WRT Watts, he absolutely must go. Some people are writing him off and saying he'll never have the hunger or the physicality to be a great AFL player. I'm not sure about this, but if we keep rewarding him with games on the back of insipid performances marked by a lack of physicality, then he'll never be hungry for a place on the list or have any motivation to improve the physical side of his game.

I must have some problem with my internet. I keep clicking to come to Demonland but it seems to be directing me to the Richmond board instead.

GIVE WATTS A BREAK!

He is not to blame for all our problems, nor will he be the solution to them.

He is a KPP and will take a FEW YEARS to develop. Don't bash him until he leaves and becomes a good player somewhere he gets the support and encouragement a young developing player needs.

That's a little redundant, eh?

We were absolutely pathetic today, but people who are either:

- Saying we can't win a premiership with this list

- Calling for Bailey to be sacked/the entire football department to be cleaned out or

- Saying that Richmond will overtake us

are ridiculously short-sighted and totally absorbed in the "now". We are at least as good as, say, Hawthorne three years before they won their flag. The team our present FD have built would beat the team that ND left us with 9 times out of ten, and is infinitely better placed for the future than that list was. Richmond's form now mirrors ours at the start of the year, they have yet to beat a strong side, and it remains to be seen if they can maintain the rage; I would have our overall performance this year comfortably ahead of theres at this stage. A bit of perspective, please.

Perspective? We've now had a development coach for 3 years, the best of the draft, and improvements in most areas around the running of the club, but have still only won 4 games with probably not many more (if any) to come... Perspective is fine, but it's not limitlessly ongoing.

Perspective? We've now had a development coach for 3 years, the best of the draft, and improvements in most areas around the running of the club, but have still only won 4 games with probably not many more (if any) to come... Perspective is fine, but it's not limitlessly ongoing.

Do you seriously think we havn't improved each year since Bailey took the helm? We are miles better this year than last year, and were significantly better last year than the year before that. Are you honestly surprised -given where we were three years ago- that we are still in development mode? We were woeful, our most important players were passed their prime, and we have pretty much rebuilt our list from the ground up. This takes more than 3 years to do, even with the draft picks we've had.

I'm not saying you should accept todays performance just because we're a young, developing list. It simply wasn't good enough, and there'll be a few players looking over their shoulders for next weeks game, for sure. But it doesn't undo our progress this year or prove that we're the worst side in the comp, or that Bailey is a hack, or any other ridiculously emotive assertion that some people are spewing forth.

As far as your post about Watts is concerned, I'm not asking him to come in and fix our structural problems or be Nick Riewoldt in his second year. I also agree that his best football is two or three years away. But, like anyone else on the list, he needs to justify his place in the side- on present form, he does not deserve a senior game.

You know, years ago there was a system developed to measure if teams were improving and it was called the ladder... Currently we look like we will be last place on that ladder for the 3rd year in a row... So where exactly is this improvement Two Sheds? We have better players than 3 years ago, yet we're still just treading water... Back to reality

what i wanna know is, what was tony shaw smoking and where can i get some????

Can't win in that jumper

I know it won't happen, but the retractions(myself included), will be pretty funny if we get up in the second half.

No laughter in sight.

Bate beaten in the air by Johncock, then made to look silly. god he is average

He was easily our best today. Are we watching the same game?

Bartram should be given the boot - he just gives the opposition too many goals.

Interesting, he had conceded just 5 goals this season before today.

Interesting, he had conceded just 5 goals this season before today.

People talk a lot of [censored] on this site, ay