had been a star in state junior ranks and dominated a SANFL Under 18 Grand Final in the ruck. Andrew has played just six NAB Boys League games (he lasted five minutes in one of them) and only really stood out in his first two back in April. He played just one decent quarter in the Academy game v Geelong and didn’t impress as a ruckman v Vic Metro Under 19s. As it stands, I have yet to see sufficient scope for improvement in him to warrant top 10 or even top 20 selection so I wish him and the recruiter who takes him with pick 9 the best of luck as his career unfolds. Twomey has a KPP in Jacob Van Rooyen at #27 yet on what I’ve seen of him, he’s a player who appears to me more likely to have that improvement in him. I wouldn’t lose any sleep if we found a way to draft him at that number and missed out on Andrew. Likewise with a bevy of others.

• Collingwood looking at Geelong’s Natan Kreuger who has yet to play an AFL game; • Josh Caddy looking for a 4th club; • Gold Coast considering a bid for Luke Parker.

I’ve had a long, hard look at Twomey’s Top 30 and I wonder where Cal Twomey gets his intel from? Two weeks ago, he published his Draft Team of the Year in which he placed Mac Andrew on the interchange bench. He’s pick #9 here. The rationale must be that he doesn’t make the best 18 because he’s there because of his long term potential and the suggestion is that he’s been told by at least one club recruiter (I suspect more than one) that he’s in their sights. Otherwise, this doesn’t make sense to me. There were a couple of other NGA’s in Twomey’s DTOY. They were Collingwood’s Youseph Dib and St Kilda’s Michito Owens but neither of them are in his top 30 a fortnight later. Strange. Full back Zak Becker, winger Isaac Birt and interchange also missed his top 30. Josh Rachele who was surprisingly left out of Twomey’s team is back in favour at number 8. All this suggests that we can expect plenty of surprises and changes in lists of this type before the final decisions are made.

Cal Twomey has dropped his August form guide and has Mac Andrew sitting in 9th place. Cal Twomey's Phantom Form Guide: Top draft prospects' August ranking

Possibly forgetting Jim Stynes’ very talented son who can play a bit. Also around 15/16ish but is also a top junior basketballer.

I’ve since discovered that he hasn’t turned 15 yet … however, he is the oldest.

Good to see him get some recognition for his performance. Those stats are pretty good for a 4 x 25 quarters game with no time on and 5 players rotating off the bench. Given that there were a number of highly regarded prospects from each state on the ground. I’m biased obviously but he’s going to the right club where he can be developed without the urgency that we used to apply for every recruit who walked onto the scene. Here’s a player by player assessment on the game - Scouting Notes: 2021 AFLU19s – Western Australia vs. South Australia

There’s an article in the Herald-Sun (no link available) entitled “Moneyball: Follow all the latest trade, contract, draft and coaching news across the AFL” there are some interesting items – • Essendon is keen to recruit Gold Coast’s Malcolm Rosas who is seen as a replacement for Irving Mosquito who has left the club. • Adam Cerra is considered a certainty to land at Carlton with Melbourne mentioned as the only other possible suitor. However, the Demons aren’t in a position to provide a trade. Luke Jackson is out of the question and the club doesn’t have any high draft picks. • Melbourne is keen to retain Sam Weideman who has received interest from Collingwood, North Melbourne and the Gold Coast Suns. • Tom Lynch who was told by Adelaide that he wasn’t getting a new contract. • Hawthorn has offered a three year deal to Fremantle’s Lachie Schultz.

Some years ago, I was a member of a tribunal of a junior football league. It probably shouldn’t come as a surprise but there were a few cases that we sat on where young impressionable players sought to emulate their heroes playing league football and it landed them in trouble. Fortunately, I didn’t sit on any cases involving attacks on umpires but there were some in my time that were heard by other tribunal members. A suspension of a season or the remainder of the season plus the next were meted out. I’ve watched the vision and listened to the pundits arguing both ways but to me, this is a no brainer. Forget the argy bargy and excuse making about whether or not there was physical contact (there was). You need to look at the entire incident from beginning to end. Start with the confrontation in Greene’s approach to Stevic, the way the contact was made and the aftermath of the contact. The look of every aspect of this incident was appalling and reeks of conduct unbecoming of a professional sportsperson in this age. A finding of not guilty or a light sentence in these circumstances would not be well received in the community competitions, whether senior or junior that struggle year in and year out to fill umpiring places. I believe that earlier this season, a number of competitions were struggling and in many cases, umpires had to double up on games over a weekend. The AFL Tribunal has a duty to decide this case on its merit but it would serve the sport well if it took a strong stand tomorrow night. I personally would like to see a minimum penalty of six weeks suspension with a stern warning from the chairperson that he is fortunate to have received just that. Hopefully, a severe penalty might influence GWS to not even consider wasting everyone’s time with an appeal as they did a few weeks ago.