Macca

The one thing in our favour is that at least we know that there is a certain level of base talent at the club ... from 2007 through to 2015 the levels of talent were negligible. The current output is abysmal though as we've a raft of players who are well below their best and many others haven't come on or progressed. As for the FD, same story. Game plan isn't working and a major fix has to happen - pronto. We need a major lift, right across the board. In the dark days the talent levels dictated the wins (losses)

Our footy media are either clueless or in bed with the AFL ... probably both if we're being honest. Intentionally clueless? But tanking has become like PED use in sport ... no one gives a stuff anymore so it is rarely a conversation piece SP. Look up 'Match Fixing' on Wikipedia and the MFC club is the only AFL team mentioned. Again, only a very small part of a much bigger story is highlighted.

Yep ... and I knew all that simply by putting 2 and 2 together (decades ago) - it isn't rocket science TT ... but the set in their way types here are more interested in shooting the messenger As for our future prospects, I am way more buoyant with the current list than in any number of previous seasons. Right now our game plan needs a lot of work and a stack of players need to improve.

BS There was a lot of stuff going on at the same time - The slandering of the umpire - The pending court case - The settlement - The club not backing Smith on the slander charge (that is what Norm was really on about in that 'I am Melbourne' piece of footage) - The sacking - The reinstatement You and others have been told a story and it has been reduced to 'The club sacked Norm Smith for no reason whatsoever' You like that narrative because it means you can complain about your mythical take on what happened (forever and a day)

They were tanking as well in 2005 ... picked up a priority pick and a top end pick for their trouble. Brereton ... "We need one more go at the draft" (meaning a good go) So Clarko tanked in his first year of coaching ... with the backing of the club of course.

It was a legal issue ... and Norm wanted the club to side with him. They didn't and out of frustration they sacked him. I wouldn't have sacked him so I don't know why you are pointing the finger at me. And I know all about his success ... what Melbourne supporter doesn't? I get it, because it was one of the hated umpires, Norm's actions were justified. I wonder what the settlement cost him? Norm made a critical error ... and he paid a heavy price for that error. I doubt that he saw it coming too. Norm coaching the team for a further 2 and a half seasons must have been awfully difficult - another contributing factor to our fall from grace it could be argued. An untenable situation all round. Just debunking another myth ... as I see it. Those who choose to disagree can disagree all they like. I'm not fussed.

We need a major lift right across the board. FD included. I want to see the club win as many games as possible ... for the clubs benefit we do not need another 16 loss (or worse) season. For those eyeing off the draft, we can work our way towards a top-end draft pick with shrewd maneuvering (Clayton Oliver style) Another rubbish season affects sponsors, membership, supporter confidence, the ability to attract talent, player moral and numerous other areas. Better to battle it out rather than close up shop. 8 - 10 wins from the position we are in right now would salvage things somewhat. Not ideal but the alternative of a 5 & 17 season (or suchlike) would be horrendous.

I'm no populist Smoke ... most here get it, all the same. Robust debate and leave nothing out I say. Once vital info is left out (or conveniently put aside) myths abound. I can see why the club sacked Norm ... but many believe we sacked Norm on a whim or through sheer incompetance. I do not believe it happened that way. I mean, it just doesn't make sense to sack a 6 time premiership coach who's record after 9 games of the '65 season was 8 & 1. There was more to it.

We shelved out decent coin for Diamond Jim & Big Carl but other clubs were bringing in a stack more dl. 2 big name recruits versus double figures from at least 5 clubs. e.g North Melbourne ... they just kept bringing in the talent in the 70's & 80's. Bankrolled by a few of course but we had no such luxury With these things there are normally logical explanations. We had rubbish zones and we didn't have money either. End result = Lose.

Zones '63 - '86 (roughly) How many top players in that 24 year period ... Flower, Alves, Biffen, Hardeman, Wells and maybe Parke & Dillon. Not much else in terms of top players. The strike rate was abysmal. It is any wonder we couldn't win games as the only other alternative was the interstate top talent where the 'money' clubs dominated. Or pay big money (which, again, we didn't have) for top talent from rival clubs. Smith knew all this too thus his frustration. The curse is a nonsense ... talent and good coaching wins. Lack of pure talent - you lose.

He called a certain umpire a cheat - publicly. Probably cheered on by the masses who see the umpires as the enemy (the brainwashed lot) Norm should have been above that sort of stuff ... great coach though but we've all got flaws. If you don't agree I couldn't care less.

Forget the success, slander is slander Imagine if Goodwin came out and labelled a certain umpire a cheat? Naming the said umpire. But you just keep on believing your myths swill ... see how far it gets you (nowhere) We became a basket case post that premiership era primarily because of our zones and also because we got left behind with our antiquated thinking. But the main reason was lack of talent - same as it nearly always is.

If you reckon I'm wrong, prove it But a word of warning swill, in your pursuit of the believed myth being correct, you're going to discover that I'm right So toddle off and do your research and stop wasting my time with your inane replies.

I am not sure that legally the club could stand by him ... if tbey did, they would be effectively slandering the umpire as well Just my take

My take on the sacking of Norm Smith ... spoils a good story but nevertheless ... Norm slandered an umpire publicly, was sued (settled out of court) and the club rightfully wouldn't stand by Norm and his slanderous comments ... in frustration he was sacked by the club and then later reinstated (a week later) His team had started to struggle (moving forward) and the writing was on the wall with regards to the less than average zones that we were allocated. Norm did the 'supporter' thing and started blaming the umpires. He brought about his own downfall in my opinion.

Over to you Wadda for the clincher!

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@Wadda We Sing @Dee Zephyr I'm happy to continue with the midweek multi whilst there's still some big time sport about being played midweek. NHL & NBA goes through to mid June whilst the European soccer often plays catch-up midweek (along with the Champions League) Midweek Special Thursday NBA 10.00am Houston lead at the end of every quarter vs Utah ($2.10)

Monday Special NBA Monday 5.30am $2.40 Golden State Warriors lead at the end of every quarter @ LA Clippers

We will win more games rjay but I'm thinking they will be the unlikely wins rather than 'We should be able to beat such and such etc' Oddly enough, coming to terms with how the season will probably end up is rather easy. Back to the default mode hey? None of us are going anywhere and we'll continue to be paid up members etc (why quit now?) but it does pay to have some other strong interests outside of footy. If it is just the Demons it will do your head in.

Back in medievil times you'd be a marked man rjay ... you got any good news? You can make it up if you like - tell us what we want to hear. Anything will do, we're not fussed.

In the light of the most recent event (another shocking loss) ...I might just stick around at ADATR for the winter! (or at least the MB thread) I mean, at least we've got a bit of control of the happenings at the races & multi's. As a mere onlooker with the footy, the sharp pain just continues to be quite prevalent. Pays to broaden your horizons as a demons fan ... I started doing so in the late 70's!

I've got about 8 really good prints but did have to send one back one time (quality average but got a full refund) ... and that was a ways back Wadda. The prices have come down a bit and getting a canvas print is a good option too. I believe there is now a 'super' giclee option available but it's great fun perusing ... I know a couple of people who frame paintings and prints so I have previously just ordered the giclee prints on their own. 'All posters' have got just about everything but there are probably a number of online print companies ... but if you do order anything giclee, start off inexpensive as a test case or 2. By the way, JJ has got me 3 winners today (so far) including Meli Melo in the 7th at Oakbank - got the exacta as well so a happy lad here mate!