Tigers Dayz

So, it's $273k for a basically insolvent club. Money which could be saved.

yes he can

its whether the club has the where with all to do so.

its a contract..you can pay it out.

Like any business you can sack people. There are of course guidelines and consequences of doing so. If Melbourne decides to meet these, he's gone...**pufff** Gone !!

really it comes down to money

Since noone can tell me roughly what he's on, I'm going to say $240k.

So, if it comes down to MFC paying out $240k for nothing, then he's **puff** Gone !!

What I like about Bate...

He is strongly built

He is a long kick (by Dee standards!)

He has a good motor

He is faster than he looks

The downside has already been covered here... at times he looks ordinary (but he is not!)... This is the Mr Hyde side that the coach(s) need to assist with.

I don't think he has found the right slot yet. He may end up a dour defender... but there is something to like about those sweeping left foot goals from outside fifty!

A definate keep!

Would be my assessment as well, waynewussell, but I'd like to refer to an incident that made us happy at the Brisbane game at the G;

Can't remember now what qtr, but Bate came back to help our defenders, and courageously flew across Jonathan Brown's flightpath to punch the ball boundary side towards the pocket. The resulting crunch did not look too damaging, but Brown rose to his feet, groggily, 'eyes looking everywhere' for the next 5 minutes or so. It slowed Brown down enough to limit the damage he could do over the next qtr or so.

Bate may have played a fair role in us winning that game.

A keeper for mine for 2009.

Hasn't Melbourne only won the single Granny in 50 though?

1959, 1960, 1964

perhaps he is hoping that one of the vic teams will move to tassie as there is a market there,as opposed to west sydney, which no ones wants to go to, because they will keep struggling?

I don't see any reason at all why Jeff Kennett shouldn't take his team to Tassie. In all sincerity they could be instantly competitive, and market attractive particularly when they get some Tassie talent in the side. Expansion of the Tassie sponsorship... perhaps a green "V" added to their strip.

I have no teeth, am broke, can't spell, have no job, live in commission housing, am Joffa's love child

Correct

i have just heard from someone at an mfc lunch that we will have a red clash strip with a blue logo next year!

Huge, if true. What's the credibility factor in your opinion 45?

What money is Carroll on as a matter of interest? Over a Demonology they have the view he's on huge money.

Player with lots of grunt... and presence... never intimidated.

I was impressed when he injured his foot in the Brisbane game, refused to stay off, and he came back on and showed the way on one leg.

Captain next year, hopefully.

Unless you are winning the contested ball then you can huff and puff all you like because it means diddlysquat.

This was never argued by me.

Carroll intimidates no one on the ground because oppositions (1) know he is a peanut, (2) they know his decision making is suspect and (3) they know he will do something stupid when push comes to shove.

I did not say he intimidates. My view is he is not intimidated

MFC young players need leadership and good example on the ground not the antics of a player whose on and off field behaviour aligns to the LCD.

Not disputed by me, but I don't think his on-field behaviour is particularly bad..

Like I said you overrate it and you do so at the expense of things that really count if you want to be consistently winning.

What did I overrate? And at the expense of what?

can you explain to me why you don't want to pay out his contract? we will pay him the same amount next year whether he plays or not. the only extra money we'll pay is the cost of a draftee (what $35K?). and not only will we have further our cause of pushing forward with youth, but we will also have removed a player from our list who's poor behaviour and poor on and off field examples have continually demonstrated how poor his character really is. if you want to improve the culture of the mfc, getting rid of carroll is a great first move.

Because if you delist you don't get the use of an experienced player but you pay for it.

I understand the argument for clearing a list spot and pushing forward new youth at the cheap incremental cost of $35k, however this may cause me to think twice prior to donating next time - this is something I want to think more about.

But thanks, deanox, at least you found the core of my argument.

Carroll does not have any presence. Despite all the posing and bad haircuts, he is terrible with the one on one and is a more often not a goose when tempers flare. He gives us nothing on the ground.

BTW, Miller does not have it either.

Physical presence is best served by winning contested ball more times than not and using it effectively. Otherwise you overrate the "tough guy" stereotype. Only McLean comes close to my definition.

Is it his looks that make you think he has "grunt?" Or his football?

IMO if Carroll has grunt, Fevola is a class act on and off the field.

I thought his footy was ok in 2006-7. I couldn't give a rats how he looks.

I will say this one more time; I don't want to pay out his 2009 contract. Again, I did not donate money to have if payed out for FA.

Now back to 'presence', which in my stupidity I called 'grunt';

You guys have different interpretation than me when it comes to 'presence on the field'. Obviously footy ability and possession is part of it.

Then there is the strong and courageous side, which is take no backward step or be intimidated, which is pretty key to raising the team to consistent winning.

Might be time to poll off between the "A" Demon and the RedBlue Insignia, even though caddy's is the highest polling "White".

The five options are probably muddying the water a bit given the major debate is White v Red. Thoughts?

Nathan Carroll would be the very last footballer I would want young players looking up.

I am not sure what you value in Carroll but if he adds "grunt" on the field then MFC doesnt need him.

He is a spud and we should look to more mature (football wise) and more skillful players who actually add some real grunt and contest on the field.

I didn't say anything about young players looking up to him. It's more about having players with some physical presence on the field, not easily brushed aside.

After Miller, Mclean and Carroll, I can't find any. That's all I'm saying.

Unfortunately too often supporter equate size with strength. This is not always the case. Core strength is far more important than having big 'beach' muscles. It may look impressive but isn't necessarily the answer.

Belzebub59's avatar obviously has no core strength. It is a beach though when you compare it to my missus.

Sobering to think that this nothing club is streets ahead of MFC in the eyes of the AFL. Out with the old, in with the new! Out with the bath water and...oops!

It's clear the Gold Coast Schoolies, West Sydney Mountaineers and maybe even Sydney Swans, are going to suck the funding and talent pool dry over the next 5-10 years minium.

This is the price we pay for a truely national game in areas where marketing penetration is paramount, and the human supporters, well, they can like it or lump it!Technology is such that the crowds can be painted in, anyway.

19,500 attendees to the elimination final, Sydney Swans v Nth Melb.

Give us a break Vlad, Melbourne Football Club blows that away every home game.

Oh yeh, the founding club can f'off.

Paint me up a schoolies crowd Vlad, you [censored].

I am 100% with you. I can't believe some of the people on this site.

I'd rather you be right than me demons06!

He came second in the B+F at 19.

He was tagged mercilessly at 20.

He will be 21 at the start of next year.

He will be at Melbourne at the start of next year. I cannot believe that the hand-wringing on this site has led to "We should trade a promising 20 year old because he struggled being the most tagged midfielder in the worst team in the comp."

Its probably more about what he does when he gets the ball, and the way he does not create open opportunites due to lack of speed and endurance, than the fact he is 'tagged'.

See, I'm of the opinion that when the the players, McLean etc, Buckley (yes Buckley) come back and take the tags, then there may not be a place for Jonesy. Love the guy, just fact. Can't see the skills necessary to go forward.

He's seen the glory, he's told the story

Of battles glorious and deeds victorious

But he will cease now, he is at peace now

Far from these GREEN hills of Tyrol

Because these GREEN hills are not highland hills

Or the Islands hills they're not my lands hills,

As fair as these GREEN foreign hills may be

They are not the hills of home..

God bless you Brad. I think you can still see the glory.

Yeh, nah..

If it said somethin about gettin rid of Vlad, well.... I could get exited. But yeh, nah...

It's not like Waverley Park at all - next to Casey Fields is the closed Leongatha Railway line. The rail corridor already exists, and its just a matter of relaying the tracks, upgrading road crossings and building a station/s.

I'm sure Lynne Kosky will take that on board! And be as effective as she's always been when it comes to public transport. What a little goer she is!

Really it's the same as VFL park; right area, right gowth potential, right market. Sorry, can't get to it, let's pull it down.

No rail; fail!

Lucky it's only going to be a training base for MFC.

Do you really want those people to include Nathan Carroll?

Just want some players, eg, Miller, McLean, and I'm finding few others to add some grunt onfield.

Please name others for me so I can get off Carroll.

This point here is incremental cost. Paying him out, or keeping him is 'a wash'.

If he goes off the list we pay a new kid. What ever that costs is incremental.

Then we lose 'child support'. Our young guns need people to look up to in a football sense.

I doubt the 180cm, 81kg bit. (He looks a lot heavier than that to me. Whelan is listed as 180cm, 84kg.)

First, let me say, I love the way he plays, courageous, hard at it, never stops trying etc. And this year, he became the number 1 mid-fielder after McLean's injury, so he copped the major attention/best opposition.

But, he has basically one speed, and poor acceleration and is (thus?) unable to break tackles. His possessions are only at stoppages; he rarely gets to other contests to crumb/gather as very good mid-fielders should. And his disposal is not good. He just doesn't have an impact on the game.

2009 will be a very important year for him. He must find some real acceleration that allows him to break a tackle (lose weight?). And he must improve his kicking. These 2 a minimum. He was dropped towards the end of the season; on return to the team, I saw no improvement/change in his impact or form.

Years gone by, he would have made a great 'back pocket'; sadly those days are gone.

I originally thought Nathan could be our Paul Chapman, but not any more.

Pretty much everything "mono" says is right IMO.

I would trade (disappointedly) and see how Valenti goes.

After the last couple of games, I would also like the fitness guys to work up Sylvia as a running midfielder, which is what he should always have been.

Depending on results, that may also limit Nathan's future with MFC

I read somewhere a 24 round season which would coincide with NAB Cup sponsorship ending, with no ongoing preseason cup.

Not sure how this would work...