Demonland

I thought you meant the far fight of the entire banner. But yes you are correct it is on the right side of the "Demonland Logo".

Quick poll: Dawes or Frawley? Preference.

Colin Garland is making a big challenge to Nathan Jones' supremacy over the past 18 months: PROGRESS VOTING ROUND 13 108. Nathan Jones 103. Colin Garland 74. Matt Jones 55. Jeremy Howe 43. Colin Sylvia Dean Terlich 40. James Frawley 39. Jack Viney 26. Jack Grimes 24. Aaron Davey 23. Shannon Byrnes Michael Evans 21. Tom McDonald 16. Max Gawn 14. Chris Dawes 12. James Magner Jack Watts 11. Luke Tapscott 8. Mitch Clark Jack Trengove 6. Lynden Dunn 5. Cam Pedersen 4. Jordie McKenzie Jake Spencer 3. Mark Jamar Dean Kent 2. Rohan Bail Mitch Clisby David Rodan 1. Sam Blease Jimmy Toumpas

I'd really like to see "no change" one day but surely Frawley comes in this week.

We'll never know and actually, this thread is rather nonsensical. Craig's in the chair till the end of the season and we can also discuss that issue further on the POST MATCH DISCUSSION thread because this one's going nowhere.

Game over all right and we can discuss this on the POST MATCH DISCUSSION thread.Thanks folks!

A CHILL WIND IN DEMON HELL by George on the Outer The perseverance of football fans in Melbourne was tested to the limits again by the AFL when they scheduled a 4:40 game on a Saturday night in the depths of winter. They might complain about the lack of fans attending MFC matches, yet the same number (28K) turned up as against ladder leaders Hawthorn a couple of weeks ago. Perhaps they should look a little more closer to home as to why numbers are down, or do they have the same diabolical plan as they have perpetrated against Melbourne in store in the coming years for St. Kilda fans? The game itself wasnt much of a spectacle, and with 27 errors to EACH team at ¾ time, this was a fair indication of the quality of player capabilities of both sides. More importantly, neither side seemed capable of capitalizing on those errors to create a decisive advantage. Imagine such consequences if the opponent was Hawthorn, Sydney or Geelong? If it were not for a simply appalling opening by Melbourne, the game would have been far more of a contest, as once again, the players failed to concentrate on the simplest of things and show some genuine commitment until it was all too late. Once that happened the heads dropped and with the exception of Nathan Jones, Tom McDonald and Col Garland, going through the motions was the order of play. A new coach usually foreshadows some sort of revival, and for a time there was evidence of the old Adelaide defensive style being implemented courtesy of Neil Craig. That probably wasnt a bad thing as Melbourne were 42 points down in the first half and heading for another 15 goal shellacking. So if there was something to be gleaned from the game, perhaps this was it. Fans would have been pleased with the performance of Sylvia in the first half, but only saw a return to the half-hearted efforts in the second. Was Shannon Byrnes on the ground at all? He must not have been, given his contribution. Did Jeremy Howe trouble the doorman with his pass this week? Again nothing seen to have any effect for the team or on the game? Dan Nicholson continued his appalling lack of ability with another fluffed chance running into an open goal, bringing his season total to 1 goal 10 behinds from this precise scenario. And can we please have Jake Spencer left at Casey? One single kick for the game and more hit-outs delivered directly to opposition mids than his own is not what a ruckman is meant to do. It was only when McEvoy was subbed off at half time, that he was sighted. The team didnt score a goal in the first half while he rucked, while at least Fitzpatrick was able to direct the ball more to advantage in the limited time he was given. Until we get 18 players on the field who are 100% committed 100% of the time, we will never achieve the style and capabilities of teams like Hawthorn or Geelong. Each and every contest should be critical, but as mentioned previously, Garland, McDonald and Jones are the only ones who demonstrate this. Unfortunately Chris Dawes wasnt able to join this group after being felled behind play in the 3rd quarter, with a St. Kilda player due to front the MRP as a certainty. You can go into a game carrying a couple of players, but we already have first gamers like Clisby ( fine effort for a first up game ) alongside a bevy of first season rookies. When supposedly experienced players shirk their responsibilities we are left with probably a dozen putting in the required effort. Small wonder the results are what they are ... If nothing, this game proved that it wasnt Mark Neeld who was the problem. It is simply the cattle on the paddock. The end of season clean out that he promised is going to happen regardless, and probably with similar numbers to last year. Those who think they can top up their superannuation like others have done in the past at the MFC will be sadly misled. It was a chill wind blowing through the MCG on a wintery Melbourne night, but it will be an even colder wind for those sinners who keep creating a Demon Hell for their long suffering fans in the outer ... Melbourne 3.0.18 5.4.34 7.5.47 10.9.69 St. Kilda 7.2.44 10.3.63 15.6.96 16.8.104 Goals Melbourne Howe Watts 2 Blease Byrne Dawes Fitzpatrick Jones Kent St Kilda Riewoldt 3 Koschitzke Ray 2 Armitage Dempster Dennis-Lane Geary Jones Milera Montagna, Ross, Stanley Best Melbourne Garland McDonald Sylvia Terlich Clisby Jones. St Kilda Montagna Ray Steven Riewoldt Dal Santo Roberton Injuries Melbourne Nil St Kilda McEvoy (concussion) Changes Melbourne Nil St Kilda Sam Fisher replaced by Brodie Murdoch Reports Melbourne Jake Spencer for rough conduct against Ben McEvoy (second quarter) St Kilda Nil Umpires Dalgleish McInerney Ryan Crowd 28,751 at MCG.

6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1 ... please

I dare anyone to look at Jack's expression and tell him he doesn't deserve to be on there. For me he gives more effort than most of the other players.

A mate sent me this and it got me thinking about what could have been. What's done is done but who knows how things would have panned out in the alternate universe.

Are you sure?

http://www.afl.com.au/afl/stats/player-ratings/overall-standings#club/CD_T90 According to the AFL Player Rankings we only have 2 players in the Top 100 of the competition and only 5 in the top 200. The ratings are further explained here: http://www.afl.com.au/stats/player-ratings/ratings-explained

The whole time WYL was having his insulting little whinge he failed to notice the little Easter Egg that had been left. In fact no one has noticed or mentioned it.

i can't see him on there.

Correct, in 1991.

It was a misty night in early September, 2006 when Melbourne last beat St. Kilda before 67,528 people who came to the MCG for an elimination final. The rain began to fall as half time began and those hearts that beat true for the Demons were downcast as their team, in arrears by 20 points (it could have been worse had they not scored the last goal of the second quarter), trudged slowly into the rooms. It would take a champion effort to turn things around. The effort came in the form of a sensational last half by the team led by youngster Brock McLean (in his 46th AFL game) who played the game of his short football lifetime up to that point. The deficit was reduced to nine points by the final change and a devastating last term saw Melbourne home by three goals. They lost ruckman Mark Jamar with a broken foot and Matthew Whelan to a shoulder injury and lost the Semi Final in Perth the following week but still finished in a higher position in 2006 than any of the other Victorian clubs. Since then the teams have met eight times and the result has always been the same - comprehensive victories for the Saints (the best effort was an 18 point margin last year) before ever dwindling numbers and an ever increasingly gloomy outlook for both clubs; in Melbourne's case it has touched on despair. It is not for the first or even the second time since that finals encounter - but the third - that Melbourne has found it necessary to play out a season with a caretaker coach. It is the fourth occasion in that time that the team has reached the halfway mark of the season with but a single victory to its name. Most at the club have had enough of this but the question still hangs in the air. Is there anything that can be done to turn things around? THE GAME St. Kilda v Melbourne at MCG Saturday 22nd June, 2013 at 4:40pm HEAD TO HEAD Overall St. Kilda 85 wins Melbourne 118 wins 1 drawn At MCG St. Kilda 33 wins Melbourne 58 wins Since 2000 St. Kilda 10 wins Melbourne 9 wins The Coaches Watters 0 wins Craig 0 wins MEDIA TV Fox Footy Channel Live at 4.30pm RADIO ABC K Rock THE BETTING St. Kilda to win $1.13 Melbourne to win $6.00 THE LAST TIME THEY MET St. Kilda 16.11.107 defeated Melbourne 12.10.82, Round 20, 2012 at the MCG Sam Blease had a stand out game with five goals and helped the Demons come from a long way behind to give the Saints a minor scare before emerging winners by 25 points. There was some doubt earlier in the week as to whether Saints' small forward Stephen Milne would play because of alleged homophobic comments towards Heritier O'Brien of Collingwood. He made it and played but he's not so lucky this time around. THE TEAMS ST. KILDA Backs Rhys Stanley James Gwilt Dylan Roberton Half backs Jarryn Geary Sam Fisher Jack Newnes Centreline David Armitage Sean Dempster Terry Milera Half forwards Nick Dal Santo Justin Koschitzke Clint Jones Forwards Trent Dennis-Lane Nick Riewoldt Jack Steven Followers Ben McEvoy Leigh Montagna Farren Ray Interchange Sam Dunell Seb Ross Tom Simpkin Jimmy Webster Emergencies Brodie Murdoch Ahmed Saad Arryn Siposs In Sam Fisher Justin Koschitzke Terry Milera Tom Simpkin Out Beau Maister (hamstring) Stephen Milne Ahmed Saad Josh Saunders MELBOURNE Backs Lynden Dunn Colin Garland Dean Terlich Half backs Tom McDonald Cam Pedersen Mitch Clisby Centreline Jeremy Howe Jack Trengove Matt Jones Half forwards Aaron Davey Chris Dawes Sam Blease Forwards Shannon Byrnes Colin Sylvia David Rodan Followers Jake Spencer Jack Watts Nathan Jones Interchange Jack Fitzpatrick Dean Kent Daniel Nicholson Jimmy Toumpas Emergencies Max Gawn James Magner James Sellar In Shannon Byrnes Mitch Clisby Dan Nicholson Jake Spencer Out Michael Evans (foot) Mark Jamar (toe) Jordie McKenzie (elbow) Luke Tapscott New Mitch Clisby (23, North Adelaide) TWILIGHT ZONE There's a game this Saturday scheduled to take place in a time nestled between day and night usually reserved for fixtures that aren't quite right. Like most matches between 16 and 17th placed teams it deserves its placement outside the normal hours for the game and indeed, until the events of last week, it would have attracted minor interest from those outside the group of avid fans of the respective clubs. The strange case of Stephen Milne and the charges of rape from nine years ago and the equally strange (on a different plane) case of Mark Neeld's dismissal have combined to ensure that there will be a substantial amount of public interest in this game. After all, the media ghouls have been feasting on the two stories for the entire week. The back story from the Milne affair is the alleged player revolt at St. Kilda in support of their teammate and the question marks against the entire culture of a club whose history of extracurricular party boy activities precedes it and has become the stuff of legend. How will they respond this week? There are a myriad of questions about Melbourne in the wake of Neeld's departure, mine being about the confidence of the playing group and whether the changes that are taking place both on and off the field under a quasi AFL regime will have a positive effect to their mindset. Do the players trust the people in charge? Selecting the winner remains easy on paper. You only have to look at each team's most recent performance. The Saints were genuinely unlucky not to bring home the four points against the Eagles in a pressure cooker game while the Demons could only maintain one quarter of pressure before the Magpies swamped them. While St. Kilda is missing personnel who have hurt Melbourne in the past - Hayes, Milne (always seems to kick the opening goal in these games), Meister etc. - the missing Demons are so important in terms of the strength and team depth that are so crucial in young, inexperienced sides. Ultimately, the difference between the two might be determined at the top of the class in terms of the two Saints celebrating their 250th games for they personify two of the main ingredients that the Demons lack. Nick Riewodlt is a true champion of the game, a key position player with a great engine and plenty of courage and Nick dal Santo is a clever and classy midfielder. Both can turn the course of games but their team won't need to change anything this week. I expect them to be far too strong. St. Kilda by 37 points.

THE TURN by Whispering Jack It was a misty night in early September, 2006 when Melbourne last beat St. Kilda before 67,528 people who came to the MCG for an elimination final. The rain began to fall as half time began and those hearts that beat true for the Demons were downcast as their team, in arrears by 20 points (it could have been worse had they not scored the last goal of the second quarter), trudged slowly into the rooms. It would take a champion effort to turn things around. The effort came in the form of a sensational last half by the team led by youngster Brock McLean (in his 46th AFL game) who played the game of his short football lifetime up to that point. The deficit was reduced to nine points by the final change and a devastating last term saw Melbourne home by three goals. They lost ruckman Mark Jamar with a broken foot and Matthew Whelan to a shoulder injury and lost the Semi Final in Perth the following week but still finished in a higher position in 2006 than any of the other Victorian clubs. Since then the teams have met eight times and the result has always been the same - comprehensive victories for the Saints (the best effort was an 18 point margin last year) before ever dwindling numbers and an ever increasingly gloomy outlook for both clubs; in Melbourne's case it has touched on despair. It is not for the first or even the second time since that finals encounter - but the third - that Melbourne has found it necessary to play out a season with a caretaker coach. It is the fourth occasion in that time that the team has reached the halfway mark of the season with but a single victory to its name. Most at the club have had enough of this but the question still hangs in the air. Is there anything that can be done to turn things around? THE GAME St. Kilda v Melbourne at MCG Saturday 22nd June, 2013 at 4:40pm HEAD TO HEAD Overall St. Kilda 85 wins Melbourne 118 wins 1 drawn At MCG St. Kilda 33 wins Melbourne 58 wins Since 2000 St. Kilda 10 wins Melbourne 9 wins The Coaches Watters 0 wins Craig 0 wins MEDIA TV Fox Footy Channel Live at 4.30pm RADIO ABC K Rock THE BETTING St. Kilda to win $1.13 Melbourne to win $6.00 THE LAST TIME THEY MET St. Kilda 16.11.107 defeated Melbourne 12.10.82, Round 20, 2012 at the MCG Sam Blease had a stand out game with five goals and helped the Demons come from a long way behind to give the Saints a minor scare before emerging winners by 25 points. There was some doubt earlier in the week as to whether Saints' small forward Stephen Milne would play because of alleged homophobic comments towards Heritier O'Brien of Collingwood. He made it and played but he's not so lucky this time around. THE TEAMS ST. KILDA Backs Rhys Stanley James Gwilt Dylan Roberton Half backs Jarryn Geary Sam Fisher Jack Newnes Centreline David Armitage Sean Dempster Terry Milera Half forwards Nick Dal Santo Justin Koschitzke Clint Jones Forwards Trent Dennis-Lane Nick Riewoldt Jack Steven Followers Ben McEvoy Leigh Montagna Farren Ray Interchange Sam Dunell Seb Ross Tom Simpkin Jimmy Webster Emergencies Brodie Murdoch Ahmed Saad Arryn Siposs In Sam Fisher Justin Koschitzke Terry Milera Tom Simpkin Out Beau Maister (hamstring) Stephen Milne Ahmed Saad Josh Saunders MELBOURNE Backs Lynden Dunn Colin Garland Dean Terlich Half backs Tom McDonald Cam Pedersen Mitch Clisby Centreline Jeremy Howe Jack Trengove Matt Jones Half forwards Aaron Davey Chris Dawes Sam Blease Forwards Shannon Byrnes Colin Sylvia David Rodan Followers Jake Spencer Jack Watts Nathan Jones Interchange Jack Fitzpatrick Dean Kent Daniel Nicholson Jimmy Toumpas Emergencies Max Gawn James Magner James Sellar In Shannon Byrnes Mitch Clisby Dan Nicholson Jake Spencer Out Michael Evans (foot) Mark Jamar (toe) Jordie McKenzie (elbow) Luke Tapscott New Mitch Clisby (23, North Adelaide) TWILIGHT ZONE There's a game this Saturday scheduled to take place in a time nestled between day and night usually reserved for fixtures that aren't quite right. Like most matches between 16 and 17th placed teams it deserves its placement outside the normal hours for the game and indeed, until the events of last week, it would have attracted minor interest from those outside the group of avid fans of the respective clubs. The strange case of Stephen Milne and the charges of rape from nine years ago and the equally strange (on a different plane) case of Mark Neeld's dismissal have combined to ensure that there will be a substantial amount of public interest in this game. After all, the media ghouls have been feasting on the two stories for the entire week. The back story from the Milne affair is the alleged player revolt at St. Kilda in support of their teammate and the question marks against the entire culture of a club whose history of extracurricular party boy activities precedes it and has become the stuff of legend. How will they respond this week? There are a myriad of questions about Melbourne in the wake of Neeld's departure, mine being about the confidence of the playing group and whether the changes that are taking place both on and off the field under a quasi AFL regime will have a positive effect to their mindset. Do the players trust the people in charge? Selecting the winner remains easy on paper. You only have to look at each team's most recent performance. The Saints were genuinely unlucky not to bring home the four points against the Eagles in a pressure cooker game while the Demons could only maintain one quarter of pressure before the Magpies swamped them. While St. Kilda is missing personnel who have hurt Melbourne in the past - Hayes, Milne (always seems to kick the opening goal in these games), Meister etc. - the missing Demons are so important in terms of the strength and team depth that are so crucial in young, inexperienced sides. Ultimately, the difference between the two might be determined at the top of the class in terms of the two Saints celebrating their 250th games for they personify two of the main ingredients that the Demons lack. Nick Riewodlt is a true champion of the game, a key position player with a great engine and plenty of courage and Nick dal Santo is a clever and classy midfielder. Both can turn the course of games but their team won't need to change anything this week. I expect them to be far too strong. St. Kilda by 37 points.

Thanks for rubbishing the hours of work I have put into it.

That's why we provide each poster with a little avatar. Can't see Jimmy in yours.

Demonland has had Jimmy on the banner for the past 3 years. I have the utmost respect for the guy and everything he did for the club on and off the field but the time is right to start making our own history and being at the lowest low is the right time to get up off the floor and move forward. We will never forget the past and the long list of champions.

Time to look forward.

According to his brother Mark Williams has the "fire in his belly" to take on the coaching job at the Dees http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/mark-williams-has-a-fire-in-his-belly-to-take-on-the-coaching-job-at-melbourne/story-fni5f91a-1226666437747