rpfc

Heh. Hilarious. I'm pegging you as one of the enlightened that didn't appreciate the 'list management' and 'experimentation' that went on over the last few years? We didn't go out as winning as first priority... How dare we? Where were you on that sharp fence? I was deep in the 'let's be ruthless and do what has to be done to win a flag' camp. Does that make me a better supporter than those who wanted 'to win every game as you sacrifice the heart of clubif you don't' and those that claim a 'winning culture is more important than any draft pick?' It probably does. But I didn't run over any fans that thought that. I tried reason and respect. And sometimes condescension...

I'd back myself as a pretty good supporter of this footy club in good times and bad. And Junior's farewell game is an effload bigger than his 250th. I want to win, but this loss, after the fight they showed in an important game last week, does not hurt. At all. Last week was the equivalent of a final, and this game was the equivalent of a practice game in October.

I wouldn't be questioning Nasher's mindset as a fan of this club. Let's be honest with ourselves here, people. Aside from our horrific record at AAMI and the desire to turn that around - there was little in this game other than a chance to give players who, are or recently were, on the cusp being moved on further games (Newton, Bail, Dunn, Batram, Warnock), and getting games into our core talent.

I could name 12 to 15 core players that will be the nucleus of that flag team - the other spots are going to be taken by periphery players fighting for spots. I can see Bate being prominent amongst that group. A flag team never has 22 stars of the game, remember. Hard to fit under the cap...

A chance for finals, absolutley. A chance to win one? Maybe. A chance to get to a prelim? No. Then what is the point? I want to win a flag. What we do now will make a difference. Talent needs experience.

Nonsense. The majority of Batram's kicks are 20-25m kicks at the back to players standing on their own. Sylvia and Davey and others get their possessions under pressure at the business end of the ground. Stats have their own bias. Hoped for better from you, ID. But, Batram is an ordinary kick. He's having a great BTW, a career year, really.

Define 'legitimate.' As I have been saying for a couple of years now - I am willing to lose matches in the short term for the long term benefit of the club. Watts playing VFL does not help us get a flag. We need to pump games into our talent. And he has been pretty servicable since the break. Done some good things.

You know what they say about statistics... I know Batram is an ordinary kick. I believe my lying eyes...

Much like Stephen Colbert - our enemy is RAIN!! To those who laughed at that - well done.

Jeez, that was hard to read. I don't know if personnel will be the big change - more like mindset. Well - 'hoped for' change at least...

I don't know whether he is confident or happy with his body size, but he doesn't play like he is. He rarely looks for body contact and I have not seen a "Gee, that was tough" moment from him this year whereas I have from the equally skinny and young Jack Watts. He has problems with his defensive work, but I need him to show more physicality. I think he needs a more solid body to play regularly under Bailey. Good luck to the nutritional staff.

I believe he/she is questioning your appraisal of Bate and Batram. Batram, apart from his break out year in a very good team, has shown a lack of footy smarts, vision, and decision making skills. He has a sub-standard kick and, like the rest of his teammates, couldn't handpass to anything but shoelaces. He has always had fight and tenacity, but to say he has had more upside than Bate is verging on the ridiculous or, at least, the self-indulgent re-writing of history. Bate has a fantastic motor, excellent speed on a lead, good hands, kicks like a mule (in both length, accuracy, and style), and has vision and a decent footy IQ. His issues are his agility, his one-dimensional playing style, and his more often than occassional brainfade with the footy. Batram and Bate play vastly different roles but the talented one is out of form and the grunt with heart is in career form - that's probably why you think they way you do. Don't lose heart, a number of posters on here do... Was that arrogant enough?

It's selective history, WYL. I can't embrace the Invincible Whites even though we won the inaugral Victorian Premiership back when time began in white, because why? It's not what we are about now? Post 'Checkers' Hughes (played for Richmond by the way - I know, yuck...)? It's a non-colour/meaningless colour/colour of surrender (wouldn't say that in Madrid just quietly)? We only played in those colours for a decade or so? (Important effing decade.) I love the jumper and I would prefer not changing a thing, but we have to change the jumper in certain games I think you will agree. I would like the blasphemy have some meaning rather than have some ugly, meaningless red jumper with white shorts, just because it is still red and blue. Inverted colours? Where is that in our history? When were we called the blue legs? What I am saying is that you can't hold up history as a cause when you don't embrace all of your history.

Morton and Bate are unsettled according to a couple of members of this board. What do they have in common? They are currently out of the first 22. I know you kids think that getting dropped is, like, the worst thing in the whole world! But it is a fact of life that good players lose form and get dropped. Cale needs to work on his physicality and Bate needs to find significantly better form in his high HFF role or loosen his thigh muscles enough to develop enough agility to play another role in the team. I see big things for them at the MFC. I wish people would stop getting so carried away when the 15th best player finds themselves the 25th best player for a few weeks or months. Look at Batram - I thought the guy was gone at the end of the year, but he looks to me to be our Campbell Brown (when he was in defence).

Players get dropped. He, and you, can get over it. He has not developed his physicality this season and if he has 'disappeared' it is due to injury and his failure to impose himself on contests. He is a fine young player and an important cog, but match committee should not kow-tow to the whinging of a 20 year old. And, you close to Cale? A family member? A friend? We get it. We don't care.

I just thought you were your average MFC supporter; keen to dwell on the negative, and constantly looking for it. But that last line is something else. Looking past the fact that the brackets should be inside the full stop, I have to say that claiming the 'coaching staff' has lost a few of the younger players is inflammatory. And then claiming inside information where you won't revel the source makes it incendiary. I don't know if you think that passing along grumblings amongst the playing group is your right. Because it is. But I will temper you, and everyone else reading your provocative post, with the fact that grumblings amongst over 40 grown men in a highly competitive industry is common place and hardly newsworthy. If anyone is unhappy - I say, and I hope Bailey says (as I am sure he did to Buckley, and I know he did to Johnson (heh)) get in line or get lost - we are going to win a premiership. And we'll run over anyone in the way...

This could be placed somewhere but who cares... I have been playing around with the Ladder Predictor at the AFL site and put in the permutations that I believe will eventuate. It seems that losing to Port, in Adelaide in Rd 21, is far better than losing to Hawthorn. Far better. Some of you will be giving a subtle 'duh' into your teacups right now but I highlight this fact because I want to see how the boys go in a finals game atmosphere against a battle hardened, angry, proud opponent. It is this week that we play a meaningful match for the first time since a forgettable day in Perth 4 years ago. Bailey's desire to not mention the F word aside, the boys will realise the importance of this match and I am eager to see whether our backline has the steel to withstand the lift in temperature that will occur this week, I am eager to see how our midfield runs with the tension of 50000 expectant fans watching their every move, and I am eager to see the most effective forward line I have ever seen in the red and blue play without the room and space that has been afforded them of late. Win, lose, or draw (god forbid) meaningful games are here again and I say - throw the kids into the flame, hell, they're the ones that provided the spark... (And by that I don't want to see Miller put in the team for anyone younger than 24.)

You need to stop caring about what the AFL 'wants' - it doesn't have to be neutral to us. As for the StK strip and our strip - I cannot believe you are arguing that our white strip makes it more a clash than our traditional strip. Finally, you went right past the Batram incident. He saw a similar colour and handpassed to it. Umpire, player or runner - players are confused by similar strips. It obviously occurs.

We have worn a predominantly white strip in the past and we will in the future. Adelaide, Brisbane, Hawthorn, and WCE supporters can hold your argument and say that white, which is the predominant colour on their away strips, isn't apart of their history but not the MFC. If you think bringing up what we wore over a hundred years ago as irrelevant spin then you would also be opposed to our claim to be the oldest footy club and our inclusion of 1858 in our new emblem.

They wear red and black - we wear red and dark blue. They clash. And, as an addendum to this post, I would add that the argument that 'we have had it this way since time began' holds little water with me in the current day as there are few one-on-one contests anymore, the game has evolved where rolling scrums and fast handball movement have become large features. Both of these spectacles, if you can call the rolling scrums spectacles, are better disseminated, and no doubt executed looking at Clint Batram's problem with the 3rd team playing in our close loss to the bullies, by clearly defined and contrasted jumpers.

Were the other clubs who wear a white strip were named the 'invincible whites' at a point in their history? We should take ownership over the history you love so much and tell everyone why we are wearing white over, say, silver...

That stance is, as you point to, hypocritical. You can embrace history only so long as it fits a narrative. Other than red and blue, the other colour (or non-colour) associated with the MFC is white. It is our history and WYL conspiracies aside - the club should keep a white strip going forward.

The logic is the fact that they clash, if only slightly. You want to be embrace our heritage and I understand and applaud that. Times change, and modern football dictates a clear determination of the two teams playing. And a 'white' strip has been worn by the MFC before. If you like seeing 1858 on our new emblem then embrace the jumper they wore when they played back then. I would love it if you or DC would articulate why I cannot embrace white as an MFC supporter for selected away games.

He's a smart young man and I think an important player but he really needs to work on his writing style. If this is him attempting a life as a journo after his footy career he better hope there is a vacancy at the Hun because the only person that writes so unevenly is Mark Robinson. Maybe Jon Anderson after a night out...

I just saw this thread. Heh. WTF?