Doggo

I don't normally get too carried away with bad umpiring, but I was seething watching today's game.

I still don't know what those first free kicks of the game were paid for.

Agreed. They (the umpires) really put a stick in our spokes, so to speak, in the 1st and 4th quarters.

Anyone have a stat for goals Sydney scored directly from frees?

Given our year so far why rush these kids back, just to satisfy us the supporters? The priority has to be about getting their bodies right first.

Personally I'm happy for Ricky to only play Sandy seconds for the rest of the year to get him right for rd 1 2009.

In hindsight, i agree with that. As i said, i'm less concerned about Ricky playing 2's than Newton, as he's come off a very long lay-off and a few different injuries. To manage him in the 2's is more than reasonable. My only qualm about it, and i know i probably jumped the gun a bit earlier when i said he should be straight back in the Sandy 1's after just 2 games in the ressies, despite his long lay-off, was because he is sooo much better than that level, even now in the earliest stage of his return. Proof is his BOG from 3/4's of footy in just his 2nd game back.

However, given his circumstances and bad luck with injury, and the running role he plays, as well as Sandys 1st's requiring 22 100% fit players... it is probably best to wait until he can get a decent fitness base and more confidence in his body before playing him in an unrestricted manner in the VFL.

Newton, on the other hand, will be gaining absolutely nothing from playing against sub-standard opposition in the 2's, and not getting any fitter playing there either. He plays as a deep forward, essentially using his height, leap and well-timed, short leads to win the footy. Fitness and aerobic capacity at VFL level, even after missing 7 weeks, should not really be an issue for him, given the deep role he plays and that he has shown himself a more than capable VFL player. He kicked 4.4 and probably could have got a couple more from about 80% ground time, in his first game back thru the ressies, which indicates he must indeed have some 'juice' in the tank. He been around long enough and played at a high enough level to adapt back to the speed and physicality of VFL seniors you'd think. And he had a near full pre-season.

He did miss a lot of footy though, and wasn't in the best of form before he got suspended and then injured, which may be a hint as to why he missed selection. As some have suggested, he might not be showing he's working hard enough, has shown poor attitude and is being 'stung' back into action by being kept down there. He certainly didnt show any work-ethic in his last appearance for Melbourne in R1, but thats another topic altogether.

None of us can really say for sure whats going on behind the scenes and if Sandringham believed it were best to play Newton in the ressies for their own team balance or whatever, then so be it.

I'm still firmly of the opinion that he should have been selected to play for Sandy this week, regardless of whether Sautner is in the side or not. One game playing inferior opposition to gain a bit of confidence back is enough! We need to see if he can really play. You'd imagine if Dean Bailey had any influence in the decision, Newton would definitely be playing VFL this weekend. Not just to satisfy the supporters, but because if we're fair dinkum about Newton becoming a player, he needs to be given every opportunity to show something at VFL level, where he will at least be challenged and can push for selection.

I'd rather Juice came in this week and kicked 2 or 3 goals in the VFL against a strong, mature opponent, then see him kick 6 or 7 in the 2's against some poor kid.

No big deal really if they spend one more week down there. If Juice gets amongst the goals again then promote him. Pettard is really not in a position to be rushed back and far too valuable to risk. Let them have another game and see how they go. If Pettard can play out most of the game then promote him.

Would like to see McNamara as he is a bit of a smokey late in the draft (our last pick from memory).

Less so with Petterd than with Newton, but i just fail to see how playing at that inferior level will benefit them? Especially Newton, who has had a few years in the system now and needs to be challenged. Playing against skinny kids in the VFL 2's is not going to challenge him.

When Sandy play a stand alone team there is a 12/10 rule....possibly why Juice and Petterd aren't named ....

I'm going to contradict my last post now... but, as happy as i am to see guys like McNamara (and Zomer) getting named in the 1's, I'd much prefer to see Juice and Petterd in the VFL senior team, as they are further along in their development and if fit, are close to being best 22. McNamara and Zomer are KPP's a long way off of playing AFL still and have time on their side, but Newton has shown some capability at AFL level in the past, and his career now is somewhat at a crossroads. Would have made much more sense to name him in the senior team as part of the 12/10 rule ahead of the younger guys, wouldnt it?

Yeah i'd take him for a mid 2nd round pick, though if he were to be traded, i'm sure St Kilda would insist on nothing less than a late 1st rounder. Would be a very handy player for us, with at least another 4-6 years left in him.

Not the quickest player, not the strongest body, but has the skill level and poise we're desperately lacking in the middle. A bit like Cameron Bruce in his ball-winning ability, but with the polished skills to top it off.

VERY dissappointed to see Juice and Ricky P not named in the 1st's. From all reports, last week Ricky dominated and was BOG in less than 3/4's, and Juice kicked 4.4 in his first game for 7 weeks. What more did they need to do? :angry: :angry:

On a positive note however...

It's very good to see Tom McNamara finally get a chance at Sandy! I'm glad he's turned his recent poor form around and here's hoping he can cement himself in that side and maybe even push for a game with the Dee's later this year (if we're lucky, or unlucky... depends how u look at it).

I've only seen him play once and I know he was very bottom-age, much like Bate, Dunn and Newton were, so will probably spend the remainder of this year between the VFL 1st's and 2nd's. But i think (and i know i'm not alone), he looked very impressive against Geelong in the NAB cup, and not at all out of place against the big boys. A bit skinny but reads the play exceptionally well, Colin Wisbey had him rated as a top-20 pick in his pre-draft profiles last year i think, but slipped so far down the draft order because of an injury hampered year. His upside is huge as he will probably grow a couple of cm's and gain 6-8 kgs after a couple of solid pre-seasons.

I remember reading a coaches report from Chopper Lovell a few weeks back saying that Tom had been struggling in the VFL 2's, lacking confidence and down on form. Also heard from a mate of mine who is pretty good mates with a lot of people at Sandy FC, that word was Tom had been feeling rather homesick and was seemingly having difficulty settling into Melbourne. It's good to know he's turned it around. I just hope, if or when he comes good, 2 or 3 years down the track, that he doesnt jump ship back home to SA, Scotty Thompson-style...

He looks built for umpiring. lol

Haven't seen anyone as slight as he play for Melbourne since Cam Hunter played a couple of games late in 2003. I think he weighed 68kg when we drafted him.

Not even Cam Bruce was as skinny as Cale when he started out, and he was skinny!

6 - Garland

5 - McLean

4 - Bruce

3 - Bate

2 - Green

1 - Miller

Reckon he could do with a spell at Sandy. Will do him a world of good. At the moment his confidence is shot. These pokey little kicks are not what he's about, or at least on his brilliant U18s form last year. Plenty of time for him yet.

I agree he needs a couple of games at the lower level just to find his way again. He's looked overrawed at times with the pace and physicality of AFL. I think he's gonna be a gun player in time, but at the moment i just dont think its fair to expect him to do consistently well at senior level, especially given his slight frame. I don't doubt his endeavour at all, but physically he's just not ready to stamp himself on the game yet, and his lack of strength can hurt defensively us at times.

Like u said, i've got plenty of time for him, but think it would do his confidence a world of good to go back to the less physical and slower pace of VFL and dominate a few games.

Can someone fill me in as to why playing Frawley at CHF is such a laugh? We have been told Bailey has a knack of developing players (and we've already seen it in action), so why does naming a 193cm developing player sound so silly?

We are obviously looking to the future... lets see what Frawley has got to offer us down in the forward-line. If he doesn't show much, then that's fine... what have we lost from trying? However, if he does do alright... how good would it be in 3-5yrs time knowing that the kid can actually hold his own in the forward-line should we ever need him to be thrown down there because of injury or whatever.

You never learn from the chances you never take.

Good post. I agree.

FWIW Frawley hasn't shown as much in his time in defence as many would have hoped for from a highly-rated junior, specialist KP defender and 1st round draft pick. At times he's been beaten in one-on-one contests a bit too easily, and hasn't looked as natural a reader of the play as Garland and Warnock, who have now overtaken him in that prospective FB/CHB position.

I think that DB has identified young Spud has been struggling in defence, and with the rise of Warnock/Garland, has noted that if Frawley is going to be a player, it'll have to be in a different role. I've read James played most of his junior footy as a backman, but its ridiculous for some people to suggest that at 20, and being a highly rated pick, he has no future in the AFL and is not worthy of playing in the forward line, because he has been poor in the backline. At least try it out, what have we got to lose? With Rivers out i must say it seems unlikely that he will play forward, but if we can't find an immediate match-up for him, i like the idea of trialling him at CHF.

Whether DB is playin coaching mind games or not, we wont know until game day, but I'm happy to see him named at CHF and genuinely hope he's given a chance to play there. One thing that irritated me most during the Daniher years was our inability to find flexible young KP defenders, capable of playing forward or back, because, with the exception of Brad Miller, none of our KPP's have ever had a go playing at the 'other end of the ground'. It's fair to say we haven't had enough quality young talls on our list in the first place to swing them around, but a guy like Frawley who has struggled as a defender at AFL level, is a perfect opportunity for the club to try develop a KP forward and do something different to what has been done in recent times.

Zomer did look very impressive in this clip. Ran very hard and created opportunities out of nothing. Very keen to see more!

Hopefully he can put that together consistently at VFL level and hopefully, just maybe, push for senior selection later this year (Moloney on the LTI list will enable us to do so if we choose).

On the ground YES

off the field and at training don't know what hes like does anyone?

I've met Beamer a few times, seems a real genuine kinda bloke. Is very vocal about his love for the club, and from all reports works as hard as anyone on the track, and harder than anyone in recovery (which unfortunately, he's spent most of his time in during his career). I've seen him at training first hand on a few occasions as well, and he's very vocal and always involved. Along with his hard-at-it, in-your-face attitude in the middle, and a strong imposing body, he has attributes that could translate well to leadership. He'll never ever shirk from a contest, and is guaranteed to put his body on the line and head over the footy every week. Like Viney, Moloney's footskills haven't been of the greatest standard of late, but it never stopped guys like Viney from leading by example. But unlike Viney, whose errant kicking was more brought about by poor technique, Brent has a lovely, penetrating kicking action, and hence more scope for improvement.

Much like Rivers, injury has stopped him from being the consistently good player he has shown he's capable of being. He's got a dodgy shoulder and dodgy groin, and just 25 games in last 3 seasons is not a good result at all. The only thing stopping him from becoming a very good player at AFL level thus far is his body. Until he can at least get some continuity over a couple of seasons, only then can he be considered for a leadership role IMO. No use being a leader if you're not in the team (due to injury).

Hopefully they manage his OP well, so it clears up completely, during his time out with this current shoulder injury. I really hope he can get back, and once back, stay in and play consistently good footy. The footy gods haven't been kind to Beamer so far.

Best of luck to him in his current recovery.

Bruce and Green came from late in the draft and have been around for 8 years now, regardless of what you think about them now.

Bruce was a late pick, but Green from memory was a 1st round draft pick (pick 17 or 18?), one pick before Wheatley in the same draft.

Good luck to him in getting back.

Does anyone know his contract status? I hope the club keep the faith in him, he wouldnt cost much. Knowing Beamer, he loves Melbourne so much he'd probably play for free (or base salary, i'm sure, rather than go to another club)!

It's such an absolute shame for a great bloke who gives his heart and soul to the club every time he plays. Was certainly starting to show more passion after that quarter time spray DB gave him against Freo, and hasn't looked back. It's a real shame because i felt the continuity he had had over the last 6 weeks was starting to pay off and he was getting closer to full fitness again.

He and Riv have got to be two of the unluckiest players in the league with regard to injury.

I expect there are very few games he will dominate in. As long as he is serviceable accountable and at least breaks even against his direct opponent and provides advantage to the team even I will be happy. If he does better than that....great.

There is alot to like about Miller in regard his athleticism, courage and his attitude. I just dont think he has an adept enough football brain to dominate games regularly. He will have his days in the sun but....

Agree 100%.

Consistency is the key for him now, no doubt. He needs to be "solid, servicable and accountable" every week. I've been quite pleased with Miller's output this year, as i've noticed many others have too.

As long as our expectations of Miller are reasonable and realistic, the "Miller-bashing" seen here in the past, will stay in the past.

On the radio they reported that the AFL said it wasn't a head butt, but a clash of heads so he was charged with 'misconduct'!

This is from the AFL web site;

Charges Laid:

Travis Cloke, Collingwood, has been charged with misconduct in that he made contact with his head to the face of Matthew Warnock

Ummm.... you mean, a headbutt!? hahah

Get real AFL... FFS.

I remember Greens pass being from up-field, so I don't think its the same incident I described. My memory tells me Johno's pass off turned into a turnover.

Nope, trust me... i'm definitely right!

Johnson marked 48m out on the boundary with about 30 secs left in the term. He knew his limitations so he centred the ball to the corridor outside 50 to Garland, who marked and kicked to Green, who marked about 40 out. Siren went, Green goaled and kept us in it. Had PJ had the shot, he would most likely have kicked a point. I too would like to see him take more responsibility for a big man inside 50 and have the shot, as he did in a similar situation from the same spot on the ground against Hawthorn (although he missed that one), but believe he made the right decision and execution this time round.

I agree. I particularly remember a mark inside 50 on the flank. Should have had a shot but tried to pass off. Very ordinary. A big man like that can easily make the distance.

He hit that target, which subsequently ended up in Green's goal on the 3/4 time siren.

Against the tide of opinion I thought PJ was way below average today for a player who's meant to be a big imposing presence to the opposition.

He simply didn't do enough in the forward line when given the opportunity - didn't go hard enough at the tackle, didn't go hard enough at the mark on at least three occasions and made poor decisions when in possession within fifty.

By my count, his ineptitude cost us three clear goal opportunities.

I watch PJ, and all our ruckmen, quite closely (every week), and i have to say from what i saw, i disagree with you. All but one of his disposals hit their target and I can think of only 2 occassions where he could have been more competitive or gone harder at the mark when inside 50. Both times, he got his hands to the ball, and although he didnt complete the marks, he wasnt outmarked, and still provided a contest and spillage, but lacked support at ground level.

Also, in the last minute before 3/4 time he took a mark inside 50 on the flank near the boundary, and could have gone back and had a low percentage shot, but quickly squared the ball to Garland in the corridor, who hit Green, who went back and kicked the goal from directly in front. He also hit a forward (one of Green or Sylvia i think) inside 50 with a nice low middle-distance pass from the midfield, but the subsequent shot was missed.

Unfortunately I wasn't at the ground today so i can't comment on his work off the ball, but theres never been any doubt about his work-ethic before, so i'd imagine that wasn't an issue today.

What play in particular did u find so inept?

3. Bode is way out of his depth; way, way out

He didn't look great, but he should be persisted with. Asking a young player to perform on Queen's Birthday and not giving them another chance would be poor coaching.

I thought Bode looked ok in the 1st qtr. Not great, but solid and competitive. But after 1/4 time he completely disappeared. I wasn't at the ground, so i dont know if he was on or not, but i assume he was taken off. The next time i saw him was someway thru the 3rd qtr and his confidence and skill level by then looked absolutely shot. In the end it wasn't a pretty day for Bodey, and think he is probably close to one of the first dropped. That said, it would not surprise me if DB persists with him. His strengths are his good pace and defensive work-rate, and his weaknesses his footskills and decision-making (gee, that sounds a lot like a Clint Bartram, Daniel Bell... or Daniel Ward!). Daniel Bell looks likely to be dropped this week so Bode may well stay.

I think DB might be keen to see more of what he can do in a midfield run-with role, or as he's playing now, on the opposition crumber, in the latter half of the season.

noticed that too. he actually got a lot of clean hitouts that landed straight into the arms of a pie. I would imagine that is something that they will have to work on with PJ and the onballers.

I notice this a lot when i watch Collingwood. Due to the ineptitude of their own ruck division (Fraser is ok at best in the taps, Bryan's ONLY weapon is his long kicking, and Wood is too slight). Their midfielders are very well-drilled at reading and sharking the ball off the opposition ruckman. They rarely rove to their own ruckman, and on the flipside to winning many clearances from the opposition's rucks, don't get too many from their own.

Have seen a lot of the Filth play this year, and it's something i've noticed watching them more than with any other team in the comp in '08... I wonder if it's just me who sees this, or if there's a stat source somewhere on the net for "Most Clearance's/1st Possession from Opposition Ruck Hitouts" to back me up?

there was about 8 mins left in the game... and i dont see a problem with running 1-2 mins down if we can turn the ball over in our attacking 50.... i thought they were zoning to begin with... then they started to man up.

Watched the game on TV today, so had the pleasure of seeing the game clock that i normally would not have had at the ground, up until Ch.10's 5min warning, which came on at the 20min mark. I noticed the runner signal into the forward 50 to go one-on-one with roughly 3 mins left on the game clock (around the 22min mark). A message which seemingly got out to everyone except Sylvia, and one he didnt seem to catch onto until another 45 secs were killed as the Pies played keepings off.

At the time we were down by less than 3 straight kicks and with no more than 2 minutes of actual game time left, one-on-one was an absolute must! A most basic footy principle that everyone else in the team had picked up on. When he finally did man up, we forced the turnover, before eventually having the ball rushed thru. Pies got the ball down the other end from the kick in movement, then Thomas kicked that goal, and it was all over.

Michael Voss pointed it out that he wasn't manning up, yet there he was waving his arms at other guys trying to get them to pick up a man

That looked really bad didn't it. The camera followed him for a good 0:45 secs as he ran around pointing to others to man up, oblivious to the fact he was the ONLY player without a man.

FFS Colin, pull ya finger out...

Maybe we should try him as a defensive counter attack off a HFF ????

I've mentioned this a few times before, but no takers. Bell as a Defensive Forward ?

l reckon he was going alright up until he nearly got his neck broken by Johnson against the filth last year, has played with no confidence since.

That's true that. I almost totally forgot about that!

Many people, including myself i'll admit, have short memories. He was killing it up until that sickening collision.

I really hope he can go back to some great performances in the VFL to regain his confidence, as i dont think he's as bad as is being made out on here.