Grandson of a gun

Exacery!!!!!

No you misunderstood, yes there may be some stupid idolization by their mates but when found out by the community they are rightly chastised. My reply did answer that. Yep. And I guess I'm just arguing against the 'norm'. [censored] I'm beginning to sound like a lawyer.... now that is a group I do have issues with!

Agree entirely. You are 100% right and that wasn't what i was saying. I never said anything about it being the female's fault if she was sexually assaulted. I used the term, sex scandal which the commercial papers and wider media openly apply to just about any situation that has some form of sexual connotation...if you mistook it that way then that was not my intention or point. No i said i painted it in a harsh manner...bluntly if you will. How? I said the males in those cases should be rightly criticised. But shouldn't the same be true of the females who do the same thing? What if Lara took one of Fev? Would she be attacked in the same manner as him for that incident? I don't know how i can make that point any clearer for you??? Yep. For sure. But are ALL parties always painted as fools? Or just some? And what message does that send to young impressionable females? That it is ok to go after these players in a predatory manner because if anything comes out it will ALWAYS be their fault...

It took two posts for someone to turn it around..... No issues at all with females in general. Love em all. I may have painted it in a harsh light but you have missed my point... Think back to any "sex scandal" or situation where a female alleges something against an AFL/NRL footballer or The Footy Show- Who is always willing to come out and blast them??? Who will always give their 2 cents on the issue and lay the blame fairly and squarley at the feet of the footballers with no regard for what actions the other party may have undertaken in the first instance. Dare they ever stop and think that maybe, just maybe, blame or chastisement should be directed at the female party involved. Spider Everitt said as much and got lambasted by these same people but truth is he was right. Sometimes people just don't want to hear it... Having seen the photos, they are suggestion enough that the photographer was a female. As is the person publishing them. Don't be so ignorant or naive. Young men being photographed nude. Silly yes. Just as silly as when young girls allow their boyfriends or partners to do same. As the female victims are rarely criticised in those cases, and instead the males parties persecuted (quite rightly), will the opposite be true in this case (as it should be). I fear not and that is the point. Double standards.

So with the much publicised news of the three St Kilda players and the nude photos, where will the blame and chastisement be laid? Will those who are always so quick to criticise footballers for their actions this time condemn the FEMALE taker of the photos in the same manner? Sadly i fear not. The footballers will be blamed for putting themselves in that position and they should have known better etc etc. It's the footballers who are always the predators and to blame, never would a female act in a predatory and deliberately misleading way........ It is clear that the photos were taken either in confidence in a private setting or they were taken without the footballers consent. Let's see the feminists and lead protagonists such as Robyn Riley, the Herald Sun and the centre for respect of women or whoever they are, actually come out and go after this female predator. After all, the manner in which she has been conducting herself, does nothing for the image of young women around footballers either...... Just looking for some equality in the community and for the AFL players who already have to be careful of where they go, who they associate with and who i'm sure have to deal with predatory females on a constant basis, to be seen as not always to blame in these circumstances... REIWOLDT, DAWSON AND DAL SANTO NAMED BY HERALD SUN

Thanks for that. I was under the assumption he wasn't yet... I think it will be out of Campbell and Nicholson at the start of the year with a leaning towards Campbell and then Nicho after rd 11 barring an LTI earlier...

Please, please, please do not turn this into another Scully hasn't signed / is going/gone to GWS thread...

I thought we had 2 spots available because we have no one on th VL?

+1. That is the perfect description. There should be nothing more to debate.

Really? What was the nature of the conversation, because I have found him to be quite the opposite in multiple conversations held.

Pretty much sums up what he'd said in previous interviews in the media. Good to see he has no plans of just wallowing at Casey and will be working towards playing seniors. Once he gets some continuity through the NAB cup and the start of the VFL season then i see no reason why he won't play in the AFL either...as many have said, little downside to this choice but a huge potential upside. I would back he and Nicholson to be the promoted rookies at the start of the season.

Yep, if Martin can get back then i think he is best suited in defence so you have a point there. Only 53 and a half days left now.......... Bugger Christmas, bring on Feb!!!

Yep. I do agree with you. Perhaps too it was Grimes' man who kicked the ball inside 50 to Trengove's man twice too! That is life in football and lessons get learned... You would agree though i'm sure that we need to start becoming a ruthless football team who start to develop a winning culture. Development also comes in the form of learning and knowing how to win games that perhaps they shouldn't, or have been playing badly but still get up, or they are getting over-run but they guts it out. Learning to do this is what will make us into a finals team and ultimately help catapult us to the top. As i have said previously, i don't think we will make the finals next year, however i think it is fair to expect around 10-11 wins whilst still developing our players...that would then satisfy the need to develop a winning culture, whilst nurturing and developing the youngsters and pushing closer to being a top 8 team. I see next year as being the final year of 'the initial development' where players are given games to give them experience, rather than earning a position necessarily. If that gets us into the finals then so be it but i don't expect it and don't see the season as a failure if we don't. However we will need a couple of years 'finals development' where we are playing in the finals and learning how to take our game to another level before we can really make a tilt at it, it won't simply be a case of 2011- 8-10, 2012- 4-6, 2013- Flag... look at the Geelongs, Collingwoods, St Kilda's etc. We need sustained finals experience and a hard nosed team. I envisage ladder position being something more like 2011- 8-10, 2012- 6-8, 2013- 3-6, 2014- 1-4, 2015- 1-2.... So the pass mark for 2011 will be a combination of many people's opinions: -Achieving higher results in the KPI's that have been mentioned; -Getting games and experience into our youngsters and blooding the likes of Blease, Tapscott and others; -Winning 10-12 games. And i reckon that's how the footy department sees it too.

Sorry JCB but i agree with Sylvinator on this one. Frawley and Garland are the perfect 'modern' key position backs. Who better to use his pace and skills against than a slower kp forward and make him look silly. The beautiful thing about he and Frawley is that from the last line of defence, both are great at spoiling and then being able to run and carry the ball out with pace and skill. Absolutely perfect for what we need. Rivers and/or MacDonald are then perfect foils for the floating third defender to come across the pack and take the mark and Grimes as the link man out of defence. Warnock is more of the old school KP back and i still greatly value him but in our best team, he wouldn't be playing. As for the latest draftees, it would be great if all of them came on the way we wished but reality says that one, two or maybe even 3 won't. With Garland and Frawley filling those key back posts, and Watts developing as a CHF, i would bet that Cook is then groomed to be the deep forward to move LJ to a pocket where he can float around and be even more devastating. Bottom line, i believe Garland serves the team best where he has been playing and that is deep in defence.

Here's the story: Works In Progress Not real ground breaking stuff, just pretty much sums up what all the astute Demonlanders are saying and thinking in relation to our list. The need for size, strength and young players to step up. Likewise with other teams... Have to disagree with his assessment of the Doggies though. It has been proven time and again that their game plan doesn't stack up when it comes to playing the top teams. Their record against other top 4 teams is atrocious and i don't see them improving enough to take the next step. There will be some adjustment to a new coach and game plan under Chris Scott for Geelong so whilst i expect them to slide a bit due to natural adjustment, i think their quality will keep them firmly in the upper half of the 8.

Agree with the winning culture stuff Big red. For too long these kids have played in losing teams. It's time to develop a winning culture and a ruthless attitude in games to lift this club to the next level. Bit it is a delicate balance as we do still need to develop some players. There is no better way to fast track development than winning though!

It will be a topic for debate for much of the year. Is it a case of robbing Peter to pay Paul? We all know how great he is off half back, how good at beating his opponent 1 on 1 and rebounding the footy. With the opposition usually pumping the ball inside forward 50 many more times than us, having Grimes there to win the ball back and hurt them on the rebound is invaluable. However, would Grimes going into the midfield lead to less opposition inside 50's, more stoppage wins and inside 50's for us which we desperately need? Possibly. Will it diminish our backline though? Firstly we need to get continuity of games into Jack. If that means more time at half back than midfield to let his body strengthen then so be it. I can however see him spending time in the guts this year, perhaps in direct swap with Trengove during games, to further aid his development. But overall I just want 22 games from him, no matter where he ends up playing he will tear it up!

Yes. He can hold down CHB or FB depending on the Frawley match-up. I really rate Col and hope that with a full pre-season under his belt he can have another really good season.

If Grimes had played closer to 35-40 games then i reckon he would have been a real chance.......however, as someone else said please let his body give us 22 games- then watch the competition take notice. It made me sick all the Harry O talk this year, Grimes is twice the player. It really is out of Green and Davey. Someone (sorry had a few beers) also mentioned that Green will be Green no matter what, whereas Davey, perhaps elevated to Captain, will take his game and attitude to another level. I'm coming around on this idea. On a side note, if indeed Davey does become captain there will be a huge amount of press, being that he is one of the indigenous boys... He would be in pretty special company- Goodes, Wanganeen, Long, Chris Johnson. Did i mention about Grimes........

I hear ya. I trained my boy to say 'Go Dees' and punch the air every time the footy was on tv. It worked so well that he says it now any time there is any form of sport on and any time he sees a football picture or magazine.

I think you are correct Sylv... The likes of Scully, Trengove, McKenzie, Gysberts, Morton and then maybe Blease just don't yet have the bodies to win hard contested footy constantly. Yes we have Sylvia, Jones and Moloney to assist but i still see that at times during games we will get monstered at the stoppages. What is important though is that the midfielders are more accountable and put more pressure on the opposition mids when they have the ball to 1) reduce the number of inside 50's against which was far too high this year and 2) make the job easier for the backline who can then hopefully force the turnover and hurt them on the rebound. We also need to get the ball inside our forward 50 at least 25% more (preferably 50%) to give our forwards a chance. Then delivery comes into it. A lot comes down to how quickly these mids develop. Because the more ball they get, the more ball our forwards get and therefore the faster our forwards develop. (It was pretty tough for the likes of Watts, Jurrah and co when they only saw the ball 35-45 times a game while the opposition had 60 plus). 7 weeks and 6 days...............

For what it's worth.... 1. Collingwood 2. St. Kilda 3. Fremantle 4. Geelong 5. Western Bulldogs 6. Hawthorn 7. Carlton 8. North Melbourne 9. Melbourne 10. Adelaide 11. Sydney 12. Brisbane 13. Port Adelaide 14. Richmond 15. Essendon 16. West Coast 17. Gold Coast

more a feeling of meh....

Now why would there be so many topics involving the Gardner Board, why do they need defending, they were fantastic, right????? You still can't escape the facts laid out at the end of that administration. So, how about we move on???

I agree with what you say in part, and that is why many posters put a win range. To account for a bit of luck. It is also why things like quarters won and a more consistent output in performances are key indicators and good ways to gauge how the season is going and our youngsters are progressing.