Wiseblood

The club wouldn't tell him info like that. Anyone actually go today? I feel as though if the TMac injury was bad there would be reports on it by now. Dawes and Terlich I can handle.

Cross is the only player I consider a loss. What did Howe give us in 2015 that Bugg can't give us this year? He was horribly inconsistent and I already feel as though we don't miss him at all. If we were to make our best 22 for Round 1 in the other thread he certainly didn't leave a hole that's hard to fill. I agree that the bulk of our improvement will come from current players, but that's how it should always be. The fact we got rid of McKenzie, Bail, Fitzy etc is a huge win going forward for us.

I'd like to think we can this year, but I also see our first finals appearance being in 2017. Roos has dragged us off the canvas when we were seconds away from being knocked out for good. His job has been superb in my book.* *If we were to somehow go backwards and only get 6-7 wins, for example, then I'll certainly change my tune.

Are we talking this year? 2020? 2025? Roos won't be around when we're pushing for a big finals tilt. That will be on Goodwin.

We got what we wanted though. The only thing that changed for us was when Howe seemingly backed out of going to the Suns and decided, at the eleventh hour, to go to the Pies. We have to put together a deal quickly, while still getting Kennedy in the process, and then we were still able to make the deal with the Suns in the end. We were always after Bugg as well. They aren't 'sexy' trades as such, but they deserve time to blossom before we write them off.

When do you consider it 'done', then?

Bit early to make those calls I would have thought. Give the new recruits and draftees a chance before claiming they don't improve the list. And if the kids improve for 2016 then we've made the improvement we need.

Not to mention that one of their best players, Cale Hooker, is a free agent at the end of the next year and there will be plenty of clubs chasing him. If I were Essendon I'd be worried about the next few years and the very real possibility that their best players will get the hell out at their first opportunity.

Alright, I'll bite. Roos was paid a premium, helped in part by the AFL, but as stated above he has played a big role (with Peter Jackson) in beginning to turn the club around. We've still got plenty of hard work ahead by I don't think anyone else could have coached us to 7 wins last year, and we could have had 10 if we hadn't given up a few easy games. Vince and Cross are excellent recruits. Lumumba, I'll agree, has been poor so far. Melksham can't be considered a bust yet, or overpriced for that matter. We've also been able to draft some excellent players in his time at the club, although that obviously doesn't sit solely at his feet. No one approaching A grader? I would have thought we had a number of players with that potential. Hogan, McDonald, Brayshaw, Viney, Gawn... they aren't there yet, but they have the potential to get there. Lastly - I have no idea why you still support Melbourne. In 600 odd posts I've never seen you even try and to say something positive about the club in any way, shape or form. That's sad really.

Fair point there DD. Jackson has been just as important, if not more, than Roos in helping to turn the club around. The fact he has stayed on and continued to do such good work is one of the best things to happen to our club in a long time. The Jackson/Roos combination has sent us in the right direction - we aren't there yet, of course - but we are looking better than we have in a long time. Spot on with the bolded bit, and Roos was the best we could get. He came at a price but it hasn't hurt the club in the slightest.

If you take your love affair with him to the next level then you can have him coin phrases like that, just for you, any time you want! Perfect!

I personally don't think there was anyone else out there, apart from someone unrealistic like Clarkson, who could have gotten us to this point right now. We were so far behind the rest that we were in danger of become irrelevant for a very, very long time. Roos has changed that immensely. He has turned over the list, the club has drafted and traded well and we are just beginning to see the fruits of his labour. Saying that Roos is'phoning in' his third year is a little harsh but, at the same time, he should be handing the reigns over to Goodwin more so once the pre-season of 2017 rolls around we hit the ground running. I understand the negativity, although you did go negative very quickly on most things these days, but I don't think there is anyone else out there who could have made the impact that Roos has over just a couple of seasons.

Maybe. Or its a pretty ordinary look to sign someone who has been suspended already for illicit drug use when you've had 34 players done for the same thing. I would have thought they would be trying to get away from that image.

Thanks, once again, for your wonderful contributions to the board jnrmac. Always a pleasure. And a waste of time.

Storm in a teacup really. Yeah, it's incredibly stupid to send nude photos of yourself, especially if you're an AFL player, but they've done nothing illegal. I love how the people who had the photos flogged them around to the TV stations first who all declined before the lowest of the low, Woman's Day, accepted them. They are just in it for a buck.

And that is so good to hear. I think those of us who read the training reports over this pre-season have noticed that more than in previous seasons. We seem to have a larger group who are training at a consistently high level and we aren't seeing just the usual players doing it. Another terrific aspect is that we aren't hearing much about the first year guys - not because they aren't training well, but more so because our list is so much better than it has been in previous years that we don't need to rely on them to come in and make an impact.

Your second sentence is important - while you're right in that it doesn't guarantee anything, Kennedy has shown on a consistent basis that he can dominate at VFL level. I'd love to see the stats on how many times he was then promoted to the senior side and simply made the sub, but he has done enough for me to suggest that he will be a handy acquisition at the very least. And if he doesn't become a best 22 player in the years to come then I'll be happy with that, as it suggests we'll have a very strong side that is well and truly playing finals football.

Pretty good analysis ProDee. As you mentioned both are very different players, but I still believe both were similar in the way they were treated by their previous clubs. It was very easy for us to pot Toumpas and he came with the baggage of being selected instead of Wines before he even played a game. It was rare that he was given a regular run in the seniors without either being subbed or being the sub and, even when he did play well (St. Kilda game, for example) he was quickly either out of the side or back to being a sub. Kennedy spent many games doing the same things - either being subbed or spending 3 quarters as the sub. I have no doubt that, if he is given a good run at it with the backing of the coaching group, that Kennedy can become a good player for us going forward. I can understand why others are not as confident as he hasn't exactly played alot of good footy over the last few years, but he has shown enough in glimpses to suggest he has the potential to do it on a more regular basis.

Super updates Wayne! Much appreciated!

I said much the same thing earlier in the thread. It's not as if Jake went out and deliberately cheated. As Fifty-5 so eloquently put, he was 20 at the time and from all reports what he was taking wasn't illegal. A year out of the game and what they've been through for the last 4 years is punishment enough.

It's rare to see you rate anyone or anything within the club these days, so you're comment doesn't mean much. And nobody is saying Michie will be the answer to our problems, he is just the most likely player to be promoted off the rookie list to replace Melksham.

And Heppell for that matter, although I tend to think he might be a loyal fella and stick with the club. Hurley, though, might be someone who will look at it differently. Only time will tell.

Do you think they'll be able to offer that? With the amount of expenses they are already having to go through my gut feeling is that they may be only able to offer rookie type wages. That's just my assumption though.

He'll play second fiddle to Leuy, but with his injury history having someone like Jamar ready to go isn't such a bad idea.

I wasn't even talking to you. You're the one who quoted me. Move on.