Adam The God

No. He never gets on the park.

Such a loyal bloke. We don’t know him. He'll see out his contract. The little bloke is all bluster.

Alastair Clarkson's Curse? ? One can only hope.

We shouldn't rest them all at once. I'd say they'll rest a few more next week.

Isn't this an oxymoron? They're depth for a reason.

Look at this play. Viney shakes off Williams and then Cordy a key position player, and then has the vision to see Kozzy and kicks it very deliberately out to the space in front of Kozzy. It's a brilliant piece of play. https://www.instagram.com/p/CRxhF0lHWPd/?utm_medium=copy_link

I've watched Viney carefully at stoppages for essentially the last year, since @Axis of Bob wrote that brilliant post about our stoppage set ups and Viney'sdefensive importance to them, but at this stage I just have to completely disagree. He ball chases. He doesn't trust his team mates to tackle and our midfield is noticeably unbalanced when he's in there. I'd even argue our dip in form as a team has coincided with his return. That's a loads things, but his return has also totally ruined whatever midfield synergy we'd developed over so many successful weeks. I'd take a fresh JJ over Viney as defensive midfielder just about every day of the week. JJ is a brilliant tackler, but is also beautifully clean below his feet and makes good decisions by hand and foot. He also stays within his wheelhouse and doesn't play hero. Viney forward on the other hand, I believe, is a completely different proposition. He overpowers small to medium defenders, even key position players at ground level, and makes good decisions, and his kicking shortcomings (mostly penetration) aren't an issue when he plays high half forward and deep forward 50. I wouldn't rule Jack out of the midfield necessarily in a final, particularly in bursts, but during the regular season I think he can add much more pressure to our forward half (to compliment Kozzy) without creating this bees to the honeypot effect in the midfield and leaving us exposed going the other way. Anyway, each to their own and I can't see them playing Viney permanent forward, but he and we IMO looked a lot better earlier in the season when he was playing more forward than constantly on the ball.

I'm not sure we can know what we're trying to do from clearances with Max's thumping as we're not in the inner sanctum. It sounds like you're saying the midfield is tired, not lacking in confidence. As for Oliver's ball use, I think aside from the Collingwood and GWS games he's been consistently damaging and territory taking with his kicking. That superb pass to Brown the other night was a perfect example. Brown then missed from directly in front 30m out. Not Oliver's fault. I've always thought Oliver has been marked harshly, but this year IMO he's been a model of consistency except for those two aforementioned games. As for Langdon, he looks exhausted. It's also telling that the three guys you first mention have played 90% TOG consistently all year. They look tired to me.

I'd be interested to hear who you're referring to here? If it's McDonald, I thought he showed some good leadership at the start of the third. Took a great contested mark and then converted, unlike most of his team mates. It sparked a comeback. I agree he's not having the same influence and it's probably a confidence thing, but I'm not sure mental fragility has been our undoing. I think clearly tiredness has. It obviously impacts on adherence to structures, concentration across 4 quarters and goal kicking accuracy. If we're a fresher team, we're the best team in the comp IMV. I'm just hoping that the intense loading that Burgess has been putting the players through pays off and at the very end and push for finals, we get a second wind. I don't think we ever 'deliberately' concede clearances, it's just that emphasis is not all down to winning the clearance. Winning a rushed clearance is good for territory but risks interception. Pressing the opposition post clearance heightens the chance we can intercept and get the ball on our terms. It's the Geelong model for almost the entirety of Scott's coaching career. If you look at Richmond, a similar thing. Clarkson's teams didn't always rely on them either. The most important thing is getting the game on our terms and then kicking straight. I've felt in at least the last two weeks in the wet, it's been about taking territory and bombing long to contests. This is a good back up strategy, but we were better when we switched the ball to uncontested players or had Max taking contested marks. As Max's dominance has diminished, we've reverted to 2019 territory, thump it forward, a bit haphazardly. It can work, but if we're just a little bit off defensively like we have been the last fortnight, then it gives the other side a chance. That said, IMV we lost both games due to goal kicking accuracy. Obviously can't know for sure if we'd have kicked on against the Bulldogs, but given they still struggled to score against us for large periods, had we taken our chances, I'd say we run over them.

I think it's clear our game stands up in the wet. We accounted for at least Richmond and Sydney in the wet. IMV, we were off 10% defensively the other night and clearly tired at ground level, which impacted on our cleanness and ability to get the ball moving back our way. Hibberd for example would have shut Bontempelli down earlier in the year, whereas he let him kick two of the easiest goals you'll see unattended. If there's a weak link in the defensive chain (and there were a few the other night- Salem was poor again, JJ was fumbly, where was Jackson, Hibberd fumbled, as did Rivers), most systems won't stand up. I think it's a testament to ours that we managed to get within 4 points midway through the last. IMV, our single biggest problem is goal accuracy and conversion. Even when we got so little out of so many, we were well in the game. Get that right and I think we'll be very hard to beat come finals.

Lol. Have you been on Demonland since? I don't even remember what I said back in May, but given Cody is 4 foot 1 and I'm 6 foot 6, I doubt I'd be coming off second best...

I think we need to seriously rejig our midfield. Why are we persisting with JJ at the moment? I’m not sure how many CBAs he had, but I don’t recall him in there. As for around the ground, he didn’t really seem to attend stoppage. He effectively played the Sparrow half forward role, but looked fumbly and tired. JJ is one of my favourites and his tackling in stoppage and around the ground, as well as his cleanness, was IMV a key reason why our midfield defended so well in the first half of the season. Give JJ the week or two off and get him fresh for the last few weeks prior to finals. Bring in Sparrow and reward his good form this year. I’d keep Gus on the wing with Langdon, but I’d keep Viney as a permanent forward. He can attend stoppage if it’s inside 50, otherwise he should play as a pressure “speed forward”. He’s dangerous around goal with his attack on the ball carrier, it protects his foot for finals (if we want to revert to Viney as a mid, which could well work in finals) and enables JJ to take his place as the defensive mid. Harmes isn’t playing brilliantly, but I prefer him in our midfield to Viney, providing he remembers he’s not Dustin Martin. Take the right option. I think we use JJ and Harmes as our defensive mids and rotate them forward and to the bench. They wouldn't be strictly defensive of course, because both can get it on the outside too and attack from stoppage. Petracca needs to play somewhere between 80% mid, 20% forward IMV. We just don't have the midfield depth to leave it all to Clarry. Speaking of which, Oliver should be in there just about every time. I’d also like to see us use Kozzy more often as an attacking mid from stoppages. And as much as it pains me to say it given how he treated MFC supporters in Sydney last year, and frankly his bruise free form, I think, as you intimate, we need to find a way of getting Melksham’s ball use into the team, so I’d add him very occasionally to centre stoppages as well if we can find a place for him in the team. Who for though??? So centre bounce mids would be Oliver, Petracca, Harmes, JJ, Kozzy and Melksham. Viney should attend forward stoppages as an inside slider or pure defensive mid and Gus should attend defensive stoppages as a width receiver or ground ball get player. Anyone feeling any of this?

Peak beautifully? Sydney murdered them a fortnight ago and the Suns gave them a run for their money last week. But each to their own.

I can't stand most of their guys. Weightman is particularly punchable though. They're building a forwardline of puncuable heads to compliment their midfield of muppets.

They didn't look like scoring for large chunks of every quarter. Basically it was a pattern. We'd dominate them for the first 15+ minutes of each quarter, fail to capitalise on enough of our work and then we'd let them get an easy entry for an easy goal that kept the lead at 2 to 3 goals. We didn't dominate them for 100% of the game, but IMV we dominated them in every quarter for large spells. It was like 2018 Melbourne at times.

Oh and that was one of the least influential 30 possession games you'll ever see from Petracca. Defensively he was nowhere too. And they went to school on Gawn again. They just held onto him prior to every contest just enough to stop him jumping. And since Jackson seems to have fallen off a cliff, we had no plan B that was strong enough to provide Max a chop out or a change up.

Sure, they had Keath out and then Richards down, but we dominated them for 4 quarters and failed to capitalise in front of goal. I just don't rate the Bulldogs. I thought we were, with the exception of Oliver, and a few moments from Viney forward of centre, woeful, but with 10 minutes to go we were 4 points down. JJ takes the mark in the goalsquare and we're in front. But goalkicking has now cost us 4 wins (Adelaide, GWS, Hawthorn and tonight). Brown kicks those gimmes and I think we comfortably overrun them. I was pleased to see Gus back to the wing and Viney forward. Two good moves. Gus started okay, but faded I felt. Whereas, Viney was brilliant inside 50 and his attack on the ball carrier was exactly what we needed there, but it's time to shelve his midfield minutes. It's never been more obvious than tonight. He was a deadset liability at stoppages. He is the key reason our mids are bees to the honeypot. He just mindlessly hunts the ball carrier and completely exposes us on the outside. You certainly can't afford that against the Bulldogs. That's their entire game. Burn you on the outside as they flick it (and I mean flick it) to their receivers. But back to the bees to the honeypot, it wasn't just in the midfield that we failed to trust team mates to get the job done. I thought repeatedly we were done on the outside between the arcs and inside attacking 50, when multiple players swarmed the one Bulldog player, only for them to flick it out to a free Bulldog. We also seemed to take too long to adjust to the wet weather and played too fancy with the handball. We weren't clean either, particularly in the first half. I thought Salem was terrible, not just fumbly, but poor in the contest. Hunt tried hard but his kicking is a real worry. No drive or cleanness from Rivers or Hibberd. As for Brown, you have to wonder whether playing under a roof a lot of the time for North shaded his true accuracy in the midst of inclement weather. He just couldn't handle the conditions. I don't think I can remember seeing him kick so poorly. It's a conundrum because he actually takes marks and gets to the right spots, but if he's not kicking them, is he much better than Weideman? The answer is yes, but it will cost us games and potential finals. We didn't really have any winners forward of centre in the first half, perhaps Fritsch, but our lack of potency in the forward half has become an Achilles heel in the second half of the season, and much of this is down to accuracy. JJ, Jackson and Rivers all really struggled and Kozzy continued to make the easy look difficult, but I did love his pressure and attack on the ball. Tonight though is the first time I've felt we are relying on too many young guys to play important roles. I think it'd be worth resting JJ for Sparrow, Jackson for Weideman and Bowey for Rivers. Maybe not all in the same week but over the next two weeks. I'd much prefer to have some concerns now than come finals, but this evening was bitterly disappointing. Our defensive game was off (leaving Daniel free and then Bontempelli twice is not good enough), but so was our offence. The fact we only went down by what we did says a bit about our system and a bit about the Bulldogs.

Can I just say, the way umpires are officiating the holding the ball rule is a blight on the game. I guarantee tonight we'll be pulling our hair out at the lack of holding the ball.

I have a feeling it might be about Jordon and Viney. They want a pure mid as an inside slider from half forward. Viney did it earlier in the season, as did JJ and now Gus is doing it.

Agree with all that, but Harmes must tag Libba. Let's not get too cute here. Stop it at the source and see if they have another way of winning. As for Vanders, the idea that he should stay in because he's tough doesn't hold up for mine. We could get some tough bloke off the street and that wouldn't make him a guaranteed starter. I've yet to see a worse handballer at AFL level and his kicking is suspect too. I think our system is strong enough now that we don't need a player that is simply tough or sets the tone. Intensity should be a mandatory requirement for all of our players.

You definitely get the sense that the AFL world is a bubble, so it makes sense that some can see the forest through the trees. Players are also often looking for short term success (ie within their playing careers), so naturally go for those who are up right at this moment and appear to give little thought to what that club might look like in 2-3 years. That said, our list has been rated within the footballing community for a while, despite not getting it to click consistently, which is why we've been able to attract the likes of Lever, May, Langdon and to a lesser extent Brown.

Hore was a turnover merchant IMV. A good interceptor, who would then hand the ball straight back to the opposition by foot. Very Tom McDonald when he was a key back. I reckon if Turner comes along a bit in the remaining few weeks of the year, that could spell trouble for Hore. But maybe Marty is an ideal player for the rookie list given his injury history. For the way we play the game, we need a lot of key back depth in case of injuries.

If playing on their home turf, I'd agree

Nah, 1st will play 4th and 2nd will play 3rd. The top 3 will likely be made up of us, Bulldogs and Geelong. It's that 4th spot that's up for grabs.

It's early days yet, but Rowell could be another.