No10

BOTH Wagner boys for pick 2? Or King? Not remotely a fair deal, but they need players that want to be there. Help the talented kids they already have enjoy Qld. It’s not exactly a bad spot to be an overpaid footballer.

Butting in... I want him to straight bat with more confidence. I'd like Goody to say "the game style requires all 18 on the field to function at a very high level. When it doesn't work it fails completely, but when it does work it's football that will win finals". I agree with @Sorry kids that his media impression matters to the players, even subconciously. However, I also believe @stevethemanjordan that Goody is a world different when not on camera. Goodwin is making a lot of mistakes, but he's learning...

Gosh, 500k. Good career choice, stay fit + get rich. Slightly OT, but I was put off by the ‘pace setters’ when the players were running in pre-season. In that it surely falsely enhahnced their times. Faux data set perhaps didn’t help.

Demonland pre-game articles by @Whispering_Jack are among the most brilliant writings in any sport media. “Scream” v WC deserves some kind of sports literary award. I’m a great fan of @The Oracle also and @george_on_the_outer on the post game, consoles my wounded pride at being a Dee. I’m sure it’s been said before... but the considerable work and passion is much appreciated, I’m sure by all.

This must be the real question. The only players to have markedly improved under Goody are players that fit his team game style (whatever that is) - like ANB who can make numbers around the ball. Roos gave the players roles based on their attributes and those players rose up. Harmes is maybe the only player Goody gave a signature role - and he shone. I hope he can pull it together. But the fact there isn’t a great deal of exciting player development with a list of extreme talent... this has to be the big question

It does seem a combination of so many things... the team looks at sea. The game is now perfectly suited to our former No1s - Watts and Hogan

I admire Goody has a plan and he’s implementing ruthlessly. I didn’t like Goodwin at first. But his commitment to his vision is winning me over, even though I don’t understand it.

There really isn’t an excuse to be this poor. The list on paper has incredible young talent that should see significant improvement year on year. Chemistry solidifying. Confidence building. There are similarities to last season where we were scored on too easily, this year there’s a lack of scoring power in the fwd half now too. I’m a believer that this can turn around. But I confess to having absolutely no idea why the team as a whole is performing so badly. I can’t pin this on specific players.

Who are these players with “intuitive footy sense” on the MFC list?? The failures are with the players who lack any sense at all, it seems.

He was so relaxed, it was strange and concerning. Of course the players carry the message from the coach post game, so I’ve no doubt he was set into that mode by Goody. Perhaps he’s a genius coach, keeping them believers even at 0-3. The failures are bizarre, players like Frost and ANB aren’t as bad as that. It all looks so inexperienced. Even the experience (like Jones) seemed to run to positions to escape responsibility, he guarded grass more than anybody. Goody traded Watts and Hogan, he doesn’t play an experienced forward like Garlett. He believes full team buy-in to his game plan will win over individually gifted players. I’m going to say Goody is a genius coach as he’s doing everything different to what I would’ve thought. He still has Brayshaw believing, so maybe that’s a good thing?

This is a great thread Binman. The first rule change you listed and detailed, is the most surprising to me. Generally the AFL want to improve the spectator experience. Positioning was a real issue back with the ‘flood’ game style, but more recently positional coaching has been far more nuanced and interesting. Coaches, in particular Goody, were trying out new ways to set the team and I thought that was exciting, sometimes frustrating, always interesting. You could argue those manoeuvres are too ‘inside baseball’ for the wider audience, so the AFL don’t care to let that play out. But then there’s the incredible drama of tight games and those last few minutes where the captain has to direct the team to setup defensively to protect a slim margin... dramatic, even when we didn’t and left the game exposed, then lost! These are great moments in the game. I’m not sure what the AFL are gaining here? Perhaps a really clear graphic setup of the positions in AFL, lasting for just a moment before it becomes a scramble to reposition. I liked that Goody had new ideas and was brave enough to try them. Gave us an edge, with so many players being trained to be so adaptable. I’m marking this one down as a loss for the AFL and a loss for the Dees.

In the morning we give a late but good pick (maybe 46) for KK. Freo are spooked. Freo concede they must give Neale to Brisbane for 5. Now Freo are in a total mess. Freo give 5 and next years 1st for Hogan. GC take the Freo 2019 first for May. On draft night we swap 5 to Adelaide for 8 & 14. Even if this happens I’d prefer Hogan to stay.

I believe it was clear that KK can be a separate trade. Hogan for pick 5 and 23 was a fine trade, last week.

Sure. I might be dreaming, but from this point in negotiations I would certainly expect 2 firsts. 5 and 2019 first. Fremantle will be forced to offload Neale, then they’re in real trouble.

Oh, I see. I would've thought Hogan would be the much more valuable player? But I guess I don't know enough about Lobb.

What's the Lobb decision? And why not well bode?

I’d love to see Hunt back in the team. It was eluded to by some that he had a difficult year. I wonder if anybody can shed a little light on if his difficulty was physical or his application or personal issues?

If I were Kent, I’d absolutely want St Kilda paying a higher price than 75. He’s meant to be going there to be more valued. However, 3 years and (I think Chook said?) 3x money... maybe he doesn’t care about the other number

Just wait for it, one of them (probably Caro) will hype it up massively leading in. The story will be Hogan Redefining Trade Currency. But they’ll have a better headline.

You keep saying Hogan must be less value than Judd. Or that there’s some overestimation of his ability on here. Firstly you can’t list a bunch of accolades as evidence Judd was more valuable. If so, what then would you have paid for Lewis?? Hogan is a young gun (not overrated, the stats back that up) & JM has said he’d be asking for one of the highest trade value seen yet. I guess you’re excited by the King brothers, I’d prefer Jesse personally. Would you take Kelly or Salem/Tyson? I appreciate posters being emphatic about their opinions, but 4&5 isn’t unrealistic, it’s just a hard bargain.

Come on ETtradewhisperer... You need to earn this title of greatest newsbreaker on Demonland and give us something fresh.

Thanks Chook, can I ask what you think of the trade generally? A player like Hogan is such a unique talent. It is what it is, but wonder what your take on the vibe of it all is?

The only way this makes sense is if his foot injury is really bad. Fine then, take the money and security. Otherwise, surely the manager would say stay. Win games. Maybe a premiership. In 5 years take a Buddy deal and cash in. Going to a failing team is crazy at this stage of his development. It appears such a bad option for Hogan that it seems impossible. But many posters on here rate Chook in Perth as a solid voice.

Absolutely. Hoges is v fast. I’ve posted this already, but fastest top speed in AFL is...

I’d argue Mr September is a player that rises above their season form. Viney and Oliver both incredible, but no more so than typical. Harmes and Brayshaw emerged in season. Trac is the player we all hope for. 1. Hibberd. Found the desperation. 2. Weid. The big surprise. 3. TMAC. First to stand tall.