No. We had Bruce and McDonald. That doesn't mean we were older and more experienced. If we had a hundred-year-old playing for us, we would have lost by more, despite having an even more "experienced" side. That statistic is as much a lie as "Quarters Won" when the only quarters you win are the last.

Bruce and McDonald are 10 year + players so against hawthorns young players our structure should have been way better than what yesterday served up.

My major concern at this stage is that the great kids we have recruited will not reach their full potential if they play continuous games like yesterday.

Apart from Green it was hard for them to be inspired by any of our senior players.

Hawthorns babies would have been pumped. Seen it so many times before over the years.

I haven't given up, but i am concerned.

So Dermie is saying Al Clarkson pulled Bailey's pants down.

We played better in the the last Quarter because the Hawks had slowed up, not because we improved.

Its a tough question to ask, Do we handball or kick to a player and hope he beats his opponent (sometimes 2). I just hate seeing a player mark the ball, turn around, handball to the closest player only to see them have to side step out of trouble. A player sometimes has to way up his options. Our switching of play was horrible.

I heard on the footy show this morning that DB was offered the extension to his contract as reward for doing what had to be done at the end of last season (tanking?) This is not acceptable in my opinion.

I know we are all [censored] off at the moment, but please show improvement Melbourne.

We pay our money each year so we deserve more.

You must get overwhelmed easily if you took the stats of older and experienced to heart.

Hodge, Mitchell and Roughead are younger, less experienced, much better players then James Mcdonald, Bruce, Green. Quality in in the experienced players who influence games. In MFC, our quality had 0, 0, 12 games between them.

So

Quality Hawks ave age: 24 ave games: 90

Quality Demons ave age: 18.5 ave games: 4

Yes but add to that who hawthorn didn't play. On Paper with the right attitude before the game we were a chance, the way the game was executed was deplorable.

Bruce and McDonald are 10 year + players so against hawthorns young players our structure should have been way better than what yesterday served up.

Age + Expereince doesn't make you a quality player. Bruce's got 200 games. Hodgey 100. That does not make Bruce twice the player of Hodgey.

Bruce was deplorable. Moloney was terrible. Miller provided squat. Davey played in name only. Green played a half. Jmac played hard but made plenty of mistakes.

We played like kids because they were kids out there. The leadership group was non existent. How do you win games with your most experienced players taking a back seat to the kids.

Age + Expereince doesn't make you a quality player. Bruce's got 200 games. Hodgey 100. That does not make Bruce twice the player of Hodgey.

Bruce was deplorable. Moloney was terrible. Miller provided squat. Davey played in name only. Green played a half. Jmac played hard but made plenty of mistakes.

We played like kids because they were kids out there. The leadership group was non existent. How do you win games with your most experienced players taking a back seat to the kids.

ii agree with you, but why does it happen? Why is our leadership group so timid and ineffective. We keep asking these questions yearly don't we.

Bruce will never be twice the player of Hodge, i would play him at Casey next week myself, i am over his hospital hand balls.

Otherwise play Bruce forward.

Its a tough question to ask, Do we handball or kick to a player and hope he beats his opponent (sometimes 2). I just hate seeing a player mark the ball, turn around, handball to the closest player only to see them have to side step out of trouble. A player sometimes has to way up his options. Our switching of play was horrible.

I agree, this happens all too often and the net result is not only putting ourselves under unnessecary pressure but it is also wasted energy cleaning up the mess.

The irony is that when we should play on because we have space there is nobody to pass it to. Our ball movement must improve as well as our positioning and ground coverage. Yes, this is up to the coach but our conditioning is also a part of this.