Earl Hood

Actually Hoody it's fare worse than this.

Apart from Jimmy T, Jack Fitzpatrick, Cam Pedersen, Luke Tapscott and Rohan Bail all needed just one more game to qualify for VFL finals with six games. Jordie and Dean Kent also needed one more but they were never in contention to play in VFL this week after strong games last week.

One of Bail or Jetta will be the travelling 23rd backup to Adelaide tomorrow and I'm betting it will be Bail.

The reason is because Melbourne don't give a s.t about Casey and developing players via VFL finals - they think they have a great development program in October and therefore want palyers back from their break early - you can tell how good it is by the results it has achieved the past few years!

Interesting post DeeP. I am confused. I mean we all know that our training form has been elite, Neeld stated that numerous times as we were being thumped on game day. But lets make one thing clear that through out the game day carnage, training levels stayed at elite AFL levels. Of course making sure that Jimmy is ready to go in October to pit himself against the witches hats is much more important than facing up against second rate VFL types like Magner and his inferior types makes sense. Why would we want to have a kid playing hat sought of pressure cooker, I mean he could get niggled or even punched by hooligans!

Yeah I think it does but then again in a lot of ways he hasn't really been part of the Casey crew all year and averaging 30 touches a game the last 2 weeks he needs AFL experience. He's got VFL covered.

As for Taggert he only had 15 touches last week. 5 goals for sure but I don't think at any other AFL club that would be enough for an AFL game. It's a shame that means Rodan gets a game ahead of him but I do see why they don't want to gift Taggert games.

Pedersen is in ahead of Davis because (apparently) Pedersen can ruck. That's the way I see it anyway. I'd rather Davis but he isn't up to AFL as a forward either and he's much too short to ruck.

Please tell me this is not true, that this disqualifies Jimmy T from the Casey finals campaign! If true I say we have not got a clue. The best development for JT is some high pressure finals games where he might be challenged physically and expectations on his contribution to the side would be high. The alternative is he plays two non descript games for MFC at the end under no scrutiny. That said Ihope he puts in a blinder tomorrow.

If Spencer goes down injured in the first 5 mins, who rucks?

Looks like it is Pederson! I would have had Gawn in for Fitzy as backup ruck. Magner instead of Rodan to pump out a few hard get handballs to Jimmy T. And I would thrown Davis down back just to see if he can play the actual role we have groomed him to do for nearly 3 seasons. With Frawley, Davis and Garland down back you can then leave Watts at CHF for more than a quarter and hopefully build up his trade value.

Why is Watts playing. I thought he was being made to understand.

Watts has been selected at centre half forward. Does Betfair run a book on how many minutes in before he is thrown down back? I am betting he'll be on the move after the Crows have the first 4 on the board, that should take about 6 or 7 minutes on our current form.

Congratulations on a great career. I was hoping for one more year, even as a super sub. Or how about being the designated kick in player. I thought he was talking about one more season. I hope he wasn't pushed.

We all know he has had problems in recent years but his kicking skills are still intact and we have precious few others who can spot up a target. Looking at his highlights reel is amazing. Who else on our list has anywhere near this amount of poise, balance, speed and agility that he had in his prime? Jurrah maybe.

In fact it crossed my mind that we have had players in more recent times with some special X factor but they were all drafted in the 90's - Yze, Schwartz, Robbo, The Wizz, Jackovitch could all do some amazing things at times that got you up out of your seat but gee since 2000 we have really struggled to unearth those special sort of skills that get you excited.

Wasnt he that guy who piloted the qantas airbus after the engine blew up?

Good man to have on board if he has experiences in avoiding plane crashes, because we basically are one.

We are a train wreck, I don't think a QANTAS pilot could help.

Lyon's defense of him on FC is rubbish. "He started ok then tired"

I'm with Matty Lloyd 110%. Called both of those incidents they just showed when I was watching the game as been complete rubbish.

I can only imagine what Derm Brereton would say about a Hawk doing the same or Tony Shaw about a pie. They'd probably have the guts to call a spade a spade or in this case a spud a spud.

I was sitting above this incident on Sunday. At the time I was stunned at the lack of effort by Jack but thought well there were two other demon players there. But he was in a position to intervene but chose not to. Why?

It reminded me of when I played second rate suburban footy some years ago and did something very similar but worse where I failed to tackle a player running toward goal. I was dragged immediately and dropped the next week. Why did I do it? At the time I was not there mentally, I was not thinking about the game at all, I was somewhere else. This indicates to me where Jack's mind was, not on the game, more likely thinking about his comments on the footy show and the backlash since. But this is of his own making.

I have been a patient fan but 5 years in I think it is time to part ways. JW is now a potential problem in the ranks. No passion, doesn't want to be here. Lets play him forward for the next two games and try to build up his currency for a trade.

For heavens sake yet another high draft pick burnt. I just don't believe how we have stuffed up our drafting over 5 years. Selecting kids with these things in common time and time again, no leadership potential, no physical presence and no appetite for a contest. You could not have achieved this level of failure even if you had delibetely set out to do it.

Pun intended?

Yes!

In the end we can argue Magner's abilities but it should be about honouring performances in the magoos. You play well consistently you get a chance. Conversely you play insipid rubbish in the ones and you get dropped. No matter watt your draft number or past history.

Yeah but did you notice how many times Viney and Sylvia in particularly got their hands on the ball and tried to get it out but had no one smart or good enough to be in the right spots. Viney had 5 touches early in the first of the teams 9 ie. he hunted the ball and then no one could get on the end of it. Or the number of times Freo won the ball (particularly in the first 3/4) and we tackled and chased and pressured as they handballed around unable to get anywhere then a smart handball went to a Danyle Pearce or other clever outside player in space.

As I said I'm all for playing Magner but I can also see why they haven't.

I take on board your point. What I noticed on Sunday was the rapid handball by Freo in contested situations. We see it all the time in the middle with the Hawks or the Cats. Their elite mids only have the ball for a second before it is passed off to another insider if required or then it is sent off rapid fire to an outsider on the move forward. Now has anyone seen this setup with the Dees? It is usually ruck tap to Jones, who graps it just prior to be being gang tackled and we get another ball up. But for us that is a win.

Obviously lacks speed and also doesn't seem able to impact AFL with endurance either ie. doesn't rack up uncontested disposals at AFL level.

The first Freo game we got belted when Magner played. This time we went for Jones, Viney, McKenzie, Sylvia predominately with also Grimes and Trengove as the inside midfielders. Put Magner in and you take one of those guys out. Now I'd be happy for Grimes to go back to half back or for Sylvia to play half forward and rotate in to the midfield to give Magner 2 weeks just to see what he can do but I don't hold high hopes.

The big questions are:

1. Do you ever think Magner will be AFL standard?

2. Will playing Magner make an impact on the scoreboard ie. will he perform any better than Viney, McKenzie, Sylvia or Grimes do in the midfield

If your answer to both those questions is NO then you wouldn't play him if he had 100 possessions. Same for Rodan.

interesting we have on many threads been talking about culture, on field leadership, hard bodies, players who want the ball, I agree Magner is not the solution but he may be part of it. 36 handballs last week. That is 36 handballs to outside receivers, if we had any. I watched Freo do us over in the middle on Sunday, another hard arse like Viney, a la Magner would not have won us the game but it may have reduced the carnage.

Look it is obvious Magner is just an inside mid who hunts the ball and can get it out, that's all. He might get first touch 30 times but so what. His kicking is not elite, nor is his speed, or goal kicking for that matter. Now we have any number of players who can....ummh, arr. Oh I better ring Neil he knows the reason. I'll get back with the answer.

Yes 100% our list is below AFL standard. The rot has set in and PJ needs to wipe the slate clean with those (and I include Watts) who have a soft underbelly. We know who you are on this list and we want rid of your types.

Strewth! Can you have 38 picks in the draft?

Old hack has beens who never played with strong leadership anyway (ie. Green and Bruce) weren't the answer though.

This current Richmond side has climbed the ladder on the back of Brad Miller, Shane Tuck, Chris Newman and even now guys like Jake King and Dan Jackson. That's the kind of leader we needed to keep around.

We all agree on Junior but I don't understand how letting Junior go when things were actually looking up necessarily makes Green and Bruce bad decisions.

And I certainly disagree with anyone who thought Jeff White or Yze had time left.

I don't disagree with you but what happened between 2010 when we seemed to be on track with 8 or 9 wins and close fought battles against the premiers of 2010 twice, the doggies and even the Hawks in the second meeting. At that stage we thought we were on the up. Later in 2011 we thumped Freemantle at the Gee by 83 points. Two years on we cop a 95 point battering. What a turn around! What went wrong in that time? Poor draft selections is part of it. Zero leadership? Yes no doubt. The way forward, not sure but gee we need a priority pick and more.

Quite true, I've followed the club for many years and this would have to be the worst bunch of players we have ever had at the club, they lack basic skills, basic accountability and any semblance of heart.

I can't understand why it's happened the way it has, but it's like the perfect storm, where all the conditions have aligned to create the perfect [censored] team.

It's as if they are all waiting for someone else (Jack Watts in particular) to get up and show them the way and win some games for them. There are few among them that deserve to put their hand out at the end of the week.

I've stuck up for some of them in the past but not any more, players like Tapscott, who my wife sponsors, need to get more of the ball or get a new job. Howe, who I sponsor, also needs to show that he is more than a one trick pony and that he can actually help Melbourne win a flag rather than just winning mark of the year.

There are others that sit back and wait for something to happen, and we all know who they are that are never going to be as good as we thought they would be.

How must it grate on Magner when he works his backside off, gets possessions galore, but still can't get a game when Rodan and Byrnes and Nicholson and Blease seem to get one without any form at all.

WAFJ.

Trouble is you can't unload 36 players and draft in 36 new ones or 20 for that matter. We may unload another 12 this yer to go with 12 or so last year and 10 before that. When do we stop churning? Lets face it our recuiting has been shiyte. No talent, no chance, I say. Oh and of course no development of our players whatever that means?

That kid is a gutless disgrace to our jumper and club, I watched him closely today and he constantly let Dunnand T Mc do the hard yards, I hate his body language I hate his non aggression at the ball and his opponent and I hate the way he plays as a loose defender and still won't bleed for his teammates, the guys worth nothing at the trade table and he is everything that Glen Bartlett talked about at the presidents lunch today, Kudos to Davey give the guy 1 more season on a limited wage because he deserves it, Christ that pea heart Watts must be barely able to look a kid like Viney in the eye after a game and I personally think one of the reasons JW hasn't been dropped this year is because they Didnt want him Infecting Hogan, that pea heart will be lucky to get a game at another club.

Why does Craig put him in this position as floating, loose backman? His job is to mop up loose balls, not go to contests, to receive handballs and spot up targets coming out of the back line. This is not the training he needs. I blame the coaches for not putting him in the engine room where he must be accountable. They should have thrown him onto Pav or into the centre.

Scarlett did this to perfection but he had earnt his points over many years as a legitimate backman.

Good older players would be picked up on a year contract by clubs in the premiership window. Junior was picked up by GWS for his leadership, something we desperately needed. Bruce walked and played a dozen forgettable games at the Hawks.

The rest didn't do much. Anything actually.

Davey has done little to nothing this year. About the same as the year before. And the year before.

If Aaron doesn't retire, he should be retired in the friendliest possible way....

Good comment, fits in well with this thread! Aren't we talking about Melbourne's history of off loading experienced players to our detriment. I am talking Not just Junior but Bruce, Green and others who may have helped and shielded our young draft picks and provided some leadership along the way. CS, CC and Bailey thought it would just happen with multiple early draft kids, well it never will I think we have proven that theory is BS!

The thing about Craig's decision to play Jack Watts down back, which was mentioned on radio post game, is that having him play loose as the extra defender teaches him nothing about defensive pressure. If he was manning Pavlich, then at least he might pick up a few tips on intensity or just a lesson in how to lead up as a forward. But no, Jack is used as a roam free quarterback and puts in an insipid effort and plays way too deep most of time and makes possibly one intercept mark for the entire game. Rivers would have taken five. Garland probably 10. Whose fault is that? Jack's or the coach?

The second observation is that poor Troy Davis has come in and played two games as a forward and tried but does not possess the tools for this level (not quick, not a powerful mark, not a thumping kick). He will probably get dropped and is a very high chance of getting delisted. It's nice that we played him, but it would have been nice if we'd seen whether he was up to it as a defender at AFL level. Whose fault is that. Troy's or the coach?

Spot on I think the coach is burning these two kids. For heavens sake after what went on this week why would you throw Watts back as the loose backman but keep Davis forward in a dysfunctional forward line? Keep Watts forward and throw Davis back where he belongs would be the smart play. JW is learning nothing playing the loose backman I agree and not doing it well and can rightly ask if he is being developed!

Cutting Davey's career short!! You must be joking he was cooked 2 years ago.

This club has been way to soft for decades.

Robbie Flower and Neita are the only 2 players who deserved "special treatment" regarding retirement.

Interesting comment given PJ's comments that one of the clubs problems is that we emptied the locker room of experience and leadership. I had stamped Davey's papers some weeks ago but I watched him today amongst the ineptitude around him and wondered if he is not worth a one year extension at basic wages. We all know Davey has deficiencies and he may need to a be a super sub going forward but gee he does have the ability to kick to a target. Oh and it's not just about the ability to hit a target, it's about looking for a target.

I say this after watching today Colin S and Trengove get the bal and just bomb it high and long into the forward line. And when they and everyone else does that we can then put sh&t on Davis and Fitzy not leading out and kicking a lazy 3 or 4.

A good side would work out a game plan the got the ball in Daveys hands at all costs and protected him from feral taggers. But we are in survival mode as a team, every man for themselves.

Watts Martin up to? Let's hope he hasn't been made an offer he can't refuse from GWS. (And who knows maybe Jack has an offer as well). If this is the scenario the advantages given to the expansion clubs thru draft picks and extra salary caps are becoming scandalous. Richmond is on the rise what else would Martin be chasing than $$$?

Both expansion clubs have gone past us and continue to be given massive advantages and people still don't believe we need extra help at the end of the season.

Watts for Martin?

I'm not sure it should have been Clisby's decision to make in the first pace. The club decides to fight yet the club is over turned by a rookie listed payer. Hmmm

Yes I think this is a club decision not an individual's unless he has added new evidence that adds to the video.

the message is already out there.. If youre a power club, you have clout

if youre like us...just lay down and assume the status of doormat.

nothing's changed has it

Have to agree here. The media are [censored] off with the delays because the Dons are in there with QCs, these days SC's at 20 paces, threatening the AFL that if you charge us we will see you in court. Wish we did this over the tanking rubbish. But then we are on AFL welfare and are their lapdogs and no more. It is sad really.

For me this has very little to do with Clisby and everything to do with MFC yet AGAIN copping it sweet without fighting it out.

Like we always have, and it appears always will, we make it easy to be the bullied because we never stand up for ourselves when wronged. If we didn't fight this because we are suckjng on the AFL'S teet-which I don't buy - then as of right now we are dead.

I'm going to have to start not hating every other team in the comp because it is becoming very conceivable to me now that one day I might actually have to follow one of the pricks

I suppose the club's survey may be the place to start. Let them know your thoughts.

Why should we stand fast if the club's management repeatedly rolls over. In this case the evidence looks flakey but if MFC has some other evidence should not they let us know so we understand their decision making?