Can find me anywhere that Viney has been rated in the top 3, not top 10. That answers itself really.

And for the record if you read my posts you'll see that I think we should trade Petterd & Gysberts and delist Cook so keep the abuse in check!

Rated by whom ? Have club recruiters released their player rankings ? If not who are you talking about ? Be specific please.

And you'll note I said "some of you", when referencing those that would argue against average players leaving. Surely you would understand that it wasn't a specific comment directed at you ? You'd "get that" ? Surely ? I mean you'd have to. It was obvious with the words I used. Wasn't it ? Wow.

He will be selected with pick 3 in the ND I would be staggered otherwise

Rated by whom ? Have club recruiters released their player rankings ? If not who are you talking about ? Be specific please.

And you'll note I said "some of you", when referencing those that would argue against average players leaving. Surely you would understand that it wasn't a specific comment directed at you ? You'd "get that" ? Surely ? I mean you'd have to. It was obvious with the words I used. Wasn't it ? Wow.

Don't have any links to anything for you sorry BH, only from occassions when I've listened to either an SEN or watched the odd episode of TAC Future stars and they've talked about some of the best players in the draft the same names are always mentioned Whitfield, Grundy, Toumpas and Daniher. Viney mentioned also as a top 10 prospect but haven't heard him mentioned in the same category as the other 4.

FYI by saying "some of you" your implying I'm in that category, otherwise you could have used the phrase "others on here". Still if you're not including me in that category then I withdraw my accusation and I apologise.

Anyway I'm 99% sure he'll end up at Melbourne with a deal being arranged, but worst case scenario and one can't be struck, based on what Cam Schwab said I wont be suprised if we passed.

Don't have any links to anything for you sorry BH, only from occassions when I've listened to either an SEN or watched the odd episode of TAC Future stars and they've talked about some of the best players in the draft the same names are always mentioned Whitfield, Grundy, Toumpas and Daniher. Viney mentioned also as a top 10 prospect but haven't heard him mentioned in the same category as the other 4.

So in essence you really don't know where he's rated by the people that matter - the clubs.

And your and others posturing about what we should and shouldn't do is based on speculation that is as about as sound as a house built of cards ?

So in essence you really don't know where he's rated by the people that matter - the clubs.

And your and others posturing about what we should and shouldn't do is based on speculation that is as about as sound as a house built of cards ?

I'm just going off a mixture of my own opinion after having seen him play with Casey on a few occassions, what seems to be the wider AFL media opinion (Kevin Sheehan included) and what I've heard out of our CEO's mouth when I was present in the room.

You're the one that seems to be basing their opinion off nothing other then the fact we need an inside midfielder.

What is it they say about people who live in glass houses?

Edit: And I've never said what I suspect will happen will be fact. It's simply my opinion based on what I've been witness to. We'll have to agree to disagree that there's a chance we may pass on him if it came to it.

I'm just going off a mixture of my own opinion after having seen him play with Casey on a few occassions, what seems to be the wider AFL media opinion (Kevin Sheehan included) and what I've heard out of our CEO's mouth when I was present in the room.

You're the one that seems to be basing their opinion off nothing other then the fact we need an inside midfielder.

The "wider AFL media (Kevin Sheehan included)" rate him top 10, but they don't say "he's not top 5" material. You're just guessing as to where they'd have him within that 10 - unless, of course, you can show me the contrary.

What did our CEO say ? Did he say he's not top 5, or that we'll take him only if we believe he's worthy of the pick ? That's yet to be played out. And of course that's the club's public stance. They'd be crazy not to make that statement. But I also have no doubt he'll be at Melbourne next year no matter what pick we need to use.

I too have seen him live, as well as in a couple of championship games, but I also don't profess to be across every junior. I do know that he's considered the best inside mid in the draft ahead of Wines. I also know that quality key forwards are weak this year. And I rate quality inside mids as the most valuable mids in footy. And I also know he has good pace, which is unusual for an inside mid. And I also know that many junior footy watchers consider him the hardest at the ball player they've ever seen in junior ranks. I also have no doubt that he has a better all-round game than Daniel Rich, who I saw a number of times live as a junior - other than Rich's laser like kick. He has a far better inside game than Rich and is much faster. Rich just came second in Brisbane's B&F. So yeah, I'd take him with a top 5 pick even though none of us want to have to.

How about we just agree that it's a nice problem to have ?

How about we just agree that it's a nice problem to have ?

I think we can both drink to that BH!

Couldn't figure which of the many JV threads to post this in, but according to today's Age the Suns are likely to bid on young Jack.

Prestia had better form and went at 9 - which was somewhat of a surprise at the time.

Viney hasn't got the form on the board, is just as small.

If they want to take him at 2, let them.

I hope we call GC's bluff all the way now they came out and said that.

After drafting Caddy and seeing him head home - they'd be silly to draft Viney so high anyway.

Ironically, the only way they'll get anywhere near what they paid for Caddy - is probably through a deal that sees us land Viney in the second round.

Prestia had better form and went at 9 - which was somewhat of a surprise at the time.

Viney hasn't got the form on the board, is just as small.

If they want to take him at 2, let them.

I hope we call GC's bluff all the way now they came out and said that.

After drafting Caddy and seeing him head home - they'd be silly to draft Viney so high anyway.

Ironically, the only way they'll get anywhere near what they paid for Caddy - is probably through a deal that sees us land Viney in the second round.

Passing on Jack will be a monumental stuff up on the clubs part and they simply won't do it.

This guy is ferocious at the ball and the man, and proved he is ready right away for senior footy after his games for Casey. How many times have you seen a kidmake a point of getting under the nose of a tough AFL veteran (Wojcinski) and putting his body on the line the way he did, where the end result was a broken jaw? The fact is that Viney is as hard as they come, and players like this don't come very often at all. As well as that he comes across very driven, has great leadership qualities and is a good kick.

On the off chance we pass (which I guarantee we won't), the posters on Demonland will be crying themselves to sleep every night when we're left with a skinny, 'skilful' kid who turns out to be the next Cale Morton.

Passing on Jack will be a monumental stuff up on the clubs part and they simply won't do it.

This guy is ferocious at the ball and the man, and proved he is ready right away for senior footy after his games for Casey. How many times have you seen a kidmake a point of getting under the nose of a tough AFL veteran (Wojcinski) and putting his body on the line the way he did, where the end result was a broken jaw? The fact is that Viney is as hard as they come, and players like this don't come very often at all. As well as that he comes across very driven, has great leadership qualities and is a good kick.

On the off chance we pass (which I guarantee we won't), the posters on Demonland will be crying themselves to sleep every night when we're left with a skinny, 'skilful' kid who turns out to be the next Cale Morton.

Oliver Wines is also extremely hard at the ball - as is Kennedy, only Kennedy is athletic aswell as ferocious.

Everyone acts like Viney is the only hard at it player in the draft! He isn't and there is others that are hard with arguably more upside.

GWS will be taking Whitfield, that looks all but certain.

The chances of GC taking Viney ahead of Toumpas or Grundy are slim.

GC are only doing this so we panic and make a deal with them not to bid on Viney.

They'll want pick 3 or 4 for Caddy, with the Bullies picks tied up for the mini draft/draft,

the next best pick they will get for Caddy would be our pick 13.

Also, the Mini draft is after the trade period, so if they can get pick 3 or 4 out of us for Caddy,

they can then use that pick to bid on Jack Martin, instead of having to use their pick 2 to bid.

It eliminates us as competition for Martin and also allows them to keep pick 2 - which I assume they are very keen on someone, not being Viney.

Also, its the best deal for Caddy, nothing gets close to our pick.

Its a smart little ploy on the GC's behalf.

That is what I think they are up to anyway.

Frankly, we are all 'armchair' recruiters here - we don't know how far away Viney is from the 4th best player in the group.

So we all sound a tad foolish when we throw our own suppositions around about that.

What is outside of this - is the requirement to do deals with GWS and GC to keep them from nominating.

Give GWS Pick 3 or 4 for Hogan in the MD.

Give GC Pick 13 for Caddy and help them get Tippett.

Take back the initiative - don't let others decide your fate - know your destiny!

I wish we had arm chair recruiters in place of that bloke who chose Cook and Gysberts where he did!

Hopefully Todd can do a better job.

Prestia had better form and went at 9 - which was somewhat of a surprise at the time.

Viney hasn't got the form on the board, is just as small.

Dingaling, Prestia is 174cms and the last time Viney was measured he was 178cms.

Viney is also harder and better than Wines, whom he played with at Echuca. Wines credits Viney for making him more competitive. Viney is also a better kick than Wines and quicker. And he has a better sidestep.

He's always been better than Greene, who would have won the RS if he was eligible. He played with Greene at Ashburton Juniors, as well as Oakleigh Chargers, including the GF last year where Viney won the award for BOG in a losing team. You know, the equivalent of the Norm Smith.

Viney is the same height and will play at the same weight as the most feared and ruthless player in VFL history - Leigh Matthews. Not to mention probably the best. So he's hardly too small.

And no other junior, repeat no other junior, is as hard as Viney. Look into his eyes and tell him he's not the hardest.

Imagine the polls Range Rover would start if we didn't draft Jack...