mo64

TBH, I was struggling to think of a 2nd ruckman who's had a consistant year. I haven't seen the initial squad of 40, but they generally select 2 ruckmen.

Not bad. Backline and forward lines look spot on. S. Johnson, Medhurst and Motlop all play a similar role so I doubt that all 3 will get in. A 2nd ruckman possibly Hille, in for Medhurst. Joel Selwood in for Deledio.

I'll pass on both. O'hailpin - Great FF? Never Tenace - uses the ball well and could be that classy midfielder that Melbourne is looking for? Never

I thought that Players Not Quoted was our best player over the year, and will take the $4.50 on offer.

There's nothing wrong with having an opinion that turns out to be wrong. But in the case of Rhino, you can't honestly say that list that is capable of winning a flag 1 year, is unskilled and an absolute train wreck 12 months later, when Bailey inherited it. I've been saying all along that our list isn't as bad as our results and performances this year.

I like the concept of drafting players who are well performed at state level, with low draft picks. Jason Porplyzia and Aaron Edwards are 2 players that come to mind. Both were delisted from AFL clubs, then redrafted at the age of around 22. Recruiters tend to use low draft picks for under 18 players, with so called "upside". Most of them turn out to be lemons.

Name one?

It's amazing how ex-players who are actively involved in the game, and see Naitanui on a regular basis, have a different opinion of him, compared to some armchair experts on this forum. If we draft on a needs basis, it would seem that we can't go wrong with Watts, Naitanui or Rich, because we're lacking in key forwards, ruckmen and quality midfielders.

You make a fair point Hannabal, and I'd be interested to know how many times Swampfox and Rhino have seen Naitanui play when they make statements like: "Naitanui has a great leap and amazing speed and not much else at this stage". Swampfox "Natanui will be three years away from commanding the No 1 ruck role (if he ever does) at senior level. By that time we will have Spencer coming through." Rhino Prior to last year's draft, Carlton recruiting manager Wayne Hughes made the statement that Naitanui is a "one in a generation footballer, who'll bring people through the gates". So he obviously rated him a better prospect than Kreuzer. Hannabal, in your opinion, do you think that Naita will play regular senior football next year?

Maybe it has coincided with the fact that Brisbane and Sydney no longer have 1st crack at their local players. It's handy when you can pick up the likes of Voss, Akermanis, Ashcroft and Charman for next to nothing (and they almost got Reiwoldt). Also, I think the additional allowance they received on their salary cap for player retention has been scrapped.

Congratulation High Tower, you are the only person who knows how to spell Schwarz (no effing T). We were close in 1994. Unfortunately towards the end of the 3rd quarter of the semi final against Footscray, Lyon and Schwarz collided, resulting in Lyon going off with a leg injury after kicking 10, and Schwarz having concussion. Both were doubtful of playing against the Eagles the following week. The most depressing part of 1998 prelim against North Melbourne was watching a clearly injured Lyon really struggle. He dropped a simple mark in the last quarter when on his own, and it was obvious that his back was stuffed. We were a chance that night, but things didn't go our way.

I actually agree that the current football administration didn't want to bottom out, that's why they pursued Judd. And I agree with your sentiments regarding the keys to winning a premiership, except that you forgot to include "luck", which is a big factor. Our downward spiral occurred when Daniher adopted a "run and carry" game plan in 2007. It was obvious to all and sundry that it didn't work with the list we had, so Daniher was duly dumped. Bailey comes in and adopts the same game plan with the same list, and we played a brand of football that was as excruciating to watch as I've ever seen, and without fight. That's the issue I have with the current football dept, and I won't accept the "bottoming out" argument as a crutch for our inept displays.

Question no.1: Do you think Melbourne have a strong enough list to win the Premiership in 2007? (Assuming the side isn't cut down too badly by injuries) Your response. Yes Is this the same 2006 list that you've been lambasting over the past 6 months?

Well, well, well. Interesting to read Rhino's comments. I'd like to see how he gets out of this. "We are in the mix this year definitely and with the right confluence of events could seriously challenge for it. IMO a Grand Final berth is not out of the question. Its easy to be negative and apply the blow torch to your own team (more so than others). I prefer to rationally assess and see the opportunity and I think it is closer than many give credit."

No I haven't, but if you save all the PMs you've sent, you'll find it.

I agree, but if our list was such a train wreck after 2007 as many espouse, why would you forego 3 high draft choices, if you believe that success was 3 years down the track? That's not the actions of a side that's bottoming out. Would our list be any better in your eyes with Judd minus Morton, Grimes and Maric? I don't believe that the current football dept. deemed that our list was a train wreck, simple as that.

Well Rhino, you were the moderator that sent me a PM saying that it was a club request, so maybe you were just playing God again, and took it upon yourself to act on the club's behalf. And since when is a player's injury status confidential information?

Ha, ha You can't answer the question, can you? Why pursue Chris Judd?

To all those that believe that we started our "bottoming out" process after 2007, then answer this: Why did the current football administration (not Daniher) pursue Chris Judd at a cost in real terms of 3 high draft picks (Morton, Grimes, Maric)? I can just imagine our sales pitch to Judd, "Well Chris, we'll be bottoming out for the next 3 years and we wan't you to be part of our exciting future". Bottoming out, my arse!!!!!

Do you know this to be fact, or just guessing?

It's ironic that the club discloses the fact that most are fit, yet when I wanted to know the injury status of our players during our last preseason, my post was closed by the moderators at the request of the club.

In addition to the 6 wins, how many narrow defeats did we have last year? This year we were competitive on the scoreboard in 2 1/2 games, with one of those against a side that didn't try (WCE). Jeez I'd love a coaching job where you accept no blame for what transpires under your tutelage. The facts are that we were uncompetitive with a list that was competitive in the years prior.

You obviously didn't read the article. Roos stated that clubs aren't given enough credit for making the finals, and you for one have been critical of our sides from 2004-2006. As he states, there is no formula to winning a premiership, but you have to make the finals to have a chance. You watch, clubs like Carlton and Richmond will receive higher praise during the off-season despite missing than finals, than the likes of Adelaide, Kangaroos, Sydney, and the WBD. Armchair experts like yourself will say that they need a cleanout of the players that won't attain them the ultimate prize. According to Roos, this is folly. We are only in a bottoming out stage because Bailey was unable to get anything out of the experienced players, all of whom had played regularly in the finals. That's what caused the train wreck, not the previous administration.

Of course 2 experienced players will make a difference in the next 2 years. Our off-field success is dependent on winning games. Show me an example since the induction of the draft, where a team won a flag after bottoming out for 3 years?

So our next 3 years aren't important? We won't have a future if we continue in the same fashion as this year. I suggest that people on this forum read what Paul Roos has to say, in a Caroline Wilson article, about bottoming out. There is no set formula to winning a premiership, and there is no evidence to suggest that bottoming out is a sure fire way of achieving premiership success. All it does is give you financial grief.