binman

We might call such 'supporters' detractors. 'I've been a detractor of this one great club since the 70s. And i have been staunch in my criticism - disco blue jumpers, the stupidity of sacking Stan Alves, falling for the messiah complex with Barrassi, Vinny Cottagio, Crosswell, Balme as coach, David Cordner, whites board Wednesday, soft Watts, of course Gerard healy quit the club, Gutnick, Goodwin, - the list of our failings is endless!'

I haven't read a single post in.this thread, so apologies if it's been covered. Is goody a verb? If so, what does it mean? I'm thinking perhaps it's a typo, and thread title is actually Time to go giddy? Or perhaps goody is a euphemism? For what, I'm shudder to think.

I'm a punter - horses and footy. I really enjoy betting on footy. But find the ads - and even more so the integration (eg the in game ads and 'tips' from peanuts like brown) - obscene. In 20 years time we will look back on such advertising in the way we look back im horror at the total integration of say Benson and Hedges sponsoring cricket (and all the rest, eg motor sport). What were they thinking? And the parallels are clear: Like we did with tobacco in the 1970s, we know the damage gambling does to our society. The research is crystal clear. The motivation of the advertisers and companies is also the same- create life long customer loyalty, from teenager to grave. And the AFL, like sporting organisations in the 1970s will argue the money is critical - but when push comes to shove will find other revenue streams.

Agree with these points. By seasons end the following players were all in our best 23 (with the number of AFL preseasons in brackets): JVR (3), Turner (3), Howes (3), Mcvee (2) Windsor (1) and the Kolt (1). So more than a quarter of our best 23 with three or fewer AFL preseasons under their belt (and it's worth noting for end of season draftees, all bar disco in that list, their first preseason is not really a full one as they come into the system in November). When Burgess came to the dees i saw an interview with him (perhaps the same one you reference DF) when he said it takes three plus seasons to build a foundation of elite fitness (in reference to the challenge he faced getting us cherry ripe accross the board). And once that elite foundation is built, every preseason after that incremental gains are possible for each player and the team as a whole (presumably only if they continue to do the work) - that's to say they can continue build on that foundation year on year and the base is a bit higher every year (which is why a finess freak line Novak Djokovic can be fitter and stronger at say 32 than he was at 25). He also noted that it's not just aerobic (endurance) fitness that needs to be built, it's also anaerobic fitness (power and strength). And that most players are either natural endurance athletes (eg nibbla) or power athletes (eg tracc). So when they come into the AFL sytem (and through their career), will need an individual program developed for them that helps improve their relative weakness and enhance their strengths. So Mcvee, an aerobic athlete, could build an elite endurance foundation relatively quickly, but is probably one to two more preseasons from an elite power and strength foundation (and look out when he does). The opposite is true of JVR and Disco, both power athletes who will continue to get incrementally stronger (not to mention bigger as both will continue to fill out), but might take another one or two preseasons to build an elite endurance foundation. There's no doubt having so many of our best 23 with so few AFL preseasons under their belt had a significant impact on our ability to 'defend the ground' and run out games. The upside of that is we got senior games into those young guns and if they have great preseasons all will go up a level fitness wise, both in terms of endurance and strength. So, we are likely to get signficant natural improvement in terms of endurance and strength from a quarter of our best 23. Ditto for the five young players who just resigned who hope to become best 23. Of the five i have highest hopes for AMW as if he can develop elite endurance I think he is can become our Quaynor style small, medium defender, freeing Mcvee to be a Daicos style aggressive half back, occasional mid. And Sestan has essentially been given a chance to build his tank and realise his potential to become a very good AFL player (it's worth noting that this time last year it looked doubftful AMW would be able to do so). Add a pick 5 (by way of comparison Windsor was seven and the hawks' Watson was 5) to natural improvement in terms of endurance and strength from so many young players (not to mention the improvements in their craft experience brings) there's good reason to be bullish about the next few seasons. A rebuild on the run.

Straight swap.

Goes well with a crusty roll from the Garry Baker.

A no from Mr. Which is a tad ironic because I was dead keen when he was last on the market. Good thing I'm not in recruitment given Martin was very good coin at the blues. This comment from the blues wouldn't give other clubs much confidence (it feels like a bit of a nothing statement) "Jack also showed a resilient mindset through his five seasons and has made some lasting friendships at the football club"

Needs to get AFL fit. If he can/does I think he has the tools to make it. An excellent kick, but simply does not have the tank to get enough of the pill.

Unlike other years, where it never mattered.

Carlton is really the logical club for tracc. If it was 1979 when Lygon Street could still be considered little Italy.

Unfortunately, that's a con not a pro.

Can you do Financial Times and The Australian subscriptions please.

Possibly.

Happy to volunteer to write the content.

Perhaps we need a demonland calender. January - Andy flexing.

Agree. Though I'm not convinced we're that great at number one either. As just one example, I reckon I've looked at the mfc website no more than a dozen times the entire season. I'm a total dees nuffie and there's nothing on my clubs website of interstate. That's poor And the last time was to look at my membership info, which is frustratingly hard to access (partly because of the ticket master sruff now, which is not the clubs fault) I'd add a sub element of number 3 - crisis management, ie comms during a crisis. We have been poor in that space too for a long time - for example we never seem to get out in front of stories and as a result always seem to be reactive.

It's just one platform. Personally, I'm not on any social media, except demonland, never have been. But any modern comms plan has to have mutiple avenues of engagement - insta, twitter, YouTube, tik tok source, discord etc etc. I'll bet our reach on those platforms is equally poor. One of the frustrating things about being a dees supporter as a kid in the 1970s, apart from the fact I knew no other dees fans at all, was this idea the dees were an establishment club full of old fuddy duddys with their blankets and Thermos. We still battle with that image. A 2009 style fans engagement strategy doesn't help on that front.

What a funny coincidence- I just used exactly the same expression!

We could have done that. But it wouldn't be 'authentic' But on a serious note, leaving aside the tetun on investment to sponsors, good comms to fans us a massive part of the value proposition fans amd members of a club. And is also a critical element of bringing new fans on board. It feels like the dees are stuck in the 60s - our strategy to build our support base is hoping dees supporters force their kids to support the dees. The hawks certainly get a benefit from that old school phenomenon with their sustained sucess in the 80s. But they haven't been asleep at the wheel like us in terms of bringing new fans to the club No coincidence the dog hawks final had 97k attend - massive, particularly given the dogs small supporter base.

I hope noone dismisses this as silly. It's not. Every one of our sponsors would look at this table with concern in terms of a return on their investment. It's a perfect visual summary of our woeful comms.

Yep, agree. I didn't mean to say that skill becomes unimportant. My point was less about skill than game style. it wasnt their fast transition off half back using laser kicks that won them the game (the way say it did the hawks in a much lower pressure game) it was their attack on the ball. But as you say their skill was a huge factor. The handball from papley was genius, and arguably won them the game. Heeneys resulting goal was clutch, as was the one he kicked after his one handed mark. Warner was also brilliant. Players with the best skills can execute better under pressure than those with average skills, and I agree it's an area we need to improve. I reckon Windsor might become our Warner, and I have high hopes fir kolt. Two hard at players with good skills. Hopefully our pick 5 gives us one more.

Never was that more evident than in the cracking GWS Swans game. That game highlighted that whilst a good turnover, transition game get you to finals (and therefore silky skills like say Guldens' are important), come finals you still need the hard at it bulls like heeney. The swans won that game because of their intensity and pressure in the second half, not their much vaunted skill and transition game.

It's ironic that other clubs are interested in Oliver but seemingly no interest in Tracc (outside of the usual 'all clubs would love a player of Petracca's ability' palaver). No chance we trade Oliver IMHO.

Yes, i 100% agree. With all of your post. In fact i'd add that Clarry was exemplary this year. Of course his fitness was an issue but he tried his guts out week in, week out. I'd take that every day of the week over the inconsistency in effort of say Fritter. Mark my word, clarry will finish top 10 in the Bluey - ahead of a lot of players who whose fitness wasn't an issue. I actually don't have an major issue with Tracc its not how i would have handled things and think he ended up looking a pretty foolish. But the whole 'our best player wants out is evidence of how bad things are at the club' is carrying an awful lot of water given HE IS STAYING! If things were so bad and he really wanted out, and was prepared to go to any club we 100% would have done the deal. In fact i would not be shocked if they might have been ok with that as my sense is that he has made himself an outlier. And whilst his concerns no doubt have some validity i don't think they are such a big issue for his teammates, who actually seem very united (you only need to see the positive energy after out win over Gold Coast for evidence of that).

A couple of questions: How do you know Stengle's incident is a one off? Well run clubs keep things in house. The cats are a well run club. What are the incidents at the dees over the last few years you are referring to? Not rumours, not innuendo, but incidents comparable to Stengles that have been verified. There is the js stuff. Clarry going off the rails in the 2023 off season. The entrecote dust up. Am i missing any?