Rodney (Balls) Grinter

Rd 2 - BAM

Agree with 90% of what you are saying here, but I really do feel like we have been short changed for Jesse, based on the hit and miss rate of KPPs in the draft. A proven commodity should always be worth more than an unknown. Just look at Josh Schache and Tom Boyd as two virrually failed top draft pick KPPs. Yes we got May, KK and a little bit of loose change, but I recon that in the scheme of things: 1. Freo got a bargain; 2. We got somewhat short changed and; 3. The Suns got completely shafted. Basically they got pick 6 for x 2 top 10 club B&F players - one a pretty solid defender and the other a running player who has been a bit patchy for the last few years (like if we traded Brayshaw at the end of last year). Pick six could be the next Lucas Cook, just an average on baller or a pretty remote possibility of being a superstar - more than likely it will be one of the first two. I don't buy the injury doubt thing. Not only have Freo got a known commodity, but compared to a raw draft pick, they have also got a player with half a dozen years devopment already put into him and raring to go in his prime physical maturity for a KPP. I still hold the view that free agency has skewed the system way too far in favor of players, because the club that recruits them doesn't have to give up anything with respects to draft value. Would the Tigers have thought twice about Lynch if they had to give up their first and second round draft picks for him? The draft has become broken as an equalisation tool when players can serve a few years on a list and then walk to basically anyone they chose to as occurs these days.

Don't think this warents a seperate thread, so this is probably as good a spot as any: https://www.sen.com.au/news/2018/10/30/who-was-st-kildas-real-best-recruit-of-the-off-season/ Think Timmy may be onto something here. My old man had the view that Brett Ratten was a pretty good and influential assistant coach during his time at the MFC - thoughts?

I'd say that's a fairly accurate assessment. I can't see why Carlton could be so high, surely they would be keeping things pretty low key and moderating expectations from where they are at. I agree that 3rd would be reasonable for where we sit hype wise, weren't actually sitting in top spot for hype. Perhaps is because I'm cautious by nature, but I'm a bit concerned that we are actually over hyped. Quite conscious that as good as we have looked at times and as much as we have improved, have a quality young list etc, that taking those next steps of being a genuine flag contender are fraught with peril. The Port Adelaide story from 2013 when they pushed Hawthorn within a few points of making a GF, and subsequent narrative was they had this great young list full of potential etc and the the failure to deliver since. Bulldogs the other example. Were going to have an ultra compeditive team for the period following their flag, but have similarly fallen off a cliff. Would rather the hype follow the MFC retrospectively after we have delivered the flag.

Agree. Will be over half a decade since we have played West Coast at the G.

I know next to nothing about Lovell, but will be interesting to see if we can turn around the career of a few truely recycled players over the next few years. We seem to have been good at picking which established players to trade for (Melksham, Hibbard, Lever, Lewis to an extent and hopefully May, KK) and also the state league (AVB, Hannan, Freitch), but with the exception of Garlet, I can't think of any worth while and we have really struggled to recruit and turn around any real discards (McKenna, Balic, Mitchie, Aiden Riley). Hopefully perhaps Preuss might hopefully be considered a good selection of a recycled player for us in much the way Martin did for the Lyons or Dunn for the Pies, but it would be good if we could get a few more bargins that turn into solid players, even if they are just affordable depth.

Unfortunately I don't know that winning a flag will end the curse as such, but I'm pretty sure that when we do win one, these guys will be remembered and celebrated as valuable parts of the journey. Soo sad. Rest in peace Col. Gone, but not forgotten. Every heart beats true for the red and blue.

Unfortunately they got Cripps. It's a pitty the did, imagine the complete basket case they'd be if they didn't fluke it and pick him up.

Because Sheedy was gifted so many top 10 draft picks in that period he didn't have to make the compromises that others had to did he. I have respect for Sheedy in so far as I would have loved the MFC to have won the premierships he has, but beyond that, really can't stand the guy - he has this overpowering smugness about him. The smugness thing really came through in the $cully steal too.

And around a dozen clubs missed picking up Patrick Cripps when they could have. I like Salem, but Salem Vs Cripps? A midfeild of Viney, Oliver, Brayshaw, Cripps - how unstoppable would that midfeild be? Pretty much all 18 clubs passed up on Ben Brown several times. But if you look at it on ballance, the draft is what it is - a bit of a weighted lottery in which good knowledge/recruiters can manipulate to their favour. I'm pretty happy with the ballance of players we bought through that year - Tyson (was important for a while), Salem, Vince, Nev, Harmes, Cross and who knows maybe Hunt and JKH could even end up as premiership players one day.

Just hurry up and release the whole bloody draw, I want to start making some travel plans for 2019. Does anyone know when the AFL are releasing it?

This is the biggest downside to me. The MFC needs to capitalise financialy during any period of sucess and gate takings are one good revenue stream. A game against practically any Victorian team would draw a much better crowd than Port. Yes we get to play other Victorian teams over the course of the season, but generally Rd 1 draws a bigger crowd in it's own right. MFC supporters need to get to this game on mass and create a cauldron like atmosphere, to make sure we get half a dozen cheap free kicks like Port did at their dung heap this season , just to make well and truly sure we get over the line. Get the win and hopefully we build the crowds throughout the season.

Guessing that he is more likely ready to play seniors than any raw 18 yo we select at pick 100 and has probably also shown as much or more potential than any mature age talent that gets to that point in the draft as well. He would also have the benifits of being a known quantity in terms of his team fit and professionalism.

Not that bloody literally, but it wouldn't hurt if he was the equivalent of a killer on the footy feild. Every good team gains from having a few players with a bit of mongrel and killer instinct, providing that agression is well focused and controlled. Watching how he plays, I think Spargo fits that mold pretty well.

It might be a slightly sensitive question to ask of Josh, given he was somewhat touted for the top job, but I'd genuinely be interested to know how things are settling in under new CEO Gary Pert. Has been a pretty low key transition and not without some frenzied media style controversy, but we shouldn't walk on eggs shells forever and I think it's time that the MFC members and suporters get in behind Gary a bit more and give him our suport as we drive towards the ultimate sucess.

Good points, but we are not talking age for age realitive development and ultimate potential, we are talking how gets picked in season 2019. Are the meters gained and turnovers you quoted age for age or season 2018? Certainly the turn overs are a little different to the clangers reported on the AFL site, but I guess that's not exactly apples for apples. On the subject of stats, it's interesting to note that Oscar actually has one of the highest disposal efficiencies in the side, with all defenders (including Frost) performing significantly better for this stat than mids and forwards. Still Oscar and Frost play a similar position (though perhaps slightly different roles), so it's very close to an apples for apples comparison. Interestingly Hibbard who most rate as an awsome kick doesn't have a very good disposal efficiency, all of which suggests that the more attacking the player, efficiency suffers. All about making the right decisions at the right time on when to be more attacking or conservative and maintain possession I guess and is something that the team as a whole has got much better as. Getting back more specifically to Oscar, some have certainly asserted that he has had a pretty charmed ride in a sense in terms of his development and being selected on the basis of future development ahead of his week on week actual performance, though that does present challenges in it's self (i.e. fronting up the next game with shattered confidence after getting smashed the week before). If the circumstances are right, it might actually be good for him to go back to Casey to work on some of his weaknesses at some stage like everyone else has. How times change though with people actually proposing and defending Oscar as being best 22 material. Go back a couple of years and every second poster on Demonland was demanding that he be dropped and never played again, because he wasn't and would never make an AFL standard player.

I don't understand where you get the idea that Frost is too unreliable for diposal from the stats presented. Disposal efficiency is only 5% different between them and 0.6 clangers per game. I'd also like to see how that comparison would stack up for the second half of the year, when the stats might be reversed as I recall Frosty tidying up his disposal and decision making considerably. The other minor thing of note is that Frost actually registered in the stats for score involvement, where as O Mac didn't. Stacks up perfectly to me as I distinctly remember several great passages of play that were started by Frost deep in defense that went pretty much coast to coast and through the big ones. The most memorable were against GWS and that awsome torpe from full back against the Hawks. The stat comparison I'd like to see is meters gained @Watson11 - any chance you could pull out that stat. Anyway Binman, I agree with you regards Oscar still being the junior player and potentially still with further physical and game development in him, which I'm really hoping for. I quite like O Mac as well and I'm hoping that he matures into a player of similar quality and physical strength as big brother Tommy and it's a good position to be in for the MFC to have some decient backline depth. Main point for me is that I'm a little suprised how almost all the media seem to have O Mac ahead of Frost, when both it's such a close run thing and everyone seemed to acknowledge at the time how good Frosty was at the end of the year. I'm not reading too much into anything for any of our players that game against Westcoast and probably particularly not the backline ones, it's hard to single any one player out when so many made such poor mistakes - you could say Brayshaw is a dud based on that one performance, but you'd be wrong.

He was pretty firey as a first year player and that could get even more accentuated as he gets more physical strength and confidence. Could almost be said to have the personality of Chucky as well. Could be a good asset to have a player that gets under the skin of the opposition and their supporters every week. Could be our improved version of Hayden Ballantyne.

I'm glad that footy has not become so sanitized thay the players can't enjoy a quite drink together at the appropriate time. I recon Bernie would be a great bloke to have a few beers with and Hibbo too by the sounds of it.

Wow. The star pulling power that Demonland has is impressive. I noticed that Maxy also gave Demonland a bit of a shout out in his B&F speach. That these players and officials of standing keep rocking up to give interviews is a real credit to the manner in which the moderators and administrators at Demonland run the forum. Well done guys.

The others that 'might' be borderline best 22 are: 5. Jones/Lewis - obvious age related reasons; 6. Petracca/ANB/Weid. Trac, because despite all his talent, his output and actual performance is sometimes lacking. ANB, because whilst his endurance is elite, the other areas of his game can be marginal and my impression is that he needs to be operating at pretty close to 100% to get games. Weid is marginal, only because he needs to lay down a much more substantial run of late 2018 form to cement it that he can produce that on a consistent and permanent basis. For all Jesse's detractors, he provided a pretty good level of output as the main key forward over a sustained period; 7. Preuss - purely due to team ballance. Asides from 'that' game against the Eagles, it was obvious to me in several other games throughout the season the momentum and our drive from stoppages dropped remarkably to the point of going into reverse in the periods that Gawn was off the ground (ironically Vs the Suns at the Gabba is one that stands out). Against top sides that will kill us.

Competition for spots will be fierce once again best 22 on 2018 form might be quite different to how it is seen after 2019 preseason. For mine: 1. It's a real toss-up between Frost and Oscar. Both had good and bad patches of form over the course of 2018. They are actually both pretty good runners and I think you could almost consider having one rotate off the bench. That way, we maintain some height/aerial dominance of the oppositions backline when they rotate their key forwards off. Actually if I recall correctly Oscar spends about 97% of game time out on the paddock, so it would/could be Frost predominantly rotating with Lever, May, Hibbard and possibly through a wing at times; 2. Spargo was fairly borderline in parts of 2018 and I'm struggling to reconcile that he is best 22, other than that he fills that small pressure forward /crumbing role probably better on ballance than either Hannan, Freitch and Garlett. One real asset that he has is that he plays like an angry agressive little man and that probably something that gives him a bit of an edge over others. Where I do give him some grace is that he was only a first year player last year and should get better with more good preseasons under his belt. Assuming he doesn't get second year blues, a really good preseason could see him move from borderline to clearly best 22. I'm still holding out hope that Jeffy can sort himself out. At his best, he is a blisteringly good footballer with more pace and X factor than any other player on our list. Hannan plateaued last season, but has the assets to become elite if he can take it to the next level; 3. Like others, I'd have Fritsch ahead of KK at this point, but it could be a close run thing; 4. It will be a big preseason all around. Pleanty of talent sitting outside the best 22 KK, J Smith, Hunt, Stretch, JKH, Wagner all have potential to be best 22 if they lift another 20% in some areas and/or others drop off.

Was re-watching our game Vs Carlton the other day and that hit Bernie put on Daisy Thomas was an absolute ripper. Hard to imagine that Bernie won our B&F just 2 or 3 seasons ago. It's a shame Bernie dropped away so quickly this year. Would have loved to have seen this bloke play finals for us.

Would there have been a time when we had all of Gawn, Martin, Spencer, Fitzpatrick and Russian on ours? At thr time, Gawn was probably a 19 yo recovering from an ACL as well.

I understand the pragmatism, but a big part of me wishes that Trenners was still on our list somehow. Glad to see he has been held onto by Port.