titan_uranus

This whole "backline leaks like a sieve" thing is a classic Demonland myth, we saw it last year too. We're currently 9th for points against, could drop to 10th depending on what Collingwood scores tomorrow. Our percentage is still over 100% despite being 2-3 so the scoring isn't that big of a problem. The real issue is that we dominate general play for longer than our opponents but we don't convert that dominance onto the scoreboard. If we fix this problem, which comes from more efficiency in the forward half, many of our other "problems" such as this leaky sieve which doesn't really exist will be solved too.

Horrendous call, bing. Absolutely horrendous. If you're looking for someone to drop for Lewis, I could name about 18 players who go before Jetta.

If we're right in suspecting that he's been carrying a hip injury all year, the question has to be asked as to why he was picked this week. It could be because he's captain and we can't/won't drop him if he says he's right to go? Not sure, just speculating. But IMO he shouldn't be playing right now.

What is? Because Tom has conceded a lot of goals? He was actually good tonight, if you remove your anti-McDonald bias (just like ADC and others pot Hogan for the absolute wrong reasons). Having said that, I don't necessarily disagree with you that we could use another key defender.

I'm certainly not saying Pedersen is going to dominate in the ruck, far from it. However, to be fair to him he's much fitter this year than in previous so if he's ever going to improve, this will be the year. The issue with King is he's had, what, one VFL game since coming off a knee reconstruction. If we didn't have the injuries we wouldn't be considering him being selected for weeks, if not months. I don't like the thought of skipping his development just to stick him in the side because we're not confident in Pedersen (or Frost, or OMac, or someone else) when it could do more damage to a body that probably just isn't ready for AFL.

Also has anyone else mentioned that Cotchin is a dog?

I wasn't sure what Goodwin was going to say after the match but I'm pretty happy with this part of his response: "It's a tough balance as a coach. You sit here and you're so proud of the way they played, and the way they fought, and the way they scrapped and the way they gave everything they had for a large part of that game," Goodwin said. "But I reckon when you become a really good team you actually find a way to get the result you need. And we're not at that point yet. We still need to have more composure at the end of quarters and stop the opposition scoring better." He's right on all this, I think.

Fox showing the stat in the first place was pretty dumb (although to be fair who knows what they said about it, could have defended TMac). Dazzle trying to use it to make some sort of argument against TMac is laughable, though. Absolute garbage from him.

Rance is on that list, so presumably you think he's no good too?

I get what you're saying but I don't agree that we're a certainty to get smashed with Pedersen in the ruck. There is also the rest of the game we need to consider and if Mitch King isn't ready for AFL football then we simply cannot play him and we have to make do with what we have. I'd prefer a fit and in-form Pedersen over a not-fit or not-in-form or not-ready King, essentially.

What a shallow analysis. Each team's forward halves were vastly different. Our was clogged as a result of Richmond getting numbers back. Theirs was open as a result of the same thing. Hogan had Rance on him, poor delivery and no support. Riewoldt had a mix of Frost and TMac on him, better delivery and at least a modicum of support. Hogan was also being held more often than not - I don't agree one bit with his continual playing for frees and sooking when they don't come, in fact I find that pathetic, but he was held a lot tonight and that doesn't help.

6 - Hibberd 5 - Oliver 4 - Hunt 3 - Watts 2 - Jetta 1 - Petracca

Thought his first quarter was the best he's played all year. But he was getting his hip worked on when he was on the bench and he disappeared after QT. I think, without knowing for sure, that he's been playing with soreness in his hips all year and it's showing, as he's just impacting games nowhere near the way he is capable of, regardless of the stats.

Smith and Spencer will be out. Viney and Jones must be questionable. Viney was ineffectual after quarter time. Petracca surely also doubtful. I'd drop JKH even if all three of the questionable players have to go out. Find someone else, I don't care who. Tyson, Harmes and ANB will all get another game because there are just too many injured players to go out before them. Lewis, Pedersen and Bugg should all come in. Nah he's right to be peeved. Neither JKH nor Smith showed sufficient VFL form to get a game and whilst Smith didn't get the chance to show it, JKH did and proved us right and the FD wrong. It's time to reward the players in VFL form rather than continually pick the players the FD/Goodwin seems to think are the "future" or whatever, and that was the case before tonight. Pedersen should have played (might not have changed the result but it's true nonetheless).

That's the main negative. Has been all season (bar the St Kilda game, I suppose). He was on the bench for 8 minutes because he was injured. Shouldn't play next week, but I suspect he's the kind of player who will pretend things are OK. It's hurting the team. He has had a terrible start to the season and we're paying the price. This is complete and utter tripe. Hogan gives you fair evidence to have a crack at him over - the sooking for free kicks is simply not good enough and I hate seeing it from anyone, let alone someone who should know better and had just come back from a 2 week suspension. But he spent all night leading up and down the ground, repeatedly. Searching leads up to half-back which were frequently not rewarded, then cutting across into the open side of the ground to make space. Posts which suggest otherwise are just garbage.

Boy there is some absolute dross being posted on here tonight. There's no doubt the injuries cruelled us. We were two down on the bench but Jones, Viney and Petracca were all injured and stayed on the park. It was 17 vs 22. Also, does Richmond have a single player missing due to injury? It was best 22 vs not close to best 17. The fourth quarter was nothing other than a byproduct of the players having given it 100% all night and running out of energy. The fact we were still in front with 5 minutes to go says volumes about how good we were. However... We should have been way, way more than 20 points up at three quarter time. IMO we lost this game in the first quarter, not the last. That first five minutes, the ball didn't cross into Richmond's forward half, yet we had nothing but 3 points on the board. We should have been 20 points up at quarter time and 40 points up by three quarter time, which would have made the fade-out in the last quarter manageable. This is the story of our season. I think we've been the better side for longer in all 5 of our games, but when we are on top with momentum we aren't scoring goals, whilst we concede too many when the momentum isn't with us. So we end up playing better football, for longer than our opponent, but losing 3 games. Of the 17 fit players, a few of them were passengers, none more so than JKH. An absolute waste of space and I refuse to believe that he met any "KPI" that was satisfactory. Yes, rusty after 1.5 years out but no, tonight was not good enough. As for the positives, HIbberd was incredible, Oliver again a beast, Hunt is a gem, Watts was superb, Jetta is one of the league's premier small defenders, and I thought Melksham and Vince both played their best games for the season (says a bit more about the first few than tonight). We are one of the better 2-3 sides I've seen in recent years (and Richmond possibly the worst 5-0 side) but at the end of the day it doesn't matter. There is sufficient evidence to say we should have won all 5 games and that's why it is reasonable to be upset with the 2-3 start, despite the circumstances.

They have, without a doubt, the biggest bunch of bandwagon supporters of any club. I reckon at least 30,000 of that 71,000 just signed up to enjoy the success.

That stat doesn't mean anything without more. Such as: I agree with your final point that Pedersen provides something structurally that benefits the team. I don't think things are right with Hogan, Watts and Weideman/Smith, especially when Watts is in the ruck.

I shouldn't need to explain this, but whatever: There's nothing to establish any link between Pedersen playing and the increased wins.

Dr Peter Larkins was on 3AW earlier this afternoon and said Martin still needed to train today and be assessed tomorrow to see how he's recovered. He also said he was leaning towards him not playing, rather than playing. Take that how you will.

Also on the topic of these "KPIs" no one knows about, surely Pedersen, in slimming down considerably over the off season and starting off at Casey winning an absolute stack of the ball must be working on at least two of the "KPIs" the club has set him?

Except for the total lack of any relationship between the two facts. Watts also makes a much better forward. But that's the issue for me - when Watts is out of the forward line, we rob our forward line just to have someone sit in the ruck. Pedersen could play Smith/Weideman's role, not add much less than them (and no, for the record, he won't add much more either), but by rucking that prevents us from having to ruck Watts when we should be playing him as a permanent forward. And as you've said, it's not like Watts is so much of a better ruckman that it's noticeable.

I'm sure there are KPIs we don't know about that players like Smith and JKH are meeting and Kent and Pedersen are not meeting. But when there are repeated instances in the first 5 selections of a season where large portions of the fanbase are taken by surprise and where decisions don't appear to align with the evidence available, it's wholly unsurprising that the result is a lot of critiquing. IMO the balance is not yet right (not in terms of talls v smalls or inside v outside, but in terms of personnel).

Maybe he will, but right now he's giving us absolute donuts in the side. I don't believe he is the best fit option for that spot in the side right now.

I'm not writing Sydney off until their bye. Their next five games are against Carlton, Brisbane, North, St Kilda and Hawthorn. If they're 5-5 at the bye, they're not done with.