warren dean

Viney has signed with Crows as mid-field coach.

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sport/afl...8-19742,00.html

Returned to SA as reported in this mornings HUN

I don't know about leadership, but I'm pretty happy with Whelan at 50 and Bruce at 64. They have given excellent value for their relative draft positions. I was never a huge fan of CAC but he got those two pretty right.

Deanox, your call on Wheatley is right - he is a useful player. Re Green - in 07 when we beat Adelaide at the G I thought he more than anyone else influenced the result of that game. Again, he is a good player without reaching the heights of superstardom. Is he a leader? Probably not.

Brad Green was pick 18 I'm pretty sure.

We lost our first round pick due to salary cap breaches. We got pick 19 from Frenmantle in exchange for Troy Longmuir. We used 19 on Green, 20 on Wheatley, 50 on Whelan and 64 on Bruce.

My concern is that he was our CEO before our merger talks last time we nearly died.

No he wasn't.

Loved Flower and Gerard Healy when we weren't much good. Devastated when Healy chased the bucks to Sydney. My next hero was Bret Bailey for his match winning goal in the 87 Night GF. Loved the late 80's backline of Wight, Hughes and Johnson. All time favourite would have to be Schwarta! His efforts in 94 (especially the Carlton and Footscray finals) were the stuff of legend. No doubt would have been one of the all time greats but for injury. Oh, and of course Warren Dean!

John Ralph reported at half time of the Swans/Cats match on Channel 10 that Cameron Schwab had been offered the CEO role and declined. He also said that the club had met with Robbie Warnock last week, given him the full tour, powerpoint etc and used 8 of our younger players to encourage him to join the Demons next year. He said that other clubs felt that Melbourne was over the line to secure his services.

Has a team ever had an average winning margin of 3.5 points or lower at the end of a season?

1981 - MFC had an average winning margin of 1 point. We won just the one match for the season against the Doggies - by one point, obviously!

Just finished the bio of Norm Smith by Ben Collins. A really good read and appears to be very balanced. Some interesting points: the "silvertail" myth is certainly exposed as just that, certainly from the football side of things; Len Smith was certainly an impressive figure and in many ways he was possibly the most influential figure in the modernisation of the game; as always disunity is death; and Smith's greatest coaching feat was no doubt getting South Melbourne into the finals in 1970. The whole Smith ethos on "team" stands out right throughout - as a player and a coach.

Well done to Ben Collins!

For more info: www.theredfox.com.au

Sounds to me as though Fox is a key member of whats going on at Geelong, and It would be tough to get him.

On the contrary, Grimesy! Once Cook dismissed the idea of moving to the GC, Stuart Fox was blocked from the top job at Geelong. He was always talked up as being in the top 3 for the MFC job (with MacNamee and Mick Conlan), and it appears that he was probably Stynes' first choice. It is a lot less tougher to get him than it was a couple of weeks ago!

I must admit i am quite surprised and impressed by essendons resurgence of late, and good on Matthew Knights for sticking it up all he detractors after the beltings they were copping earlier in the season.

However, i beleive we are in a better position than the Bombers in terms of a rebuild, simply because we are developing a new spine, whilst half of Essendons spine are still carrying a their young team, and will most likely be gone in 2 years time.

Look at last night for example, 9 goals between Lloyd and Lucas, while Fletcher still holds down a key defensive post. Now i know Bombers supporters will throw names at me like Nash and Ryder and say these players will be ready to go when the others leave, but they won't have had the two or three years of experience actually being the main man in the gun in a KP role like some of our guys would have. And as they win more games, they ate less llikely to be in position to draft the best new talent.

Don't forget Gumbleton was a no 2 pick (taken after Gibbs). That young fellow can really play and will be an excellent KPP if injuries don't destroy him. He has had a shocking run so far but if he gets himself right he will be an excellent CHF/CHB. I think Ryder has proven to be developing nicely, and he has certainly had some major challenges thrown his way and their mid-field looks like it is coming along. They will lose Lucas, Lloyd and Fletcher over the next couple of seasons for sure, but I would say they are planning to replace them now. Their ruck strength looks pretty good to me so I think they are building nicely. I'd say there is still a bit of guesswork surrounding both teams future spines but I don't see us any more advanced than Essendon. Like you, I too am impressed with the work of Knights and his coaching panel re the rapid improvement in some of their players.

Those that cannot identify the sheer class and pedigree of Watts have been noted in my fact file. I doubt I'll ever take anything said by these clueless footy fans again.

Not that it matters. As those that are charged with identifying the very best talent aren't influenced by the dim witted.

Watts is as an exciting a prospect as I've seen in a long while.

And should we own first selection at seasons end he will be playing for the Demons in 2009! Furthermore, don't be so certain that the WA teams will overlook him if they have a chance to get him!

Not to nitpick or anything, but Big Jimmy didn't play a grand final. He would've played one had he not crossed the mark in that Hawthorn prelim (a heartbreaking thing to even think about). He's still ahead though!

Yeah he did. He was our best player in the 88 debacle. They only played the one year together (98) and Whitey finished fourth in the B&F. For what it's worth, i reckon the best genuine ruck we have had in the last 20 years was Strawbs O'Dwyer. He was sensational in 87 and 88. Won the B&F the year we made the Granny, played for the Big V and unfortunately got rubbed out in the Prelim in 88. Bad knees got him within a couple of years. Out of Stynes and White, I'd take Jimmy.

Yeah we was the best coach in my lifetime, Even with ND who did very well you just never knew what team would run out onto the ground, with northey it was always going to be a hard tough team who would give there all.

I agree, the best coach we've had since NS. He inherited some excellent juniors from the Slug Jordan school- Greg Healy, Yeats, Grinter, Connolly, Newport etc, but he moulded together a team that was very difficult to beat. Five consecutive finals series after 24 years out of September was a mighty effort, especially given the era - Hawthorn, Carlton, Geelong, Essendon and the Eagles were all outstanding teams throughout this period. Even Collingwood won a flag. Actually, I used to argue often with my Collingwood supporting friends as to who was the better coach out of Northey and Matthews. We played finals every year from 87-91 and always won at least one final. The Pies played finals from 88-90, didn't win a final in 88 or 89 (we put them out both years), but got the breaks in 90 and won the most open season I have ever seen (incidentally, the same year we ended Hawthorn's GF streak). In fact other than that 1990 final series, Matthews never won another final as coach of the Pies! I'd say Matthews would take the points now though!!

His record overall is pretty impressive. One year with the Swans and then he came to us - finals 5 out of 7 years, 3 years at the Tigers and into a Prelim in his last year (first finals appearance since 82 for them), and then another prelim with the Bears in 96 and then a sliding finals appearance with new Lions before getting the flick in 98. Arguably the best coach in VFL/AFL history not to win a flag!

A good topic Jerry! I reckon he could become one of the very good run-with players. He has a great tank - everyone knows of his beep test exploits at te draft camp. He will never be a reliable marking target up forward; I think a defensive mid-field role is the go.

Cam has been a fine player over a long period. He is no superstar but he has performed to a creditable level over long enough to be regarded as a worthy AFL player. His best games have often been in run with role. He has played well on Hird and Brad Johnson in this role and at this stage of his career it is what he should be doing. His great advantage with this role is that he can hurt teams going the other way. The problem he has at the moment is a limited pre season and an unrealistic expectation. I don't think he has ever been a match winner, more of a saver. Todays effort was not one of his best but he wasn't Robinson Crusoe! The skill level of most of our senior players was appalling and their lack of preparedness to run, carry, distribute etc etc was in stark contrast to what would be expected of a side genuinely having a dip!

A question for the statisitical boffins out there - has any coach had a worse start in terms of losing margin to their coaching career than Bailey? I can't remember any that have managed to lose by more than 100 in their first game. I hope somebody has!!!

I think I may have been onto something when I posted this one after round 1. A few people went a bit early on Cam I believe. His last two games on Johnson and Johnson have been pretty good and the coaching panel obviously read my comments above after the Hawks game. As I said then his best value to us now is playing on someone.

http://www.melbournefc.com.au/tabid/7415/D...px?newsid=57066

Interesting article ...

I think Whiteys mind is playing tricks! We had a couple of ordinary ones mid season according to my season highlights tape (the one where Todd Viney talks you through every game), including a particularly nasty one against St Kilda but no 100 point losses. The big losses were when we had a lot of experienced blokes out injured (including Neitz with a broken leg). We actually started the season well - an honourable loss to the Dockers in Round 1 in Perth and then a 25 point win against North in round 2.

Another AFL/Club Support Member here, plus 1 6 year old who is signed up as a Demon and 5 year old daughter who refuses to be cajoled into supporting the mighty D's and instead signed up as a Kangaroo member at the Casey Fields Practice Match. I tried my best but couldn't compete with Brent Harvey and the Kangaroo mascot!

At least get it right, it was a takeover not a merge that is way the hawks went against it, that's the problem with this club some people don't want to believe the facts.

The membership voted for the Melbourne Hawks (velcro Hawk and all) and against the Melbourne Demons. Those are the facts!

He picked the woeful coach ahead of a legend in Sheedy. The players are not playing for him. Bailey refused to get rid of the [censored] in Yze, Green and Miller. He refused to pick up any kid with pace and traded Johnstone for the worst possible result a kid with a bad back. GARRY STAY THE [censored] AWAY FROM THE CLUB BEFORE YOU KILL IT.

Gardiner has had his time, he refuses to put the club first and we desperately need a president that does just that. Time to go Gardiner.

If Bailey wants any credibility he must drop Green and McLean.

McLean has to get his finger out of his ass and get superfit he can't shrug taggers and until he can he will always be a disappointment.

He better start getting rid of brain dead idiots like Carroll, Wheatley and Miller get Rivers back into the side and start developing Martin.

I too would have loved to have seen Sheeds at the Club, but it wasn't to be! The best we can do now is all (players, admin, supporters and members) unite behind Bailey. The fact is, since 1980 we have had only 4 coaches (except for very small roles played by Riley and Hutchison). Barassi did 5 years, Northey 7, Balme 5 and Daniher 10. So by my reckoning, Bailey will be in the job for a few more years yet. I believe he has a three year contract which the club won't break-they can't afford to. Give him some time and lets see where we are by mid year. Improvement won't necessarily be measured by wins but I'm certain there will be some headway made.

To those who don't want to lay any blame at the feet of Bailey, remember this - he went through the entire process which involved an evaluation of our list. He must have realised that our list is neither particularly quick or possessed of a lot of skill. Either that or he completely bullshitted! He then institutes a game plan which Hards has had a look at in another thread based loosely on the run and carry methodology which relies heavily on the aforementioned. He needed a gameplan which reflected the talent available to him. This is not that plan - it wasn't for Balme in the '90's either.

NO MERGER!!!

We shouldn't be bringing up ghosts from the past! The Melbourne Demons will never merge or relocate! Those who suggested a merger should have realised they were wrong and that it would NEVER happen!

ALL Melbourne supporters need to get behind the club and support it!

GO DEMONS!!! LET'S SMASH THE BULLDOGS!!! :angry:

On the contrary Supreme, I think we should never forget that this did in fact happen. As Anthony quite rightly points out, there was some significant "behind the play" manouverings at work but the fact is indisputable, Court action notwithstanding, that the MFC membership voted itself out of existence that night. I voted NO and was crushed that night when the results came in - the news from Hawthorn made me feel only slightly better! Everybody should get behind the Demons to ensure that this doesn't happen again - 30,000 members and a base at Casey Fields (even if only for the summer) would be a great start!

Well..I didnt see him have a pot at Sheeds... and it was his assessment of the situation that was quite good..had nothign to do with his ability or otherwise as a coach.

WD..Id say your comments reflect more about what you think of Walls..than his ability to put anything balanced or sensible together.

Yeah, you're probably right, although, I thought his mention of Sheedy in the article was an opportunity to rub it iin that he had applied for the job with some enthusiasm and was overlooked despite his record in favour of a novice. Maybe just my interpretation - but I don't like the bloke at all - on that score you are correct!

I, and every Melbourne supporter i know would drop off the club if it merged.

pathetic thread

"Those who do not learn from history are condemned to repeat it"

You obviously have ignored the fact that the membership of this club is the only one in league history to actually vote its club out of existence! But for Don Scott and his ability to rally the Hawk membership, we would now be the Dorks! This is not a pathetic thread at all!!

Don't get too excited - the article is by Robert Walls- quite possibly the worst coach in league history to win a flag (purchased, by the way!). He hates Sheedy so any opportunity to pot him won't be missed. I like the way he pumps up his own tyres in that he mentions Rohde contacted him to meet with Bailey. Has zero credibility after his call on the Swans back in mid 2005. I think Paul Roos was right to have nothing to do with him. Says it all really!!

Jarka, you make some very valid points, and as you know, I agree with much of what you have to say. CAC did have 10 years to assemble a list that has us in pretty much the same position as when he arrived at the club. I do believe though, as I stated earlier in the thread that the uneven playing field re recruiting/drafting rules and regs over the past 10 years makes it difficult to rank clubs in order of success. Like you, I believe we have been just average.