Mad_Melbourne

Also with Judd, Carlton organise the stoppages so he will get the ball, they block and protect him as much as they can. This is what we need to do with Moloney, to many selfish players around stoppages trying to get the kick themselves, this also comes down to coaching.

this is what we need to do for davey aswell, sheppard him and get him in space!

he only played 60% game time, he could come in as our sub, possibly, but i wouldnt want him playing a full game at afl after playing 60% game time in the vfl

having said that 19 disposals in 60% game time is awesome, and he would kill it as a sub.

playing him as a sub would be great because we could then monitor his game time, barring injury, and we could also monitor his injury, and it would also mean we could get him doing a proper fitness test after the match for the next week.

Actually Artie, I criticised his kicking AND decision making which btdemon has outlined pretty well now so I won't repeat it.

You're the one who insisted he was an elite kick and focussed the conversation on his kicking.

It's interesting you don't have any issue with Bate being on the list. Now, given the opportunity to get on to his preferred foot Bate is an elite kick: penetrating and accurate. The problem is that he now lacks the athleticism to get on to his preferred side, and that's the point about Maric - it's not what a player can do some of the time, it's what he does do most of the time.

I'd also like to renounce the thread title "list clogger". I used it because that's how it started on 'ology. Let's call em good VFL players. I'd be rapt if Bate or Maric proved me wrong but I can't see it happening.

ridiculous, maric has the ball kicking it inside 50, bate has the ball kicking it inside 50, i sure as hell know that i would want maric kicking it. 9/10 maric has a slicing kick, it is only when he tries to do too much, tries to gain that extra 2 metres of space, or take on an opposition player when he comes unstuck. he has had a very high number of score involvements in previous weeks and usually is getting 1 or 2 assists.

he is not an elite afl kick yet, but he has the ablity to be an elite afl kick, he sure as hell on this season form is in my opinon at least, the first pick of our small forwards.

that being said

cloggers:

Warnock

Wonna

Bate

Morton

it is rough to say, but i dont see warnock or bate getting another season, even though they are great for our depth, im not sure if this is already answered, but how many players do we have to drop at the end of the season?

What you have described is exactly what we are trying to do, and what other teams do too. (I call it HIGH POSSESION HIGH TURNOVER FOOTBALL)

My problem with it is that for every disposal (dinky kicks to 15-20m away) there is the potential for A. a poor disposal B. a fumble. That's TWO opportunities to stuff it up for every movement of the ball.

Simply get the ball into the hands of a player in a bit of space and PROTECT THAT PLAYER.

If the opposition 'spread' to set up a zone it will play into our hands as we will have more players around the ball. If they 'rush' the ball carrier and his support it will open up space behind the rushing opposition players for our players further up the ground to lead into.

It's not Rocket Science, just minimal possesion for maximum gain.

Go Dees

understandable, and yes i have just stated how the successful teams get through the oppositions forward presses, and their style of play, but that is how they are winning their matches.

run and carry is a viable option, but you need to get into the space, which is constricted by the forward press, and thus the "dinky kicks", handballs, and the switches create this space, if you run into the forward press you turn the ball over, and that is why the possesion football is used, to slowly drag players out of position and then to take advantage of the space.

WHY WE HAVE NOT BROKE THE ZONE:

-Laziness, not all players are wanting to do the hard work to get into space.

-Bate, Jurrah, Newton, Maric, Petterd, Morton, are all decent players, but like to run half hearted leads with their hands in the air. run at the ball carrier hard and fast, turn around and do it again, this is how the space is also created, at the moment i think our players just want the reward without the effort, and this is why Jack Watts is slowly becoming my favourite player, he continually runs at the ball carrier, whether or not they pass it to him, and then he runs just as hard to repeat the lead, we are seriously lacking this.

-[censored] poor disposal, hitting targets is the key, mind you we are missing several key disposal players, yet at an afl level nearly every 15-20m kick should hit a target, this is seen especially through, collingwood, geelong, hawthorn, they rarely miss the short kick, gaining meterage, until all that is left is the long option.

KICK OUTS ON THE WEEKEND:

-stoppage creating, which is all well and good, but seeing as carlton are the best stoppage team in the league (and if they arent, they are top 2-3) it lead to a bit of trouble, but it also meant that we had less goals kicked on us off the turnover from kickouts, and it was a more man on man play from there, having said that it was predictable, and resulted in a sydney esque style of game.

-mind you, we were missing, tapscott, grimes, davey, garland, all who took kick outs while playing meaning we had to try something different.

i am always optimistic, and for some reason, i am more so this week.

having said that, im just hoping my optimism pays out in a less than 4 goal loss.

it is clean disposal, doesnt matter what you do as long as you move it cleanly, which is hard with the pressure, but effectively if you can keep the ball in your hands then you can get through the forward press.

this can be done through

- chipping the ball to leading players, only 15-20m away, carlton did it against our poor press on the weekend, collingwood do this, hawthorn did this this week aswell.

- going around the zone, with switches, as these presses in play usually bloke 1/4 or 1/3 of the field, thus when in posession switching is often the result, which melbourne tried to do, but we went well too wide.

- when switching then splitting the zone up the middle, as the zone will move across the field there will form gaps through the centre of play, it is often a riskier kick but most good kicks can hit them, suckling from hawthorn is my personal favourite, but most teams have these offensive/defensive players. there were several times when melbourne could have done it this week i thought, but we were trying to avoid goals from turnovers and just pushed wider and wider.

- running it, riskiest play, but breaks the press the cleanest, geelong style play, where in, handball and quick movement creates the space.

hard running is also vital to push into the spaces.

Without Bartram and Garland, we look a tad slow up back especially with both Rivers and Warnock. Especially if the Blues have Garlett and Betts up forward.

True, but also a bit untrue aswell, i think we look slower, but surely Bennell, Nichloson, Evans, have some serious jets, i just dont like their ability to be a hard defender like Garland and Bartram.

Morton - Gibbs, like his role on Goodes

Jetta - Scotland

Judd- Mckenzie, would love to see Nicholson on him bit of a baptism with fire though

Murphy- Green, like we did on dal santo

Bennell - Yarran

Looking at the list though we will probably need Nicholson in the backline, on gartlett or betts.

Would love to see green on judd, like we did with dal santo but his engine would probably be too large.

trent cotchin

hayden ballentyne

campbell brown, when hes not elbowing people in the head

ill be there with horns on

Ridiculous, the only place we should ban twitter is forums on demonland, for anyone to suggest that twitter effects how a person plays is ridiculous, sure if they are twittering during the match or even in the warm up and cool down of a match then we may have to get them off it, but let them do what they want during their free time. If a person being on twitter annoys people so much, then dont follow them, it is a simple as that, just dont go on twitter and no one will be bothered by it.

Although it is ridiculous you may be on to something, we should ban them having anything to do with the internet Facebook, get them off it, Twitter, see you later, newspaper articles and articles on the melbourne football club website, goodbye. Also the players sometimes attend University, this promotes free thinking too much and they may get distracted from playing football, so unenrol them. Extra curricular activities that have no relation to AFL, such as surfing, going out to dinner, watching movies, hanging out with their girlfriends and wives too much, we really need to cut this out aswell. We should make the mfc, a prison based team, create a bunch of cells at AAMI park, only give them certain hours for free time and three square meals a day, and the rest they have to be at AAMI training, gymming, and then studying opposition, they should not be allowed any time to themselves, and really lets be honest, its not like they should be doing anything else with themselves that doesnt involve football.

that we won in contested posession and tackle count

that it looked like we wanted to be playing out their, most of the players at least.

we were just out classed, they kicked 11 goals off our turnovers and that is what killed us.

lots of positives to take from the game on the whole, and other than basic skill errors, i thought it wasnt too badder match from our point of view.

our only problem is the fact that we are losing our speed, rohan bail, colin garland, both relatively quick, hard running players, if they are replaced with rivers and mckenzie, although they both have good tanks and good players, in my opinion this leads us to a lack of speed to break the lines, hopefully bennell can have a ripper, and even more so flash.

i hope it is a closely fought out contest, and we come into the last quarter and blow them out of the water, the one thing i am pretty set on is that we have really good endurance and that we are able to run out a game up their with the best of teams, and i hope this puts us in good stead.

Maric to continue on with his good form and kick 4 goals.

to me that's what he was explicitly stating not even in a veiled way

he's saying that everyone gets instructions from the coach, and if blokes dont follow them the system doesn't work. He is saying he is guilty of this, deserved to be dropped, and now he is learning it. I say good on him for writing that it is a ballsy thing to do and interesting that the club posts it on the same day the HS has a slagpiece on him getting dropped and leaving the club, what garbage.

can't believe nobody else has raised the bit about Barty being one of the most rated footballers at the club, he gets absolutely no rating on this site

yeh i agree he knows why he is being dropped, and he takes it in good humour which is good.

and also i personally rate bartram alot, although i agree he does fly under the radar about his work ethic, and his physical strength and endurance, and really just how hard he works in a match, especially on this site

i laughed at it, due to the fact he isnt playing for that precise reason!

going on past match ups it will be frawley.... and i would love watching frawley decimate milne

How about this for an idea. Lynden Dunn is out. Brad Green is struggling up the ground and gets too much attention up forward. He's not producing what we need.

So how about he plays Dunn's role? Play him as a defensive shutdown forward on their most attacking defender. So, this week, he plays against Brendon Goddard. Thoughts?

i think it will be petterd

yeh, because it is also a team based decision, and it is voted upon by all the players!

!

Bater should be an inclusion at shiityhed and against the hard/veteran bods of the Saints too. Probably a week too late but bater late than never! Shouldn't have been dropped from previous week (certainly not for either Jetta/Bennell

he was more dropped due to the fact newton and martin came into the side and can play in the ruck, and he cant, and also because he was the worst player afield, including adelaide players in a 96 point winning side.

I dont understand thier logic(I.E.the seletion panel) common sence would tell you if you play Juice at full forward he gets the best backman after that it has the waterfall effect which means someone like Liam or ricky(bobby) get the No 4 or 5 backman we dont seem to think this will work but over the years it has

arguable, if i was an opposition coach i would be more inclined to worry about watts and jurrah, as their goal kicking and disposal is much better than newtons. newton would take the warnock-esque defender, just the lump who really is not the number one defender but rather just a stopper.

none the less on the topic on a whole, with the massive drafting of our fwd line it is good to see this depth coming in handy, even though bate was handy in the vfl, howe was best afield, so i would be giving him a run ahead of bate, as i see playing a player on form is better than playing a player because they have played good afl matches. bate was awful against adelaide and we hammered them, so i feel that we do not need him in the side

OUTS: Garland (inj), Bail (inj), Dunn (susp), Wonna (omit)

INS: Macdonald, Evans, Howe, Mckenzie

basically self explanatory, these are what i would like to see, but i will not be suprised if rivers replaces garland, and bate replace howe.

but...

rivers and warnock in the same backline, leads me to severe worry, especially with a forward line of riedwolt and koschitzke, rivers and warnock will make us too slow, in the backline and will probably lead to severe strife, so a mobile macdonald is definately who i want in.

howe on the form from the weekend, bate in the form of a tried and tested forward, so will be interesting to see the path they take.

also for mckenzie to come in for bail, i feel this will lead our midfield looking a little one dimensional, so we need someone with that zip to break lines, and this is where evans comes in, evans is a player in the mould of bail, and thus can possibly be the perfect replacement.

i dont understand the system at all, but surely the impact is taken into account, if his is a 3 week/4 week suspension, what will hockings be?

also, dunn is not that bad, he does his part adds a bigger body, i much prefer him to bate playing, and really this week is rough to be judging him so harshly seeing as he played about a half in the backline

I remember that Bulldogs game as quite a good game(maybe his best), but just because you rack up a ton of disposals playing loose across the backline, doesn't mean you have impacted the game in a positive way, as your own stats will atest to. Which is why i rate the Sydney games as better.

seconded, he never had an opponent in these matches, and was playing loose across the backline, in a losing team, where the ball was in our forwardline alot, you would think a loose man would get alot of the pill.

scraped a draw with JCB, frees against and frees for are always my downfall!

i want to see ricky bobby, smash out the handcuff salute every time he kicks a goal haha

turning our back idea is ace!