demonmerv

by not selecting a player like Sam Hayes we may have missed the opportunity to find a replacement for Pedersen in 2019. Someone who would compliment Gawn and give us that tall to monster opposition backs.

On ‎23‎/‎11‎/‎2017 at 8:16 AM, Deeprived Childhood said:

Every time Fritsch takes a hanger for us, i will be reminded of what JW made us pay.

big chance that may never happen!

1 hour ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Good article on JT going to Port.  http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-11-17/trengove-happy-with-upfront-and-honest-hinkley

He noted:  "The other thing that struck me about Ken is that he really does just focus on what you can bring to the team, opposed to the little inefficiencies you need to improve on...for a player that's been around for a few years now, it's great to hear what you can do again".

Watts said something similar in a post trade interview.  I don't think either meant to chip Goodwin or Macca but it makes one wonder about positive motivation vs 'carrot and stick', post Roos.  

On a lighter note JT is the designated 'chaperone' for Watts:  "Ken was pretty keen for me to live with (Jack) to keep him on the straight and narrow."  Watts said in a recent interview they will share a house at Henley Beach. 

Having his mate who knows his way round Adelaide, is a known hard worker/trainer to buddy with, may just be the making of Jack Watts. 

Wish them every success.

Well said LH. You beat me to it. Only thing we differ on is I think it was a sneaky dig at the coach. Amazing two players who wanted to stay say similar comments.

I think we should be looking for some tall players. We always seem to get monstered by tall marking forwards like ben brown and we lack that same pressure. Other than big Maxxy, King and Filipovic we have no body around 200cm. Jack was our next tallest at 196cm and of course Simon Goodwin ( or should I say Simon Badloss) sacked him. I would think we would be looking at Sam Hayes or Charlie Ballard, or even Connor Ballanden if we can wrestle him from the Lions.

5 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Put pick 6 under there nose for a few days and they will look at it differently. 

Particularly if Cameron is leaving as well

I appreciate your view even though I don't agree. however your comment about "New boy:" is poor form. I have been on this forum since before 2010 and read most items . I have not posted much because I haven't bothered because there is far too many  Il informed comments. But This particular topic is very close to my heart.

47 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

If Jack wants to go to the Filth i would rather get Pick 6 than have pick 10. Gives us more Room to move with Radelaide

i have done my research thankyou

no need to be so rude new boy

I am not being rude. I am stating fact. Adelaide want our first pick this year. Whether it is 6 or 10 will not sway the crows. they want our first pick plus more.

4 hours ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Pick 6 is a great outcome, if it happens...

Think about it . pick 10 or pick 6 . Adelaide are going to get that plus one more pick . at present they are asking for pick 10 and our first pick for 2018. If we exchange pick 10  for pick 6, then we virtually give Jack to the filth for nothing. please do some research before posting

15 hours ago, ChewyOnMyBoot said:

Was interested in the comment above (that I have bolded) that inferred that the comparisons between Lynch (Adelaide) and Watts based on the 2 year 'performance' data that I provided earlier (and which showed that there isn't really a significant difference in their stats) would be quite different if I extended the period to 5 seasons instead of 2.

So I thought yeah, lets look at the last 5 years. I admit that I too thought that this would show a very different picture to the 2 year comparison.

But it doesn't (as far as I can see).
Averages for the last 5 seasons (2013-2017) 

Adding my comments from my previous post on this so that they can be read in context of the above 5 year data:

Interestingly, in the areas where it seems people (and the general football public) seem to have a real concern with Jack (the contest e.g. Tackles, Contested possessions, Contested marks and One percenters), Jack is certainly 'up' with Lynch.

I'm not convinced that Jack is used/sought out as the 'link player' at Melbourne in quite the same way as Lynch. Adelaide looks with much more intention/purpose for Lynch than we do for Jack (who I think quite often makes fantastic position on the ground but is overlooked).  I'm not certain, but I'm thinking this could explain the reason that Jack is below in total disposals.

I find the stats really interesting given the level of praise that generally gets heaped on Lynch as a player and as a link man by the media compared to what Jack cops. Just sayin'! It kind of adds to my confusion and inability to come to a definite pro or nay Jack position in my own mind.

 

This all goes to show why statements (of opinion) on player performance like the ones often made about MFC players (and seemingly  in particular Watts), that aren't based facts, can be quite misleading. Some would say irresponsible.

For me it shows how biases (which I'm sure are the result of the expectations created by the preaching directed at us 9 years ago that the messiah had arrived and would lead us out of the wilderness) can result in distorted 'impressions' and opinions - ones that aren't supported by the facts anyway.

Following are links to my source for the above data in case anyone wants to check up on me:

https://afltables.com/afl/stats/players/T/Tom_Lynch0.html

https://afltables.com/afl/stats/players/J/Jack_Watts.html

Disclaimer: If any of the data is incorrect (I have triple checked it because i was surprised by the results) it is quite unintentional. I am neither pro or nay Watts. Just like to take the emotions and bias out of performance assessment.

Finally some facts. Dont forget Jack averaged 15 disposals over his whole career. This of course included his first year as a 17 year old when he averaged 9. It is also fact that he played in a crappy team that did not very often honour his leads due to poor skills and other reasons. A lot on here are clouded by their own il informed dislike of Jacks footy. Have a read of jack Watts on Wikipedia to see the real facts.

5 minutes ago, mo64 said:

Trading Woey and Powell may or may not have been the right decision, but in 2002 we were stiff not to beat Adelaide, and make the Pelim. So the decision hardly set back the club.

The Fork's analogy with Travis Johnstone is spot on. 

Thankfully clubs don't make football decisions based on fan polls.

And while we're on irrational fan behaviour. Remember the "Focus On Footy" group. They're the group of Richmond people who wanted to overthrow the Richmond board, primarily so that they could sack Hardwick. I wonder if we'll see their faces at the celebrations.

We will never know but with Woey and Powell in the team we might have got to the GF. Travis was 27 when we traded him and got pick 14. was that Grimes. Travis played three years at Brisbane and averaged 20 touches a game.

10 minutes ago, the fork said:

This thread has me reminiscing about the Travis Johnstone thread all those years ago.

'He's our best kick, the most talented player on our list' they said.

'He's popular amongst our group, it'll destroy the fabric of the club' they said.

'He'll carve it up at his new club. We'll regret ever trading him' they said.

'This is a rookie coach looking to make a statement unaware he's making a huge mistake' they said.

Who knows I might even have been one of 'them'. We all think we know what's best for club and player but the ones closest to the decision having to be made are the ones we are forced to trust, they too are the ones that will live with the decision and its consequences. I support the direction the club is taking. We've been crying out for someone to take the club by the scruff of the neck and give it a shake. We've asked much of Watts since being drafted and he still falls short of what we know he is capable of. Does that remind you of any other former number one draft picks?

This was also a bad decision by our club. Did it improve our club , no it did not. Travis went on to play some good games at Brisbane. You are right in saying it did not split our club, but it is also true that Travis was not as popular as Jack Watts. I will also say that taking a good player out of our side at that time made little difference as we were not that good. At present we have the potential to go places and can ill afford to lose a tall player of Jacks quality.

14 minutes ago, mo64 said:

Give me a spell. What a load of tripe. You're basing his importance on our club promos?

How does losing a player, who has had 1 good year in 9, set the club back? 

You say that you are a 20 year member, but I'm curious to know how long you've been following the club? In the 45 years that I've been following the club, the only player that we let go that set back the club was James McDonald. But the club was tanking at the time, so you could understand the logic.

 

I don't really need to answer your dig at me but I will. I am 67 years old and have been following the Dees since I was 4 years old when my mother knitted me a red and blue jumper. I attended the 1958 grand final. the only one we lost in the late fifties and have not seen us win a flag since I was 14.  If you can remember 2000, we moved on shane wowodin (Bad spelling) and traded powell to Stkilda. I believe that was wrong. You are right getting rid of James Mac was stupid. Have a look at the vote at the top of this discussion  at least 75% of Melbourne supporters want Jack to stay at our club. That my friend will split the club mark my words

11 minutes ago, WERRIDEE said:

Watts won't be the difference between winning or losing a premiership. He's clearly a poor trainer. Pressure wins premierships, and Watts has never been good at pressure acts. That's how an ordinary side like Richmond won it. Pressure, pressure, pressure that's what it's all about and Watts doesn't do it.  

absoulute rubbish. Watts is not an in and under player. he is a finisher, If the ball is delivered correctly and he is used he will provide the finish. he has been used all over the ground to cover our deficiencies and has done it well.how many times did we see him kick a goal and then pop up soon after in the back line stopping a forward thrust by the opposition. Some of you people don't seem to understand footy at all. He had a good year but like other players came back from injury underdone. was that his fault or was he brought back too soon, we will never know. I am so annoyed at all the Watts bashers. Goodwin hung him out to dry pre season, when he could have easily said we are trying others on the list and dealt with Jack in private. I don't think Jack has ever got the support of the club during his career. This club will regret it if Jack departs.

1 minute ago, loges said:

If Watts had played for Adelaide today he would have been in the worst half a dozen players on the ground

he was in the best players when we were beaten in round 23 by the riff raff from Collingwood. Where were all the guns when we needed them in such an important game for the club. It pisses me off all the so called Melbourne supporters who continually ridicule  our players all the time, Im over it.

I am a twenty year member of the Melbourne Football club and have been as passionate and patient as anybody. However I am absoulutely disgusted with Goodwin and the Club for telling Jack to explore his options. Jack Watts is an integral part of this club. We are horribly short of 195cm plus skillfull players. I believe jack to be very important to our future. Just take a look at the club promotions on the website and elsewhere. Jack is upfront in everything. If he goes then we stand to lose membership, sponsorship and supporters. This will split the club mark my words. In fact I will be reassessing my involvement. I have always believed Jack Watts was a very important part of our next premiership, which I am starting to think is now a very long way away. Goodwin has concerned me as the season has gone on and he is close to losing me totally. If Watts goes then Goodwin will struggle to see his contract out. This is going to set the Melbourne Football club back a long way. It saddens me to say this but that's the situation we face now. I was very down today watching the grand final knowing that when we start to get to a position of possibly challenging for the flag , we start to trade the players most likely to get us there.

take em both

Weed is going to be a good player for us. However I still say it was crazy to bring him in now. Surely if Goodwin wants to make a statement to Jack he should find another way. Last week Jack had 10 touches and 1 goal in AFL (including goal assists). Sam had 9 touches and 1 goal in the VFL. How that was ever going to be a receipe for success is beyond me. Its one thing to look at a player and say he is not performing to the required level and its another thing to say who could do better. Oh that's right at the moment we don't have anyone who will be better. Hulett is even further from being ready..

Viney is tough like Selwood, but is not a bleeder

Canberra demon . put a Victorian postcode in to pick up that state.

Thanks Nasher streaming it now . great picture

come on fellas. we people interstate don't have vision of this game. please tell us what is happening and what the score is.

Im more annoyed with Shuey getting off. he ignored the ball and collected Dangerfield in the head. it is bloody rubbish that it all hangs on how the player comes up. It was a dangerous act and he should not be playing against us this week. He gets off, but because Carltons medical staff talk crap that Cripps and Rowe were hurt we lost Lewis and Hogan for weeks. MRP extremely inconsistent and do not make our code look smart.

North rearranged team this morning, exchanges bench players for some in team. Unusual? what are they up to. I think they are rearranging deck chairs on the titanic

I thought kent was good tonight. Did his job. We look better with kent in the team.

Jack watts, Ron Barassi, Ray Biffen, Ross Dillon, David Schwarz, Rod Grinter, Jim Stynes, Allan jackovich, Russell Robertson, Robbie Flower.

Fav non Melbourne player Sam kekovich.

Most of you did very well. I could only manage 10,9,10,12,10.