Red and Blue realist

We've got 9 currently, and they might be counting the guys who assist at their VFL team? Always been the argument why the football department spending tax came in, to stop those clubs with loads of $$$ from putting in place a massive system. Of course it doesn't always work but the more resources the better you should be?

No doubt he's a good VFL ruckman, but at 29 I think he'll get overlooked for sure. I doubt any club would want to try and integrate him into a full time system knowing he could only be there for 12 months, and if he came in then the younger rucks won't have the same development opportunities.

I don't mind that idea, such as giving the Tigers our pick 10 and maybe a 2nd next year and then getting their 1st and also the 1st they've got from Geelong and handing that off, if Adelaide get fixated on two 1sts. At least that's what I'd present to Adelaide as the only way we'll come up with the two 1st, they might panic and think there better off just taking 10 and next years 2nd themselves.

King they took on as a bit of a project, in fact I think he came to us with some injury issues they thought might take a while to get right. Given he seemed to take the main ruck position (off pencil) late in the year at Casey I'd think they might be backing him in to be the clear number 2 ruck (if Maxy went down we'd probably go small again) and hope he really comes on. Is it known for sure that Kennedy is out of contract? I can't find any evidence of this, and have a feeling he might have come across on a 3 year deal??

Geelong don't have a first this year, Richmond hold that. Plus Menzel is a free agent. Still don't think we'll give up anything near 2 firsts for Lever, maybe a 1st and 2nd, or 1st and other arrangement.

Would guess that it might be a 1 year deal with a trigger for longer - play 15+ senior games and get a second year sort of thing. Which I think is fair given he was best 25 at the start of the season, prior to the injury and would have played a significant role this year. If he's fit and wants to play midfield then he'll have to really tear apart pre-season, which Maynard will be trying to do similar and hopefully really put pressure on all the other mids to lift their games - can only be a good thing.

We needed the experience at the time, so can only see this as a good trade. Yes long term Adelaide have won the trade, but given the unpredictable nature of 2nd round picks, the next year Pat McKenna was taken at pick 23 - he's now on our list and hasn't played a single game yet. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but we picked up a best and fairest winner who has played over 80 games for us. Think he'll play on next year, but honestly hope he only gets 15 games (max) and he's forced out of the team by younger guys.

The majority of trades get done with picks instead of players, but I can understand why the Crows would throw out the hail-mary trade of Tracc or Oliver. If you look at who's been traded over the last few years in a similar situation, Treloar, TMitchell, O'Meara, Danger and Beams, they've all nearly been done with 1 first rounder and something else (2nd) or 2 firsts but with a something else coming back as well as the player (either pick or decentish player). Most of the suggestions have been pick 10 plus a second this year or next, or next years first plus this years 2nd, or even 2 firsts plus we get Lever and a 2nd or fringe player, I think that'll be the way it plays out. Good on Adelaide for trying to get more, but if they really valued Lever then offer him a decent deal to begin with and he might not have wanted to walk away.

Someone mentioned earlier about moving him forward, I know he's a terrible traditional leading forward, but I'd like to see him trained up to potentially be a taller defensive forward. Some teams have had success manning up on the list of Rance, Hurley, McGovern etc. and I think Frost with his speed would worry those key intercept types, they'd have to stay on him as well as he does have the height that demands a tall rather than a mid size player to go with him. It would be only in certain games (I still think he's best is as a back) but I think it could be worth a try, if he happened to snag a few goals as well even better, but I think they'd come in the Josh Jenkins over the top style rather than out-pointing anyone on a lead or in a marking contest. Would potentially give us some flexibility if we wanted to change things during a game he could go back and then TMac come forward.

Not sure if he gets good mail or just makes a ton of [censored] up

Most important stat was that he played 22 games. I think he slowed considerably in the last 3 or 4 games and needed a rest, but after hearing what he did in his draft year around fitness and endurance I'm sure he'll get to the level we all think he can.

Hard to get a read on that, and I'll be waiting for the "love the place was never going to leave" if he stays or "just wanted to be back closer to family and friends" if he goes. I think his partner might have a lot to do with the decision, but then his younger brother plays with the Crows SANFL team so that might be another consideration. I wonder if he does come, if his brother ends up at Casey?

Adelaide don't really have much of a choice here though, Lever is un-contracted so in theory if he really wanted out he can go via the PSD - he won't - but the salary cap doesn't come into play from Adelaide's point of view, unless he wants to stay. However I agree we need to ensure that getting Lever won't cause the loss of a required player in a year or 2 due to salary cap pressure. We've got Gawn, Tracc, Oliver and Hogan who'll all command very decent coin plus Brayshaw, the Macs etc. who'll also want to be paid reasonably well. Hopefully the club has planned for this and front loaded Jones, Viney, Watts, Hunt and even Hogan now so that if we get Level he's salary just gets absorbed so not to disrupt the team long term.

Hoping is just a related reaction to the surgery he had earlier in the season and not something new to worry about. I do think that of our list the guys who late starts won't be an issue are TMac and Viney, TMac due to his incredible fitness and endurance and Viney because it won't change the way he plays at all, reminds me of how Jelwood can come back in and make a difference after having little to no pre-season over the last couple of years.

That's just wrong, Trenners first 2 years were as good as if not better than Martin and $cully's. Talking to tiger friends at the time and we all agreed that Trenners was the most likely brownlow medalist among them, just had a lot most consistency (less flash) than the other 2. Had it not been for the foot injury he would have played over 150 games, and potentially still captain. His pace wasn't blistering but was more than adequate.

Don't think he's lost the faith of Goody, otherwise he wouldn't have played the last game. I think he just came back to soon from his hammy - he took 2 kicks from outside 50 against GWS of only 2 steps, so had no confidence in himself. This just meant he had a poor couple of games, after a very good first half of the season. His efforts against Geelong and then Richmond were fantastic, he played himself into the ground those games. Would love to see him continue as the second ruck, just to make sure he's involved all the time, and when not doing the relieve ruck play similar to Tom Lynch from Adelaide, making the connection between Def50 and Fwd50, while if feeling he has a mismatch run further forward and see if he can pick up a couple of quick goals. I don't think tying him to a forward pocket or half forward flank is the best option for Watts, he's smart enough uses the ball well enough to let him roam with a view to create as many scoring opportunities as possible.

Like the logic, but doubt West Coast would swap Brayshaw for Gaff - just given the injury history with Gus, I'd say his value is higher to us than what other clubs would value him at, which isn't a bad thing and hopefully he'll reach his potential over the next few years. WC would want some instant replacement and those guys you listed won't give them that, for a player swap they'd want Tracc, Viney or Oliver but we know that's not happening. Came off the back of a twitter rumor from one of the 'throw it at the dart board' journo's I think. We've just taken it and ran.

Doubt Geelong will have the currency to get both though, even if they find the $. They have already brought in a lot of mature players for good picks over the last couple of years. If they went after both (and maybe Ablett) then they'll require this years and next years 1st and probably more, and they'll end up with a massive gap in their playing list - all top end, no middle or developing tier. Might get them close over the next year or 2 but then could fall away horribly with no young talent coming through.

Potentially yes, given he is contracted the Lions will be able to drive a much harder deal. I'm not saying he's worth more, but with Lever is able to say he's going to walk anyway, just get the best deal while someone will have to go to the Lions with a deal they can't refuse. If it worked, I'd still think we'd have to send pick 14 and a 2nd to Adelaide, while pick 10 on it's own would be enough for Schache.

Can't see them satisfying Brissy with a trade, I know they've got 2 first rounders but they'll be something like picks 14 and 16, so might need to trade down to get the pick/s that Brissy might demand. I wonder if we could send pick 10, plus something else to Richmond to get their 2 first rounders, maybe our 2nd this year as well. Then use 2 first rounders, either as a trade (Lever/Gaff etc) and still get a young player - not a huge difference between a player rated at pick 10 compared to pick 16?

Our young depth has been diminished because we've traded away our last couple of 2nd rounders, and also brought forward a 1st to get Weid. On the list those that are under 22 who offer some quality and have been seen at AFL level are - Trac, Harmes, ANB, OMac, Brayshaw, Oliver, Weid, JSmith and Stretch. Those who haven't played yet include King, Flipper, Johnstone, McKenna and Huelett. I don't think it's an issue of not having the kids to be excited about, we've got plenty of those, it's still that middle ground depth we need (at least if we want Casey to be competitive).

Nothing to do with being dropped, lots of rumors involving his ex and another player but that was on the back of Jake not being the most upstanding citizen either. Some suggestions are that he needs to leave to be able to sort out the issues. Not sure if were the place for him, he's not known for his pressure game (he can be great but on a very occasional basis) and hasn't got the tank to move too much further than the Fwd50.

Hoping that is something Gaff also thinks the same thing and tells them it's either trade me this year or I walk next year. With the other players going from the midfield WC might want the pick to accelerate their rebuild now rather than waiting and hoping to change his mind.

Hibberd had just spent a year out of the AFL and had never been in the All Australian team, let alone the squad. He's also only just turned 25, whereas Hibberd played his first game for us at 27.

I think of him doing a job not many of our players are doing at the moment and you could call it 'racking up the cheap ball' but he finds a lot of the footy (takes a fair few marks for a mid too) in the space between the 2 50s. His gut running allows for a better link between the defense and offense, so even though he's not kicking a heap of goals I'd imagine he'd be involved in an incredibly high amount of scoring chains. Gaff not kicking goals seems to be more to do with the Eagles system than anything else, if you look at their goals kickers, only Sheed (11) kicked more than 10 outside of their regular forwards (Kennedy, Darling, Hill, Le Cras, Petrie etc). Whereas we had Jones, Tracc, Melksham, Harmes and ANB who weren't playing in a 100% forward role get over 10. Hopefully it'd be something he could add if he came to us, but doesn't seem to be as vital as the scoring opportunities he'd be involved with.