Fact is the writing is on the wall with him because his groins are shagged. He's a useful player, but taking his injuries into account and the fact that he isnt particularly quick and is a very predicatble, kick it long player who can only play one position, I think it's fair to say he is only an ordinary unit on the list. I mean assuming we draft a quality midfielder and have McLean, Bruce, Green, TJ, Jones, McDonald and Sylvia, its a long bow to suggest Moloney is going to be an important player.

Jones is good at the scrimmages, but very dull in all other aspects of the game...Again, if I was trying to build a quality AFL team, I would be looking to more well-rounded players.

interesting, but i think that if we can get moloney fit he could be the difference between us having a good midfield and a great one.

he kicks long, he runs hard, and he hits the packs hard. his disposal, when on song, is pretty good also. i think he would be the icing on the developing cake for us...

Fair go dapper, when have I ever knocked McLean? I watched Sylvia play 11 games for the Bendigo Pioneers in his Coaches Award-winning season and he was a better player then than he is now, he could kick longer, he could evade players and he spent a lot more time through the middle. Perhaps, that speaks a lot for the injuries and lack of preparation that have marred his AFL career, but in reality, his AFL output has been only OK...he hasnt been able to play much through the middle and you can hardly regard him as a gun! As for Jones, my point is that he needs a lot of work to be a gun footballer, and that he is being over-rated by a lot of people at the moment...maybe, he will be a gun, but as I say, he is a poor kick and he can only play one position. My views on Moloney are above. I dont think my views are blinkered, I think they are unbiased and methodical. If you can honestly say that Jones, Sylvia and Moloney are gun AFL footballers, you wont ever earn a cracker in the AFL industry.

Ok. So I'll assume for now that you are not "having a go" at Jones, rather lowering the expectations somewhat...

My problem here is that you are applying a "rating" to a 19 year old kid that had no right to play as much footy as he has, been as effective as he has, and play as much game time as he has.

His kick is fine. He's drilled NUMEROUS goals from 50, sometimes slightly outside. He's a FANTASTIC in and under... you even concede that point, and yet you claim he's average.

Long story short, we've had talent GALORE for years. And look where it's gotten us. We have recruited another 3 JMacs to the team so we don't have trouble getting the pill like we have in the past, simply because outside players are a dime-a-dozen...

Jesus. He's 19!!! Getting 12-15 possessions a game is right where he should be, and he's exceeded those expectations.

I think you're being too analytical. The amount of intangibles in footy are too numerous to mention, but one of those that seems to count for more in the win/loss column is desire. The kind of desire that has a domino effect on the more weaker-willed players in every side. Call it leadership if you want. Neita has it, JMac has it, Chook has it... And Jones has it.

Look at the Roos, Pies, Crows, Power, even Sydney.... They are chockablock full of players who want it, and LOVE the hard stuff. Look at where they are on the ladder.

Footy, like war it seems comes down to a simple equation at times...

The most committed wins.

Jones tips the scales in our favour as much as a single member of the 22 could.

But again, you are entitled to your opinion. Call him over-rated, there will always be "football scientists" who will say this. Personally, I'm pleased as punch he's in red and blue.

The scientists would never have predicted Harvey would last that long...

I would have to agree with alot of what the goodoil is writing. I think we look at our own young players with rose coloured glasses sometimes, but in reality, if you take a look around the league, they are no better, and possibly worse than a many others.

I still maintain, i saw Ricky pettard play a couple of games early this season, that were better than any game i have ever seen Sylvia play. He seems to me like one young player, that might(fingers crossed) be one for future stardom. Dunn is another one to me, who seems to have a natural football brain and feel for the game, but lacks consistency in both performance and coach's faith(eg. Plays a great tagging role on C.Cornes in first game against Port this year, and is then dropped for the next meeting, when we are supposedly building for future).

I still think Jones and Brock are going to be gun players, just not the superstars we need.

Oh... I forgot. Apologies about McLean... I misread Moloney as McLean earlier.

No he wasn't. He got pantsed twice by Kingsley in consecutive years but apart from that his form was quite good. You were calling for his head. Nicholson was the preferred FB at the time, but with limited opportunities, Carroll proved his worth.

Both Miller and CJ have had more than enough game time to show they're not up to it.

Carroll with Rivers/Whelan/Bell beside him form the base of a solid backline.

..........and Nathan Jones is Very Good.

Oh no not BIG ALL AGAIN i have just stoped having nightmares o well another 1 year at least now thanks. :angry:

Poor old Miller, Joe-boy.

To say he played without passion seems heartless to me. I thought he gave his guts, and wasn't ineffective, when finally played in his correct position.(leading forward).

Bell - trade trade trade

Miller - trade trade trade

Trade bell!

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

thanks for the good laugh before work

Who was playing on Buchanon yesterday??? No-one!!!

Honestly, we got taught a lesson about selfless acts.. the number of times the behind the goal cameras showed our players not being prepared to chase and go the other way, well I lost count at 50!!

Honestly, there are too many players that are not desperate enough and will not do the small things.

I am sick of the dribble that continually gets dished up week in week out!!

Jeff White was absoltuely pathetic - shown up for being loose and unimaginative!! why does he not do what Jolley and Everitt were doing and being dangerous!! Totally over this overpaid bludger!!

Well, this was the first game I have seen live this year and I just find it hard to believe how much bad stuff was happening. I won't go on about it except to say a couple of ( obviously controversial ) things. Firstly, there was simply not enough effort put in - it was embarrassing to watch. What on earth is going on with Neita? How anyone can say that Brock Mclean or Brent Moloney are gun midfielders is beyond me - they are both too slow and don't go anywhere near the ball when the heat is on in the middle!! Ward and Brown had to be introduced to their opponents after the game. There is plenty more to say but I will stop there.

On the positive side - why do people on here go on so much about Miller - at least he has a crack, along with Bell, Holland, Green, Carroll, Jones - give me those type of players any day of the week. The Juice was terrific - at least that's one thing the posters on this site have had right all year.

The last game I saw live was the Queen's birthday game against the pies last year and the degradation of this team since then is nothing short of disgraceful. For goodness sake, get Sheedy on board to teach these guys how to play football again.

And one other thing, what is going on with the rules these days - there were so many "tiggy-touchwood" frees yesterday I don't recognise the game any more - this stuff is basketball!