Lucifers Hero

West is safe as a player needs to have played for 3 or more AFL seasons to be targetted. On that basis, the high end talent we drafted a few years ago should also be safe. I actually hope this works or the AFL will be back for another impromptu idea to equalise the comp meaning weakening the strong teams. The more such ideas they have the more likelihood of our better players going. This would be especially so if the AFL gave fledgling clubs more top Tier spots.

Smith got only 2 games for an almost identical set of circumstances. One could argue Smith's were worse. Having set the Smith precedent the AFL couldn't go any harder on Ginnivan. And Smith didn't lose any income.

Maybe because the people in FD's, Admin, AFL HQ etc also partake in said activities . Pot. Kettle.

The upcoming draft is compromised as the young players were taken up in the last draft so there will only be 'over-age' players; generally those that were overlooked in the last draft. So getting draft picks for any player we lose will not be of much value. I would guess the lack of a 'draft pool' is why the struggling clubs are getting free hits at established players rather than priority draft picks.

I can see why the AFL are doing this: Crows, Lions and Dees have dominated the GF. They have graced the GF 10 times out of a possible 12. (The other times: Bulldogs (premiers in 2018) and Carlton (a flukey conference system in 2019.). North wouldn't be two happy being in the lose up to '5 players' category. But they did a fair bit of raiding and had concessions so shouldn't be complaining. The issue is the AFL moving the goal posts without warning. We traded up the draft order a few years ago to bring in talent ahead of the draft concessions to the latest expansion teams. Now we risk losing some of our best players. Some clubs will get around the # of Tier spots by offering other incentives on top of say Tier 3 $ to bridge the small gap to Tier 2 $. Like Daisy said after the GF win: "...we didn't give away cars to entice players to join..." Which I assume are not in the salary cap. Clubs also offer jobs in their FD etc. Unless our players want to go interstate their options will be Ess or Hawth. The best a player can hope for is to move from Tier 3 to Tier 2. And I suspect Ess and Hawth will already have their Tier 2 spots taken. I don't expect us to lose many players.

That clarifies it. Thank you.

That is what I recall reading somewhere but can't find it. He is back at the club today so something was misreported or negotiations with the AFL have occurred. I'm happy for the kid to at least, be at the club and surrounded by his mates. Edit: Found the article https://www.watoday.com.au/sport/afl/significant-cost-magpies-boss-says-ginnivan-will-pay-dearly-in-lost-match-fees-20230219-p5clmg.html "Ginnivan will also have to train away from the group until his suspension is completed and can’t play in any pre-season games...This means he could miss more games of the season should his form and fitness not be good enough to earn an immediate recall in round three".

Thanks dc. Not sure where I read/heard 'no training'. As you say a minor point in what seems a raw deal for the kid. Edit: Found the article https://www.watoday.com.au/sport/afl/significant-cost-magpies-boss-says-ginnivan-will-pay-dearly-in-lost-match-fees-20230219-p5clmg.html "Ginnivan will also have to train away from the group until his suspension is completed and can’t play in any pre-season games...This means he could miss more games of the season should his form and fitness not be good enough to earn an immediate recall in round three".

Just noticed that Moore wore club garb in front of their sponsor board this morning. Good to see the captain at least is supporting his player. I wonder if Collingwood saw how bad the optics of 'plain clothes/no sponsors' looked yesterday and allowed Moore to front the media 'in uniform' this morning.

Yes and protecting their sponsors but it hardly says 'our club' supports the player. I wonder if they had done the same if it was Pendlebury or Daicos, the younger...

iirc, Smith got two weeks for being caught which was added to the two week suspension for some on field incident. Ginnivan gets 4 matches: 2 practice games and 2 H & A and can't train with the club during that time. He loses match payments and conditioning making it harder to get back into the team. If there was to be a 'double standard' debate out of this it should be club/AFL treatment of a 'star' player vs a 'junior' player for almost identical incidents. Ginnivan is getting a raw deal.

It didn't read this way to me. The 'double standard' sounded like Ginivan was punished for drug use, May was not punished for 'excessive' alcohol use/getting into a brawl. (As an aside, was May 'paralytic' drunk? How would anyone know? He wasn't arrested or tested for .05. Someone doesn't need to be 'paralytic' to get angry and get into a brawl ). If he was 'paralytic' and it was played down by the media maybe it is because a brawl gets more click bait. The clubs and the AFL both came out and said they do not condone the respective events/behaviours/substances. Punishments were issued. Apologies made. Public dressing downs occurred. So responses seem very similar and commensurate. Not sure what else could have been done to avoid the perceived 'double standard' in comparing these two cases. The specifics of the two players aside, your underlying point seems to be the the media didn't do enough to highlight a societal 'double standard': illegal drug use vs 'excessive' alcohol use/violence. Not much a club of the AFL can do about the media. To me they did all that was reasonable to do for the respective incidents. Rightly, or wrongly, the AFL isn't going to promote that debate. I just hope the media leave Ginnivan alone.

While Ginnivan's $5,000 fine was suspended he will be out of pocket a substantial amount as his contract is largely match payments: doesn't play, no pay. So he loses at least two games worth (H & A and maybe a practice match) and it will be harder for him to get back into the team as he can't train with them until round 3. Altho they could do a deal with the AFL as Dangerfield did a few years ago where he played in the VFL practice matches.

Just for the record May was suspended for one game by the club which was added to the week he missed for concussion. He also had to do community service. Ostensibly, May was suspended for drinking while injured. But if the incident hadn't hit the media I doubt he would have been suspended at all. Ginnivan is being punished for (take your pick): being stupid using drugs in a public place, being caught, doing something illegal, and the old chestnut: bringing the game into disrepute! All of those? So not such double standards. Would love to see the media carry on about Ginnivan for weeks and weeks as they did May. And some scribes are still talking about the 'May incident' as when our 2022 season started unravelling which is rubbish. But that is what the scribes keep writing.

There has always been large chunks of the stadium available for sale via Ticketmaster as GA seats or reserved seats. The better the seat, the bigger the game the higher the price. Anyone can buy them. So my read of the email is that if a mfc GA member wants to upgrade to a reserved seat for any particular game they use their barcodes to buy it from Ticketmaster. I hear your implied question: Why can't mfc be allocated more bays and sell to members who buy an annual membership. Like you, it doesn't make sense to me to restrict the number of premium/reserved seat memberships when so much of the stadium will be available for week to week sales. Would love to know how many reserved seats Coll and Rich have for their 100,000+ members. I would bet a lot more than mfc have!!

@daisycutterI think the Reserved seat referred to is the usual 'Ticket That is very vague. I doubt it relates to the season long memberships that have reserved seats. My guess is the 'reserved seat upgrade' is the usual option on Ticketmaster for GA members. Pay a small amount extra and get a reserved seat for just for that game. But I'm guessing

https://www.afl.com.au/news/876047/pies-gm-denies-wider-drugs-issue-after-ginnivan-ban 1. "Ginnivan was out with teammates and other friends in January when he was filmed by a member of the public in a hotel toilet cubicle with an illicit drug". He should have closed the cubicle door!! 2. "Wright would not confirm media reports the substance was ketamine... "Ketamine is used by medical practitioners and veterinarians as an anaesthetic...Ketamine is a dissociative drug, which means it acts on different chemicals in the brain to produce visual and auditory distortion, and a detachment from reality". No wonder players claim 'mental health issues'! The symptoms of some disorders are often the same as 'ketamine'.

Glad that his team Freo, isn't in his top 4. Don't know how on the one hand he can say 'not making the top 4 is a wasted era' then say 'premiership teams often make GF within 4 years'. That gives us 3 years. Maybe he should hold fire and see how many GF or premierships we have in 3 years!!

Thanks Layzie. Hope you also had a great festive season. I had a great family Xmas then it all went south 😭 Tested + for Covid on Boxing day with symptoms lasting up to 6 weeks. Did my knee two weeks ago and last weekend my car (which I love) was stolen. Left wondering where all those black cats I din't see are🙄 🤞and 🙏my bad luck for 2023 is over!

It looks like he lowers his arms then releases the ball at about hip height whereas before it was about shoulder height. But he seems to lean back at contact which could mess with the direction of the ball off the boot.

For lots of reasons I really like the idea of this as our base. Just wondering whether our building of even 2 or 3 levels high would block the view to the 'other' side of the track for spectators etc Perhaps the idea is that an oval is in the middle and our infrastructure would be outside the track. One would think if that was the case it would be factored into the build phase and we would know about it. How do others see it working...?

i reckon any number of our players could debut eg Howes, Woewodin etc. In fact I would have Howes in the top two most likely. Sestan as a long shot. Being a regular 22 is another matter.

An article that @mauriesyposted in the Kozzie thread says: "Richardson said the Demons are likely to wait until Wednesday morning, just hours before the supplemental selection period closes, to determine whether former Port Adelaide rookie Trent Burgoyne, the son of Power great Peter, or Old Haileybury backman Kye Turner, win a spot on the club’s rookie list". Not giving much away as that could be read as either will win a spot or neither will. We will know by this tine tomorrow. I don't mind the idea of keeping the spot open for a mid season draftee in case of a LT injury.

Pondering my possible response: ignore the post: too late now! post what I'm thinking : you should be so lucky!!! take back my comment about feeling sorry for you...definitely!

There is no way of knowing what May's $ will be. Generally the club has been very fair in its player remuneration and that May has not dragged out the negotiations suggests both parties are happy. I guess that is all that counts. With Kozzie, from news reports his reasons for leaving are about where he wants to live. There hasn't been much on the $ side of it. I would be surprised if the club were to under value him $ wise. Having said that he seems set for a stellar year which would make his value go up. I'm confident the club will find the money if that becomes the deal breaker. All that aside, Kozzie seems a really decent guy and would not forget the support and trust the club has put in him when facing challenges. That may not be enough to keep him but it would be in his thinking.