Monbon

7 minutes ago, Fork 'em said:

Both.

14 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

I'm confused..

Is this thread about Kane Cornes or how [censored] the umpires are??

Yep, both. Why does Final Time mean less obvious Frees are paid? It's nonsensical. So first he complains, then he says he likes it. Sounds like a demented form of masochism to me...

12 minutes ago, daisycutter said:

when you just can't avoid kane {normal first option} you can at least use the mute button

It came up on You Tube. I taut, well, maybe he's found some sense somewhere...in an Irish bog, wherever...

Saw some footage of him highlighting free kicks after free kicks which were not paid - Toby Greene being 'hooked', Daicos pushing a GWS player's face into the surface - what would have been at least a week during the season - and the various Frees where umpires simply forgot they had whistles in Brisbane. I'm with him on this, and then, typically Korny Kane, says, he likes it, it makes it a fast, flowing game...????? Kane, as usual, hot air, bluster and contradiction. 

1 hour ago, bush demon said:

Is that John Lord far left?

yes

7 hours ago, Macca said:

Just a guess but 6th from the right? Johnny Townsend is 80 now.  Ken Emselle is 79 ... in the back with the dark hair?

Yep, on the right hand side of Ron Barassi, Hassa to Ron's left...

7 hours ago, Jumping Jack Clennett said:

Who is that in the dark glasses?
Is my hero, Donny Williams there?
Come on WJ…….you knew most of these guys!

Don Williams died in 1995. My grandson's other defacto grandfather ran a business with him.

2 hours ago, george_on_the_outer said:

1964 Premiership side.avif 127.94 kB · 18 downloads

Thanks: I have the photo: I've recognized Bernie Massey - I think, but what I would like is a list of their names, as they appear in the photo...

On the Melbourne Football Club site above Dixon's piece about Barassi, there's a photo of most of the 1964 Premiership players, all of them now old men. I can only recognize Barassi, Hassa mann, Dixon, Lord, Townsend and Barry Bourke. I'd love to be able to place the others. Can anybody help?

The bottom line is that when these two great players re-signed nobody could know that injury would plague them. There's no use blaming anyone for this sad outcome. It's simply bad luck, 'in the lap of the gods' stuff. I'm sure things will sort themselves out because the bottom line is that this club is now in capable hands.

12 minutes ago, Swooper1987 said:

I think Rohan Connolly is an outstanding footy journo.  He provides a sense of real balance in his latest piece for ESPN.

https://www.espn.com.au/afl/story/_/id/38395193/afl-finals-rohan-connolly-where-next-melbourne-demons-port-adelaide-power-straight-sets

Rohan the Man is a plagiarist. It is word for word - or its gist - what I wrote: but I forgive him, because in the end, what he and I wrote is not rocket science.

It's worth Melbourne and Port Adelaide fans pondering that as they pick over the entrails of their team's defeats. Because I'm not sure the level of angst about either necessarily matches the reality of their position. Particularly when it comes to the Dees.

ESPN/Getty Images

Of course, the Demons shot themselves in the foot in not just one but two finals, losing both by a combined total of just nine points having booted a collectively ridiculously wasteful 16.28. But you also need a bit of luck on your side to win premierships, and this season Melbourne had precious little, particularly near goal.

Tom McDonald and Ben Brown were injured, out of sorts, or both. Then Bayley Fritsch got hurt. Then, just as Melbourne appeared to have crafted first one, then a second more-than-adequate back-up plan in attack with Harrison Petty and Jake Melksham, they suffered season-ending injuries. And just to rub salt in the wound, young gun Jacob van Rooyen got suspended.

Even then, the Dees still managed to find goals in their two finals out of Fritsch, Kysaiah Pickett and Joel Smith. Even then, they managed 18 scores to Collingwood's 15 in the qualifying final and 26 to 18 against the Blues.

But the repeated disruptions to any sort of continuity of structure simply had to take a toll. On both efficiency and conversion. And Melbourne still was oh-so-close to winning either game. In fact, I'd go so far as to suggest had even one, let alone both Petty and Melksham stayed upright, the Dees might very well have ended up premiers.

On that basis, while the hand-wringing about Melbourne potentially squandering a golden era is understandable, I think it's completely over the top.

The Demons were still a healthy enough sixth for points scored this year and defensively were ranked behind only St Kilda. They were ranked top six in five out of six midfield categories and were close to the best in the business in terms of occupying territory.

They had the second-most experienced games average in but were still youthful enough, with a handful of clubs still older and with more over 30s. They got valuable experience into the likes of Van Rooyen and Judd McVee, and even now-experienced premiership players like Trent Rivers and Tom Sparrow took steps forward.

Yes, another key forward should be a priority. But that may well be all that is needed for Melbourne to continue to push for a premiership for some time yet.

12 hours ago, BaliDemon said:

Yeah not sure Hinkley provides a strong supporting case for any argument. The bloke has been at Port for what 11 years (?) for zero grand final appearances? Probably lost more finals than he's won? I'd say there's more than injury excuses going on there. 

I’m by no means a Goodwin hater. Extremely grateful for the 2021 flag but I’m firmly on the side of the fence of this list being a Golden Generation for the MFC. Like Carlton in the mid 90’s and Essendon of the early 2000’s, if it only produces the one flag I’ll be slightly disappointed. I think a fair few other supporters will be, too. 

Goody isn’t Clarkson or Hardwick or Matthews. He isn’t beyond questioning. I still find myself doubting his team selection a little too often, his in-game slowness to react a bit too frequently to be absolutely certain he’s got the Midas touch that those aforementioned coaches had/have. Only the very best coaches win 2+ premierships. 

That all said, I hope he does go on to achieve greatness for the Dees. He’s earned the right to give it a red hot crack for the next three seasons. Unless things go absolutely pear shaped I’ll be supporting him but I still reserve the right to question. No need to be sheep-like and clap everything he does.

Agree: then again, there's also no need to blame him for every twist of fate either...

1 hour ago, BaliDemon said:

For me, we kind of went out in straight sets the previous Thursday in that loss to the Pies. Pretty much all the marbles were on the line in that game and we came up just short. Geez we had some bad luck going in with those injuries to Melk and Petty, then Brayshaw getting KO'd in first quarter. Losing Gus was a lot more critical to that loss than we care to admit.

Carlton will get pumped at the Gabba this weekend and in all likelihood so would've we. Our forward line was never going to be good enough to win three tough finals after losing week one. We were pushing excrement up hill from the moment the final siren blew in that Qualifying Final.

I'm actually proud of the boys for the way they battled across the two games. Yes, we torched a truckload of entries and our forward craft was comical at times, but we all knew this was going to be our Achilles Heel heading into the season. ‘Gawndy’ was worth a punt but TMac and BBB? C'mon, let's get real. They were both cooked 12+ months ago. Not at all sure Chandler is up to it either. He was dreadful in both finals and generally poor after about round 8. We need upgrades on all of those guys.

Plenty of scope for optimism, though. We finally get to use the Luke Jackson picks to help address the issues in attack, as well as add some high-quality kids at the pointy end of the draft. That's a luxurious position to be in for a side that finished in the top four. To my reckoning we're still well in the hunt for another flag over the next two or three seasons but it is contingent on absolutely nailing this upcoming draft/trade period. A combination of experienced role players and youngsters who can have an immediate impact is definitely the way to go, rather than pile all eggs in the Harley Reid basket. That's not where we're at as a club. Leave that to North and the Eagles to squabble over.

The only question popping up time and again in my mind though is ... is Simon Goodwin good enough to become a dual or even triple premiership coach? He kind of rode the coattails of Roosy’s groundwork to win the 2021 cup but now it's on him to come through with a second one entirely in his own right. Going to be a lot tougher and he's going to have to be a lot smarter and cleverer with the methods and strategies he deploys in-game (and at selection) in order to achieve it. Like everyone, I hope he's the man but there's been enough questionable decision making in the box over 2022/23 to suggest there are a few doubts there. It's up to Goody now to prove the knockers wrong. "Double straight sets exits" is some sticky mud to wipe off.

 

 

I agree with your first four paragraphs. When you then go on to question Goodwin spoils it for me. The bottom line is that under him, Melbourne has played in finals in 2018, 2021-2023. You nailed why we failed this year but in the end, a coach - as Hinkley pointed out yesterday - has to deal with the injury hand he is dealt. I've read in these pages that West Coast had 3 All Australians out during their Grand Final win in 2018. Yep, maybe so, but they were obviously able to cover them with what was in their tank. We lost our main forwards for parts - the crucial parts- throughout the year, and just about every week was another period of adjustment. In other words, the crucial aspect - continuity- was not on the agenda when the Injury Gods consistently made decisions to send us back to square one. It's no excuse, as they say, bad kicking is bad footy, but had we the luxury of having the same luck with injury our backline had up forward....

23 hours ago, Roost it far said:

Keep swinging champ, you might land one eventually 

I don't 'swing', just for your info. You do understand you come across as a pompous know-all, don't you? 

54 minutes ago, Roost it far said:

Keep swinging champ, you might land one eventually 

Are you related to The Little Red Rooster?

2 hours ago, chook fowler said:

Not a great weekend for the Club. So good to see him return to the fold in recent years and that he got to enjoy our 2021 premiership. 

His return is not so recent. I was working part time hours in Acland Street Cellars in early 2006. In walks the mighty Mister Barassi. He brings a bottiglie to the counter, I confess my allegiance, my adoration of the way he played, the number of times I had the privilege to watch him play, asked how he fancied our chances in 2006 - the same question I had asked David Neitz the week before -  and as he left the shop, he turned to me and smiled and yelled, Go Dees.

10 hours ago, Roost it far said:

Last night felt inevitable, I’ve never seen us be so undisciplined, make so many crazy errors, ignore team mates in better positions and generally gift a lesser team a ridiculous win. I really hope Carlton win or go close against Brisbane as maybe that might rub in what we just blew.
We need some fresh eyes in the coaching box…I’d be offering Justin Leppitsch whatever it takes to come on board. We need a replacement brewing for May, another forward and some elite ball users. I really hope Woewodin and Howe can replace one or both of our wingers. Langdon has fallen off a cliff and Hunter, while serviceable needs upgrading. If TMac and Brown remain on the list I’ll cry and we need to find Max some help. I still think we have an excellent list and I’m bullish for the next few years but jeez the last 2 weeks hurt. Onwards and upwards. Go Dee’s…..and remember gifting finals to your enemies is supposed to hurt.

I guess my one worry in this homogeneous world where everything is seen as a transaction is do the players really really really want it. Would they walk over coals for each other and success. Or is making pasta on your socials and shaving your balls enough. That’s the question that concerns me with this team. 

Re hurting the enemy: you no doubt saw the result of Christian's Pontifications today: 3 Demons fined, Pickett suspended for bumping poor Crippsy, a bump that slide due to momentum and size discrepancy onto poor Cripps's nose - what was described as recently as last Wednesday as a Football Act. And, instead of Mc Govern being fined for staging, Pickett gats fined for 'Rough Play'. 

I ask, Your Honor, what is your point?????

4 minutes ago, Half forward flank said:

I had all nine players gone also with a Salem trade my tenth

I'd keep Tomlinson...

2 minutes ago, Superunknown said:

This club needs to rapidly, and forcefully, indicate to the afl how we won’t be going to Geelong for the next 20 years and now the Maynard Potemkin show trial was wholly disgraceful

 

why are we so meek and keen to be the good corporate citizen. Collingwood doesn’t do this. Why should we

Blaming luck is an easy way out. 2 absolutely wrong ARCs against Carlton , continually shoddy umpiring. And the games we lost with the disgusting sub standard kicking - that’s not luck

 

I’ll give you the injuries though 

where’s the depth cover ?

AS I wrote, yes, we are the pawns of the AFL: witness Pickett getting a week for a bump to  Cripps which connected with his shoulder, then, yes, I know, Cripps turned, Pickett's shoulder continued  and poor Cripps's nose was affected. It was called once a Footy Action...

As far as Depth Cover and I alluded to this - we have that aplenty back of centre, but it's hard when the depth cover for the loss of McDonald, Fritsch, Melksham, JRV, Petty, Brown, and earlier in the year, Smith, was Schache...

And I totally agree about the Geelong Bull...t.

14 minutes ago, BDA said:

4. Burn down the MCG

5: Land on the moon - resurrect Kubrick.

All of these post mortem/coach/tactic blaming posts miss out on the biggest factor around, and it ain't Max. I'm talking about the sheer perversity of the element called LUCK. Luck is involved in the Injury list. Just examine the players who luck slaughtered at crucial stages this year:

Gawn

Oliver

Melksham- just when we needed him.

Fritsch

Brayshaw   -  the  unluck in his case to be brutally assaulted by Maynard

Salem early season blues, struggled to get back to his best...

McDonald - again.

B.Brown

Petty

Smith early in the season

Okay, the arrow of injury slaughters many sides but the bottom line in the Demons case is that despite all these setbacks - note well, most afflicted were the forwards - we finished Top 4, 2nd year in a row.

Therefore, the Doomsday Desperadoes who dwell on woe to woe, who want every coach replaced most of the time, should remember that in the end, on that last game in September, there can only be one winner. To cast the rest to hell for 'Failure' is my idea of a Utopian Hell. 

Sure, our list needs to be strengthened. We seem to have a surfeit of more than capable defenders - some fine Casey backline regulars must be cursing their lack of opportunity - and, it has to be said, we have made some recruiting blunders on the one hand - Grundy comes to mind - but here also, some of the recruiting tosses of the coin - Ben Brown comes to mind - seemed to be well-fated and ended in despair for both parties, but all in all, the recruiting team have handed us some genuinely talented players and their success ration is way in its favor - Hibberd, Melksham, May, Lever, Langdon, Hunter from other clubs come to mind - and look at the backline talent they've assembled. 

So, stay positive, ladies and gents, and pray to the God who dispenses injury woes.

It must also be said that it is obvious we are not in the good books of the AFL Masters, witness the MRI farces which they present as 'justice' for a start. And, also, keep in mind, the factor the luck of the draw in umpiring decisions has made on some of our games. I cannot bear to watch the replay of yesterday's match, but I have noted the howls of 'WE was robbed' from some of you.

Wid a little bit of luck, I am 173 years old now, toodle pip, see you all next year.

On 9/14/2023 at 8:53 AM, Roost it far said:

Can we please not have threads about him

You are very specific about what threads we should and shouldn't have or follow. It shows a certain character trait, quite the opposite of mine , i.e. live and let live. Let the reader choose...

28 minutes ago, The heart beats true said:

Don’t be sucked into this conversation. This is the argument being made by people drawing parallels between things that don’t exist. It’s not logical to assume that if the AFL suspended Maynard they would have to suspend anyone attempting a mark. 

The ball in dispute, in the air, is significantly different to a player moving passed the ball and cannoning into a player.

 

Great reply.

31 minutes ago, tiers said:

There is no denying that EJ played it tough but he was no thug and, when needed, could play the game as well as anyone. I was once fortunate, in a state game at the MCG, to see him play probably the best game I have ever seen by any player in my time (except for the incomparable Robbie). He was that good.

Like most true champions, he would have been able to adapt to today's rules and still be able to dominate.

He personally delivered a budgie I had won in a contest - you had to guess what time the 6.30 Pm TAA flight would actually land - I rang the airport a week before and asked them and they said 6.30, that's what I wrote and won - and the budgie did nothing but poo in its cage until I mercifully let it escape when I turned to cage upside down and the gate slid down as I tried to de-poo it - and I spent most of my youth arguing with Brian Enever about who was Mister Football. He said Ted Whitten. I said Ron Barassi. 

I never forgave EJ for delivering that budgie...

This is very relevant:

20 minutes ago, Roost it far said:

 

So the game will need to continue to adapt to avoid head traumas to players. A rule change  to stop the Brayshaw incident is likely in the off season. How does the AFL intend to deal with such a case without looking at the incidents of high marks causing head trauma. I realise they are 2 distinct cases and not related except in their ability to cause injury. 

• How can the AFL say and make rules to stop concussions in tackles, bumps and smothers but leave open the ability to cause concussion when going for a mark? Whilst I understand there is inherent risk in playing, player welfare is rightfully being taken very seriously. In fact I’d say the AFL are about 10 years behind on this but that’s unsurprising. The high mark is a beautiful feature of our game so what needs to be done to firstly keep it and secondly try and make it safe?
  For me it feels almost impossible to legislate all concussions out of the game considering the way the game is played. Is the high mark seen as the same as any 2 or more players competing directly for the ball where an injury may happen incidentally? Are coaches going to train defenders to avoid putting themselves at risk by not backing into packs? Do forwards need to almost “be careful” when jumping for the ball?
  Do we simply play a sport that is inherently dangerous and thus not only do we need to keep making it safer but we also need to invest heavily in player welfare and past player welfare? Will we get to a point where a player with X number of concussions is no longer allowed to play the game and the club receives a draft pick to replace the player. Is concussion protocol going to be extended to 4 weeks? 
  Over to you guys……

 

For a start, 'going for a mark;, unless it's in the T.Greene category where you stick your boot studs into the face of an oncoming player, is a legitimate 'footy action': in other words, you are 'going for the ball'. It is, of course, a 'unique' aspect of Aussie Rules and I recall my father - who was a terrific athlete, a soccer player -trying to come to grips with this aspect of our game. Yes, there can be 'collateral damage', but when all is said and done, it is not all that common that players inflict serious injury when flying high in the sky, as they say: and most of the damage is done because of the impact to the upper back, and, let's face it, few players are able to jump that high that the heads of the other players becomes an issue.

That's one consideration anyway. And, for the record, I don't see how it's relevant to what Maynard did. In other words, a lot of Maynard excusers bring up the 'Speckie' aspect as though it is in any way connected. It's the height of casuistry.