bing181

Or EPO if you want more red blood cells ...

"DEFENDER Tom McDonald and dasher Daniel Nicholson have taken out the three-km time-trial run at Princes Park on Saturday. The two Demons broke away from the pack to run out joint-winners in front of second-year rookie James Magner. Elite performance manager Dave Misson said the top five was as he expected. “Tom McDonald and Dan Nicholson crossed the line together to win it,” he told melbournefc.com.au. “Then we had Jimmy Magner, who was third, and then Trenners (Jack Trengove) and Rohan Bail came fourth and fifth. “That top five was what I thought would come across the line. They’re times are great and we’re really happy.” You were saying?

You can't be serious ... one season to write a 21 year old off? Based on your assessment, the Brownlow next year is going to be dominated by GC players, after all, that's where all the best 21 year olds are, so it stands to reason, that they should all be bona fide stars by then. Go and have a look at Jobe Watson's first few seasons. Or Swan, Goodes, Goddard ... god knows, there's a heap of genuine stars out there who were all over the shop early on.

Have we seen anything to indicate he will not reach anything like that level? No. Different players, different teams, different coaches and training blah blah blah. For every Murphy doing decently after a season or two, there's a RIch or a Martin who go backwards, and a Goddard or a Swan who are having trouble just holding down a place in the first 22 at that stage of their careers. And if you're looking at Carlton's high draft picks ... where were their other budding mega-stars, Kreuzer and Gibbs this year? Re Murphy: Trengove did better than him (stats) for the first two seasons - and Jack's third has been no worse than his second, in spite of the extra responsibilities, the difficulties at the club, and a complete change of on-field and off-field direction. Also, Jack missed a hefty slab of last year's pre-season, which can't have helped - and now isn't going to help this year either. Trengove is clearly still a work in progress, but there aren't too many 21 year olds already captaining their club and finishing solidly in the top 10 of their B&F. One side-effect of this is that in missing the Darwin camp - which is supposed to be about establishing leaders - it can't have helped his position as a potential captain.

Think you're drawing a long bow there ... I don't know too many (anyone?) who would ever have put Bennell and Cook (and Petterd for that matter) on the same level as Trengove. Doing fine as far as I can see. People often seem to forget how long it took some of the "stars" to become just that, especially in a team with so little real leadership and role models, not to mention, one that's being hammered from pillar to post each week.

Prove it.

Opinion: A belief or conclusion held with confidence but not substantiated by positive knowledge or proof. In other words, you can be a vacuous ignoramus and still have an "opinion". (not suggesting you are ... of course)

We have a pick in the Rookie draft before Hawthorn, so if we want him ...

Garlett is a terrible fit, and would undermine everything we've tried to do with recruitment for the year.

I think you're right to exercise caution re Clark, there's still a long way to go. But there have been plenty of success stories with that injury, it's not all doom and gloom. Having said that, if he manages more than a half of footy in any of the NAB cup matches, I'll be pleasantly surprised.

Correction: Dawes was always in the firsts, except when injured. As for "other teams' cast-offs", it seems too simplistic a reading of their situation for mine. Sellars has shown himself to be a good pickup, and probably a solid first-22 player, but was even more on the outer at Adelaide than Pederson was at North. Not to even start on the "cast-offs" that Sydney have managed to find a place for (and more) in a premiership team. Not to keep coming back to one of my pet themes re all these trades, but they create competition within the team. Pederson and Gillies are certainly going to keep the likes of Dunn and Sellars honest, and even if that's all we get out of them (which I'd be suprised about), it'll be a step forward.

Wonder how often we'll see that though. Think Clark could take a while, and even getting back to pre-break level could be a bit of an ask.

Agree with the last 3 points, but your first two are in my opinion completely unrealistic. Lose 8 games by less than a goal? Be interested to see if any team has managed that. One or two "close" games in a season, sure, but 8?? Never beaten by more than 4 goals? Once again, has any team, ever, done that in a season? Even the best will have the odd off days, and the less-than-best probably quite a few. There are going to be 60 point losses this year - just hopefully fewer of them. For me, I feel that the year is going to play out in terms of luck and injuries. Losing Mitch Clark this year was iMHO catastrophic. If he takes time to come back, Dawes has an injury (or ongoing injury issues), Viney gets heavily crunched and misses 6 weeks, Sylvia breaks something (again), etc. etc. I for one would not be all that confident that we'd suddenly shoot up the ladder. If on the other hand, the stars align, everyone plays to or approaching their potential, most players are available most weeks creating a real competition for places, sure, the sky's the limit!

Good luck with finding a free wi-fi spot in Europe outside of your hotel ...

Seconded. Seen it do a lot of damage to those around me, including immediate family. Meanwhile, Caro (bless her) has come out swinging. It's gonna hit the fan, especially as the target is Collingwood. Could be the perfect time for the AFL to announce that after an extensive enquiry into alleged tanking, MFC doesn't have a case to answer.

As do the FD. We've just had a major clearout ... yet the pencil holds his spot. For a (just) 23 year old ruck, coming along nicely I would have thought.

Sure, but we're a professional football club playing at an elite level, not Reach or the Salvos. I wish him well, but after being passed over in the draft multiple times by every single club, it would appear that he has some way to go to convince the pros in the footy business that he's worthy of being even given a chance. Perhaps another year or two at state level is what he needs to get his head in the right place.

Sometimes things just don't work out with a player, and the club and the supporters need to be big enough to accept that, wish them well, and move on. Hope it turns out OK for Liam, he could do with a few things going his way. For me, he'll always have been one of us.

Not sure whether or not it's the best off-season we've (ever) had, but definitely the best training reports of the off-season we've ever had. Impressive work from all who contributed ... not just the players stepping up.

He has missed quite a bit due to injuries (in both 2010 and 2011), improved over this year when he came back, wasn't disgraceful when he had to carry first ruck duties, and is being consistently mentioned positively in training reports. Hard to ask much more of a 23 year old ruck at this stage. More to the point, we just had a big clean-out, and he's still there, which says something about what the insiders in the FD think of him.

When all (ALL!) the players come back having met their off-season targets for skinfolds, and the majority of players come back to set or equal PB's in the first 3k run ... these are not vague "training the house down" claims, they're tangible proof of the changes that the club (and its culture) is undergoing. Look at the average age of the team this year compared to last, not to mention the size, weight and experience of the players that have come in. Will we win a premiership next year? Of course not. Will we win more than 8 games? We shall see ... but if we do, it'll be because of the changes that are happening now, in this off-season, brought about by Neeld, Craig, Misson and co. Results on-field are the tip of an iceberg, much of which is off-field.

The side that beat Sydney by 73 couldn't beat Sydney at all the following year. 2010 was a bit of a smoke and mirrors season, and in retrospect, most of us seem to be able to see through that. Most of us.

A little quote from a member of North's training staff .... included as much as for what it says about training workload at Melb as what it says about Gysberts: New recruit Jordan Gysberts is also adapting to the workload and conditions. “He’s started off really well, but I think he’s been surprised by the amount of work he’s been exposed to. But he’s coping with that really well and will only get better as we go.”

Happy to take whatever you've got. It's been a tough few years.

Careful ... that's what we were doing when the wheels fell off last time. Let's make these guys work hard to get senior games, so we can have a hard midfield.