DeeSpencer

I assume you mean hyperextension. I do wonder how much prehab our guys do and working on posture, gait etc. Hogan's bow legged and awkward running style is the one that makes me think of it. But with how professional the staff are surely they are all over it? Probably can't fix these things overnight, have to do a lot of core work, exercises, gait technique, taping etc to get it right.

Interesting stats. Switching to a zone defensive system does decrease the number of one on ones though. So I'm a little suspect on those contest numbers. 41 in 14 games = 3 per game so it's not a huge sample size. There were games I was critical towards Oscar and that was mostly because I wasn't impressed by his physicality and his decision making with the ball could be shaky. Frost, Oscar and Tom do have an ability to make each other look worse because none of them are cool heads with the ball nor do they full control the ball in the air - Tom's the best in that regard and hopefully is even better without a shoulder injury this year. The main benefit Oscar gave to the side was his work rate. Just by covering the ground both ways he made the side better. Unfortunately that's not an easy thing to see when watching games on TV (or even live). That's where the intercept possessions can come in and he was solid at that. Oscar's entire season to me was summarised by that run forward and tumbling kick against Hawthorn that led to a vital goal. It looked ugly. It lacked confidence and composure. But it was effective and was a base to work from.

He's looked noticeably lighter all summer which is why it was strange one of those AFL.com.au articles said he came back in bad shape. Surely they stuffed that up. Does make me wonder if he'll continue as a key forward and not rucking without the extra bulk. I like how Burgo always slides in a few extra details during his camp diaries.

Probably just depth but could be handy and get games this year and in to the future. Key forwards at AFL level are usually very good or in and out of the side, it's a hard balance to be a reliable 2nd or 3rd string option. Especially as he can't ruck and probably can't do much as a midfielder to add a second string to his bow. In the VFL he has size and athleticism over most of his opponents. In the AFL that will mostly be the opposite. So to get a lot of the ball he'll have to working really and even be taking spectacular grabs. What I do like about him though is that he'll hit the contest hard and his goal kicking seems really good. That's pretty much perfect for a back up forward.

When did we last beat them up there? We beat them in round 23 in 2015 in a game where they had about 12 out, wasn't really an AFL standard game. Then we fluked a win in round 1 this year when they ran all over us for the middle half of the game and kicked a bucket load of points. I think the formula for beating them is pretty simple - smash them at the contest, isolate defenders, cut down their outside run - but I'm not convinced we'll do it again any time soon. We'll have to show our run is dramatically improved this year and we'll have to have the skills at a high level like they were in round 1.

A destination for guys like Griffen, Mumford, Shaw, Deledio. And a spot that some young draftees enjoy more the battling QLD teams. Some guys will enjoy the club and enjoy anonymity. But I think they'll always be plenty of guys keen to come back to Victoria and play for teams down here but they won't be picking the bad (or small) Victoria teams unless it's unique circumstances like the Boyd deal. Certainly think Kelly stays given how close they are to a flag. Might be interesting to see what happens if they win a couple and players decide they want fresh challenges but I hope that doesn't happen.

He's exactly what we need, gut running and outside class. Not that we don't need Tyson and Salem just as much, but we already have them! Certainly no point having that debate again! I'm sure the club would have a list of out of contract players around the league and they'd probably have lists of the best players per positions of need. Kelly would be high up on both.

I feel like we've had academies or a curriculum for our young players for years now? Seems to change with every new development coach yet alone every senior coach. I do like the coaching team we have in place there now with Matty Egan, Rooke, Plapp and still having McCartney around. And some off field advisers with teaching backgrounds in Jennings and Nichol. Really like honouring Neitz as well. All up I'm hoping this is the time we've got it right.

Hickey is a tall, lean, wiry type ruckman, similar to Gawn but not as big. He doesn't try to overpower Gawn or out leap him he combats him with smarts. In that second game Riewoldt had 4 hit outs, Ross 4 and Acres 3, so they used 3rd man up to control Gawn as well. The disposal difference in the 2nd game could be a lot to do with it being the post Darwin game. As well as Gawn going forward for a lot of the 2nd half of that game to give us a different path to goal IIRC. Tom McDonald/Watts took the ruck duties I think?

Gawn without a 3rd man up - good. Watts, Pedda, Weeds, Spencer etc without a 3rd man up - worrying. That said, 3rd man up at centre clearances wasn't allowed, 3rd man ups at boundary throw ins were hard to do anyway. It's really the around the ground ball ups for the 25% of time Gawn isn't in that are the concern.

He's not big by any means but he's filled out a bit and doesn't look thin either. Probably 2 more seasons and maybe 4 kg at most away from his ideal weight. Will be interesting to see if he plays stronger this year. His kicking is inconsistent but is far more natural than Tom's and at times he can kick nicely. Tom's pretty thin after presumably doing very little upper body stuff after a shoulder surgery but he's held his own in contests against most forwards even with a thin frame.

Bugg offered a lot more pace and he's never far from AFL level, he's pretty much the standard depth player. I assume the other 4 you named had contracts whilst Cross didn't. I think that's a pretty standard occruence for list manager. Matt Jones is another with pace who played some decent games breaking the lines last year. Viv played 4 games, Newton 2, Grimes 2. I don't see how the difference between them and Crossy would've changed the course of our season.

Was there from about 10 until 11:15, with a wander to go get coffee in the middle. Craft session. So really quick cycling through a range of drills. Some divided by positions, other a mix. Missed (by me): Dom, Nev (saw him leaving), Kent, Brayshaw, Ben Ken? Rehab: ANB, Hannan. At times:Flippers, Mitch King Hibberd was held out after about 11. Couldn't tell if it was his knee or some other issue and didn't see any incident. Inside 50 kicking seemed a focus of a lot of drills that had varying ways to test it. There was a drill where 2 players would gather the ball, spin round and kick to a lead, it's on the clubs instagram. There were midfield stoppage drills that then had the players streaming forward to kick inside 50. And drills where the defenders would get the ball out then the forwards would take over and take the ball the other way. All 4 rucks did a fair bit of work with Stafford, but they weren't competing against each other. The mids did a fair bit of clearance work with umpires present to bounce the ball. Hogan did go in to this drill at various stages although my focus was on the forwards at that time. I'd say they'll put him in there as a way to get him in to the game and to take him from certain opponents. Matched up with even numbers probably 8 a side they practised getting the ball out of deep defence using short kicking and things got a bit ugly. They had an umpire calling marks and play ons and there were a few turnovers. They were really restricted in the space and using only short kicks for the drill. I expect the actual game plan will call for a lot more counter attacking and long kicking, particularly switching. Individual observations: Salem - looked really composed today, used his body well to win a marking contest, ran the ball forward with speed to evade pressure, nailed a goal from 50 on the run. Spencer - not to derail another thread but he did look good, racking up touches and making smart handballs on the spread Oliver - for the brief bit of the clearance work I watched he was wreaking havoc Maynard - another who got a few nice quick handballs off in traffic. I think he has vision Lewis - his kicking inside 50 is where he stands out Watts - his leading and ability to create space inside 50 is a cut above. I want him up the ground to get the ball but he is dangerous deep if he can find room and get delivery McKenna - a really nice ball user inside 50 Pedda and Vanders look fit, JKH looks sharp

Certainly. And it's worth remembering that against guys I'd consider quality depth in Minson and Campbell he was found wanting, but most weeks he plays well and occasionally he dominates. More often than not he's putting his name forward for selection as the back up if we want to play 2 rucks.

After it turned to mud mid winter wasn't the ground looking really good for the final they played out there? Maybe they attempted a bigger fix of the drainage. I know whenever I've been there in summer for preseason games it's been in really good condition.

I think that's fair enough and I think Matt Jones is a good example. He turned training track improvement in to real improvement but still had the same flaws and was just a depth player. When we had the chance to bring Lewis in and already had Melksham, Bugg, Harmes etc as younger depth he made way. It's not rubbishing Spencer or anyone reporting on him to say his improvement doesn't mean much yet. Probably the difference with Spencer is he's clearly the number 2 ruckman and plays very well in the VFL. Therefore he'll always be around the mark in selection decisions. Overall there's no point talking about his future beyond this season.

Jones, Viney and Gawn are locks. Hard to see T Mc missing out. Hard to see Lewis missing out. Jetta, Vince, Watts and I'd add Tyson are probably the obvious contenders if they want to go 6 or 7 strong.

Gawn was in the leadership group last year and is a leader of this group. He made it last year after half a season of good footy. He'll make it this year after adding an All Aus. Whilst I agree about Watts only playing 1 good year of footy I'll say he's also been a leader of the playing group in many ways for a while now. He's king of the kids - both in terms of fans and in terms of being popular with the younger players. If there's belief that he's turned the corner for good with his footy then I could understand him being picked in the leadership group. It might even help him go to another level. I don't think it's the same as Melbourne of old, I actually think it's a little alternative and a bit like Adelaide picking Tex Walker as captain when Sloane was available.

It's probably more because he missed almost all of last preseason with plantar fasciitis. Overall I still think he's a big dopey battler who's about 50/50 to be useful depth yet alone more, but I also can't remember him doing too many full preseasons. He had the knee injury a while back, a few ankle problems and the foot last year. He's been fit and strong for a few years now but it's hard to improve your skills and smarts stuck in the rehab group.

He's a lefty. But yes, unusually for a Melbourne lefty he has a good right.

Doubt it will become a best 22 thing but Spencer instead of Weid or Pedda is certainly an option and whilst it's not ideal it probably isn't anything to be scared of if Spencer has improved by as much as his training suggests. Give it a go every now and then to rest Max a bit, use Max to stretch defenders and use Spencil to physically work over opposition in the way Gawn cops it. Sydney changed first and second rucks a lot during the season. As did the Dogs. Our midfield needs to not rely on Gawn. And Watts, Hogan etc should carry the forward line regardless of the other tall.

Yep I agree, but I think he has it, there was one spot up kick to Kent this year I think that was beautiful. His technique needs more work than his vision, which is good, because that's a lot easier to fix.

Trac has good vision, just has a technical issue with his kicking that means he can spear the ball over 50m unlike many players but doesn't have touch on his short kicking. As long as he keeps working out in he won't become the long bomb king!

Good stuff. I think zone defending will really suit Keilty if he has the awareness, fitness and confidence to pull it off. Because it's almost like playing as a forward. Read the play, position smartly, attack the ball. Edit: Just saw this. I agree. He might only be a poor mans McGovern but he has the right tools. Same with Smith.

That will do me as well. My thoughts were simply in line with people calling for him to be co-captain or an on field general. Even with his pedigree that's a lot to ask for any recruit.