dtrinh

Interested to see how he goes... he has had some off field issues... hopefully not a bad influence around our club!

What are your thoughts on how Frawley will go now he is in Hawthorn? I rekon at the Hawks he could become an all Australian next year. He'll take the best/ second best forward depending on how healthy Lake is. He doesn't need to run the ball out of defence anymore since he's got birchall and suckling around him which will means his weakness won't be exploited as much coming out of defence. He's got the ultimate chop out player in Gibson coming third man up. Hawthorn's defence is going to be very strong next year. Gibson used to have to take a power forward and try to go third man up, with Lake and Frawley there, Gibbo will be free to roam the defence as a free backman taking uncontested/ contested marks.

The initial highlights of billy were a bit worrying... the ones posted on the demons website look exciting. Appears to be a player that has good game sense, good disposal, doesn't seem to be scared of contact and can run and carry a bit too. Hopefully we can develop him into a midfielder/ winger!

Since Schroeder was delisted I'd consider picking him up. He looked good at VFL level and difficult to break into cats side. Only thing to consider is why someone of the calibre was delisted- U'd think maybe he didn't buy into the geelong culture? then if so maybe he wouldn't be a great pick up.

Random but how about Matthew Wright from Adelaide. I love the way he plays footy... hard as nails, does the one percenters and has good skills. Was ripping it up in Adelaides midfield in the preseason but was played in the forward line all year. I rekon he could be a smoky if he was put into the midfield.

He should be on Melbourne's radar. Tough inside player that can spread hard at the contest. His disposal efficiency isn't terrible? and managed to get a fair bit of ball through the midfield. Defs would add to our midfield depth and be able to rotate on the forward flanks too.

I agree he will be an upgrade for our team coming out of our backline but I dunno how much we should give for him. If it was a direct swap between Clark and him maybe since we're bound to lose Clark anyway.

But as people have mentioned his disposal is questionable. He isn't a great defender but a decent run and carry and long kick down the line player but I don't think we're trying to play that type of game anymore. Under Mick Malthouses game plan he was great and thats when he got his AA, but in recent seasons he has stagnated a lot and I'm not sure he has that penetrating kick coming out of the backline that we really need such as a nick malceski. I'm just hoping we don't pay overs for him!

Matthew Leunberger would be a massive get! He'd easily take the no.1 ruck mantle at melbourne. It'd make either Jamar or Gawn the second ruckman. Leunberger was one of the dominant ruckman in the competition when healthy. He's tall, mobile, good tap ruckman and great around the ground. Jamar is a good tap ruckman but still does not give much around the ground. Gawn has struggled to stay healthy and needs more time to develop.

Just watched the replay, if we can get the ball into Viv's hands more often we'd be a better side. He's got some speed, uses the ball well by foot! Hopefully we can get a full preseason into him!

I read the '16' line first, thought jnrmac is having a laugh till I read the names. Can't argue much which is sad.

The only one I'd keep is Jamar. He isn't great and won't return to his A/A year but I like him being there as it forces Gawny to work hard for his spot. Gawn was literraly smashing the door down to get a game at Casey and he has been solid since. I think next year Gawn will be the number 1 ruckman for us but I still have doubts on his body. I'd retain Jamar for backup as have no faith in Spencil.

Other than that your list is spot on.

The only players I consider best 22:

FB: Jetta Dunn ****

HB: ***** McDonald *****

C: Vince Jones *****

HF: ***** Dawes *****

FF: **** Hogan Gawn

R: Jamar, Viney, Tyson

Everyone else in the team has some serious work to do and Jamar is on thin ice.

I have no doubt Salem, Trenners, Viney, JKH, Kent, Toump etc will become good players but they are yet to really show this on a consistent basis.

We have a lot of work to do.

I think you're spot on there. In terms of players that give 100% and have the skills to go at AFL level thats about it, even then McDonald has major flaws in his game. I'd probably add Cross into that team there too.

Let's hope that the pre-season is massive and we see big improvements in the rest of our list or we trade in some big names!

We all know the list of players who aren't getting games in the seniors who will most likely get delisted: Blease, tapscott, terlich, evans, strauss etc. What we should be more concerned about are players that are in the team at the moment who aren't up to standard. We really need to have a big look at ourselves and see who will improve and hopefully make it and those that just don't have the skills to do it.

Players this year who have disappointed and needs to improve:

- Grimes: a true professional and courage but just isn't improving his disposal

- Garland: was a great defender last year, helped chop off the ball and was able to use the ball coming out of defence. This year poor disposal isn't coming in third man up when needs to and making errors he wasn't last year

- Viney: tough one, hard as nails and goes into every contest 100% but would be sooo much more effective if he could hit targets. You see glimpses of it but just doesn't do it enough

- Watts: great skills, if it's anyone you want the ball in their hands it's Watts, just has great game sense and usually makes good decisions. Just doesn't go hard enough

- M. Jones: runs all day but just poor decision making

- Bail: applies forward line pressure but what's the point if he can't kick goals when he gets the chances or help set up goals after putting the pressure on and causing the turnover

- McDonald: really needs to put on some size, I don't understand- his position doesn't need someone that can win time trials at our club, what we really need is him to put on more size to play against the bigger men. He's great spoiling on the lead but one-on- one in a wrestling match can't match it with the big boys. Everyone knows he can't kick but still tries to do too much

- Dawes: he tries sooo hard every game, but I can see how he can get frustrated, the ball coming into him is terrible, what can we expect from him

- Jamar: good tap ruckman but doesn't give much around the ground. Really time to give Gawn the no.1 ruck spot and maybe play jamar as the 2nd ruckman in the forward line

I think this pre-season PR is really going to concentrate on 2 main things apart from teaching more of the game plan: endurance to allow players to run both ways and provide leads which we can actually make, 2. skills- really need to teach the team how to kick and handball again which is sad considering thats what they get paid to do.

Defence:

So in defence two real glaring positions we are missing are:

- A tall defender that reads the play well and can leave their opponent and go third man up. If Frawley stays and goes back then I think Dunn would be ideal in this position. He's playing out of his skin at the moment against much bigger and taller opponents, so I think if Frawley can take the first key forward, McDonald the second then Dunn or Pederson can take the third and hopefully be the ' Josh Gibson/ Nick Maxwell kind of player' Too many times this year it's just been one on one coming into our defensive 50 and although both McDonald and Dunn have stood up, it's just not enough

- Running back flank that has high disposal efficiency: This is one our biggest killers. So many times the ball gets to McDonald, Grimes, M. Jones and it gets turned over just as quickly as it comes out which pretty much gifts the opposition a goal. That or we manage to get the ball out of the 50 and just don't have the elite kick that needs to find the next player up the ground which has found space. Howe isn't bad but we aren't finding him enough. McDonald has to drum it into his head that if he is going to kick it, it's either to someone under NO pressure or kick it long down the boundary. I think they're trying to groom a few players in toumpas, strauss and maybe clisby. The only one at this stage I know has the skills but needs to develop more is toumpas.

Midfield:

I guess we need class and grunt.

- The core group is going to develop ok

- Viney is just a bull, will need to improve his disposal but he has the endeavour to do that

- Jones, Viney, Cross, Tyson are really our core

- Really hoping to bring in some class but more development in Mitchie, Riley, Salem hopefully will help them out

Forwards:

In the forward line we're lacking players that can rotate effectively through the midfield and key positions.

- Hopefully with Hogan coming into the team this will help with structure. With Dawes and Hogan as our key forwards then gawn and jamar will be our resting third talls.

Geez today really emphasised a problem we knew we've had for years.. We've just got players that have poor game sense and footy skills. We don't have many players today that have very penetrating kicks or damaging disposal. All our players have to take a N. Jones as an example... even though he's not the best kick he's definitely improved on it's penetration and decision making. I remember when he used to have pretty average disposal efficiency, but now he has improved significantly.

I'm hoping that players that we have recruited for that reason can break into our team, players like toumpas, salem are two great examples, others who have been on our list for a while and hopefully can have a big preseason would be players like strauss.

From our current list the only players that are probably up to AFL standard in terms of ball use would include: N. Jones, J. Howe, B. Vince, L. Dunn, J. Watts. Thats compared to players that have average ball use that get a game week in and week out: D. Terlich, M. Jones, T. Mac, J. Frawley, J. Grimes, R. Bail, J. Mckenzie.

SEN was talking about teams defence and mentioned how the talls usually need other players that HAVE to give the ball to when coming out of defence: birchall, suckling, B. Smith, M. Jaensch, Malceski, Hibberd, Dempsy etc... all the good teams have these players. What I don't understand is why Melbourne persists with giving the ball to T. Mac to run and kick out of defence. It should be cemented into his head and the players around him to get a good kick to run behind him to recieve the handball or short kick.

Either we need a big preseason on development of skills or we need to recruit these players from outside.

Would geary be a good pick up?

Not sure about Maxxy, even though he had 87 hit outs Brad Miller said he wasn't dominant as in his hit outs weren't too advantage. Maxxy looks good as the number one ruckman because he can make his way around the ground and collect disposals and contested possessions. In the forward line he's still a liability... Not quick off the lead, doesn't chase hard to keep forward line pressure and isn't taking contested marks either. I think he needs a lot more development before he can take the mantle as no.1 ruckman.

A bit early to call for Toumpas's head. He's got heaps of talent and most importantly he's got good disposal efficiency by foot. If he can build on his defensive pressure and contested possessions he can be a decent player. If you look at all the good teams, they build teams on players that can hit targets... if we've got one who has talent why would we want to get rid of him?

We currently have no players who can kick bags of goals (cant count Hogan until he plays and actually does it).. we would be in no place to say no.

Adelaide: Walker

Collingwood: Cloke

Fremantle: Pavlich

Geelong: Hawkins

Giants: Cameron

Hawks: Gunston, Roughead

Port: Schulz

Richmond: Riewoldt

Stkilda: Riewoldt

Sydney: Franklin, Tippett

WCE: Darling, Lecras, Kennedy

There are only a few teams that i didnt name that have quality power forwards and with the exception of Essendon and North (who Petri arguably fits the criteria), none of these teams are top 8. I could put Lynch in for GC, but havent seen enough of him personally to say that.

The issue is, we need a forward that can kick big goals, we thought that would be Clark, and we are unlucky it wasnt.

Based on the statistics of teams making the 8 without prominent forwards, i do not see Melbourne in any position to turn down a player of Riewoldt's calibre.

Totally agree, our forward line of Dawes, Frawley, Pederson, Gawn/ Jamar doesn't look dangerous. None at this stage, maybe apart from Dawes looks like they can kick more than a couple of goals a game. Hopefully Hogan becomes that player with Dawes as a back up forward. At this stage i think one of Pederson or Frawley will have to move back. If Frawley goes back then hopefully that will free up Dunn to be the third man up player. With more development hopefully Howe and Dunn become our backline quarterbacks.

FB: Terlich Frawley Dunn

HB: Grimes McDonald Garland

C: Watts Jones Vince

HF: Howe Dawes Trengove

FF: Kent Clarke Hogan

Foll: Jamar/ Spencer Viney Tyson

Bench: Mckenzie, Cross, Blease

S: Michie

With the incoming players from the draft this give us more depth in the midfield: grimes, vince, howe, kent, viney, tyson, mckenzie, cross, blease

Depth players: pick 9, M. Jones, byrnes, Luke Tapscott, Mitch Clisby, evans, fitzpatrick, pederson.

It sounds like Roos is interested in having a possible senior coach in each of his line coaches. It seems like Jade Rawlings has done a great job with the backline this year so it would be good to keep him. In terms of other possible coaches I rekon it'd be good to get Voss and Ling in. Both are premiership captains, are respected and seem to be keen in coaching. Ling is untried but you can imagine the teaching and coaching he would be able to provide. Voss didn't seem to be out of depth as a senior coach but to step up into head coach with no tutalage would have been tough. If he comes to Melbourne now, he knows he's got one of the best coaches to learn from. It would be good to keep Davey and McDonald around as development coaches if possible.

FB: Garland Frawley Dunn

HB: Grimes McDonald

C: Howe Jones Toumpas

HF: Kent

Also would love to see Howe play more on the wing. With Dawes, Clark and Hogan in the forward line I think that gives us flexibility with Howe and he can rest up forward. He defintely has the skills and speed to play on the wing and would be a great leading option coming out of the backline.

Watching the Bulldogs game... I really don't see Gawn being our No.1 ruck man in the short term future. He looks to have skills but at this stage in his career he really needs to build on his endurance and add a few Kg's to his frame. Against Minson he was just bullied in the ruck because he didn't have enough size and strength. I don't mind Spencer at this stage... he really seems to work hard and he has second efforts once the ball hits the ground... seems to love the contest and looks to tackle and get into the contested stuff. Might not have the polish as a few others but maybe having him as no.1 and clark no.2 would be good?

Yeah I think it would be a good idea to sign him up... He would be a lot better than Gillies at the club and bring everything that we would be hoping for, contested ball player, good attitude, good leadership, experience and high training standards especially in a line which we need help in.

Not sure about getting rid of David Mission- remember we had a very poor endurance base prior to him coming to the club. It seems from all the reports over the preseasons since he has been head of the department that we have had major improvements with our fitness. I would perserve with him as he has had a proven track record and seems to be a respected sport scientist.

Wondering on people's views on our coaching panel and the overhaul that should happen at our club. I think the coaching system itself is good with all the extra assistant coaches but just the line coaches I am a bit worried about.

Brian Royal: He has been at our club for a long time and since taking over our midfield group i'm not sure there has been much development there. Apart from Nathan Jones and I guess Jack Viney the rest of the midfield aren't up to scratch. I understand that it is to do with the personnel but not sure if he has that much value at the club anymore.

Leigh Brown: he has been unlucky with the injuries to our forward line, I understand he has come from a successful club so maybe he is worth holding onto.

If you look at other successful clubs such as hawthorn, you see that Brett Ratten is sacked as coach of Carlton and straight away they sign him up. He has senior coaching experience and can bring new ideas to their clulb. I was wondering what people thought about bringing in michael voss as our midfield coach? Ultimately I would want Cameron Ling but not sure if he will come, seems pretty settled in the media at the moment. Michael voss was a champion player, although didn't hit great peaks as a senior coach still has had senior experience.

Just wondering on people's thought son Pederson. People say that he is lazy and doesn't hit the contest hard but over the last few games when he's played in defence he has been able to play the third man up and seems to be able to take marks in our defensive 50. I think he has a place in our team as a third tall defender who can help chop out Frawley and Mcdonalds forwards and also probably have to play on the resting ruckman in the forward line which most teams do these days? Garland is good but probably a bit short to play on the oppositions marking ruckman?