heartbeatstrue

That is 100% spot on.

I couldn't bring myself to cheer or sing the song after the game because I was so disappointed with the last quarter. It was lazy, arrogant and frankly embarrassing to see how we played in that last 15 minutes. It totally ruined what was an otherwise good display of football from the team.

The galling thing was it gave the wingeing Bomber supporters berhind me something to shout about in the last 10 minutes "no killer instinct... no killer instinct". If I wouldn't have risked my membership I would have snotted him.

Two questions.

How important is Grimes to the whole functioning of our back line? I felt yesterday that we missed not just the player, but the leadership he is starting to display down there.

Secondly, has Jurrah always kicked that bad? Someone needs to get him to an Auskick clinic and straighten him out (only joking, fantastic to see him back and a few glimpses of his magic, but his kicking...)

Consider this objectively: if Jack Watts wasn't a #1 pick, and wasn't accompanied by countless media pages of hype, would you have noticed him ?

Yes he looks the most awkward player when he gets caught with the ball... got away with it yesterday but he'll have to learn to bluff his way out of those moments or the ump's will ping him every time.

Yeah we keep fooling ourselves with all these "great" players, but truth is we're a crap team.

Only consolation, we're getting good at all the other club songs...

Disappointing. Capable of much better.

It's not just games we can't start with any intensity, it's every quarter.

Would we be second worst side in the comp right now?

What was Bailey thinking, interchanging Scully 2 min's into the 4th qtr, leaving Lenny Hayes unattended to kick first goal of the qtr?? Poor.

We were pitiful in the first quarter, absolutely pitiful. We made every mistake in the book and were luck to be so close. Surely our coach is capable of doing something about this - it happens every bloody week!

I don't agree.

We absorbed an enormous amount of pressure in the first 10 minutes, not sure we can blame our slow starts for that but rather, Collingwood was absolutely frenetic at the start.

Obviously they weren't going to be able to sustain it, we were just lucky they didn't get 5 goals on the board in that burst.

To our credit, we absorbed all that and started to get our game underway. The signs were good for us in the second half of that first qtr, so I think we did reasonably despite the Pies' opening burst. The fact we were in touch at qtr time told a story.

In the face of intense pressure, we didn't capitulate!

Can someone explain whether this playing with no one inside 50 assist us against Collingwood today or harmed our chances of kicking a decent score?

I thought it assisted us. In fact, good coaching up forward for a change. We don't have strong tall marking forwards, so our shorter forwards would have been exposed to huge physical pressure from the Collingwood backs.

Instead, by the likes of Green, Miller, Dunn, Bate etc. running quickly into the wide open space in front of our goal, they weren't under such physical pressure from the Pies backmen. And those backmen were caught wrong-footed because they were forced to defend running towards our goal, rather than what they prefer & do well, defending a ball coming towards them (and our goal).

Just how it appeared to me. Of course once Jurrah's around, things can be different.

robbed?

We were lucky not to lose by 10 goals.

Today's lesson is once again, play like crap at the start of the game and you will lose.

We absorbed an enormous amount of pressure in the first 10 minutes, not sure we can blame our slow starts for today but rather, Collingwood was absolutely on frenetic fire at the start.

Obviously they weren't going to be able to sustain it, we were just lucky they didn't get 5 goals on the board in that burst.

To our credit, we absorbed all that and started to get our game underway. The signs were good for us in the second half of that first qtr, so I think we did reasonably despite the Pies' opening burst.

In the face of intense pressure, we didn't capitulate!

My beef with the interpretation is that it doesn't seem to matter if the tackle is correct or not, they just love to pay holding the ball.

Part of it is I think the frustrated Thespian in the maggots who love the "theatre" of the HTB arm actions.

I think you're right. So let's change all that.

From now on, any umpire awarding a HTB decision must do a jig on one leg, waving his arms while holding a fluttering handkerchief in Morris Dancer style. That should fix the Thespian instincts in them

I actually had to agree with Robert Walls today.

He said the holding the ball rule has to go.

And it's not the umpires but that is the way they are told to adjudicate the rule.

If they don't pay those they get told they are wrong.

The main problem with the rule is the punish the play maker! As soon as a tackler lies on the guy and holds it in it should be a ball up, but if a team mate jumps on to hold it in, then it should be holding the ball.

Today it wasn't the rule that was the problem, but the inconsistent way it was applied. And today, most of the inconsistencies cost us.

(unless Jamar is injured, in which case we are [censored]).

Good point, Jamar is certainly our most important individual player, right now.

In away matches, I'd rather see us wear an easily identifiable alternate jumper against any side with which we remotely clash, rather than suffer through any modicum of confusion among the players or the spectators.

Which raises the third team out there, the umpires. Are they "away" sometimes or is simply every game a "home" fixture for "Team Umpires"?

This will be the REALLY interesting test of the AFL's resolve on the clash guernseys. I rather feel that the majority of the clubs are just accepting being dictated to where home & away games are concerned, but we haven't had any clashes on GF day in the "clash era" and I would be amazed to see a club wear something other than their traditional strip in a Grand Final.

Personally I have no problem with our clash strips,

Have you ever seen any team play in white and dominate? It's such a woozy, nothing "colour".

Personally, MFC's jumper should be sacrosanct not just for GF's but every game. We're the founding club, not Collingwood. Our jumper is worth fighting for.

get matty lloyed down

To teach him what, the art of diving?

we've got the biggest injury list in the afl.

I reckon Geelong's is bigger.

Hi Jerry, the optimism's giving way to realism!

Rhino's right, for where we're at (skills, experience, physical development) there's lots and lots to be excited about every week. I'm expecting to lose on QBD but looking forward to seeing our list play, get another game under the belts, and who knows who will be the bright stars for us on the day. Maybe McKenzie & Gysberts get to play together, the day would be exciting just for that. And there's heaps more...

The optimism's a few years away, but the realism is that it's definitely coming.

Great work Gys! Definitely deserved. And remember, next time we play Carlton, "pass it to Brock!"

I wouldn't want to see wholesale changes, but we were very defintely out-coached by Ratten on Saturday. Out-physicalled among other things.

Neil Craig is one coach who seems devoid of any plan B. I think DB does change things around a bit, maybe what you're really wanting is a bit more thinking outside the box. Like someone said, we're predictable and that is a problem at the moment because our skills and inexperience and young bodies all leave us vulnerable to good coaching plans like against the Roos and Carlton on Saturday.

Another thing I hope our coaches can address is how to fire the team up from the first bounce.

On physicality, why does Watts not realise the opportunity he has right now?

All he needs to do is hit one contest hard, lay one big bump or show some sort of intent with a shepherd to get our supporters onside...and get some respect from opposition supporters.

Slipping over and throwing his hands up like he's given up is not what we're looking for! It's not to do with his size - it's all about intent and intensity.

The whole team needs to attack the contest like Farmer or Tingay used to - all we want is an honest effort, whether it's marking attempts, shepherding or even manning the mark correctly.

I look at all the little things when the game gets away from us - and sometimes it's downright embarassing.

Great first post, TB. Scully earned my undying respect when he didn't shirk getting hit while playing the ball about 6 weeks ago. Showed the kid's got that fearless desperation.

And you're right, there's heaps of those little things for the coaches to work on. And a few biggies too!

I had a scum supporter walk past me in anger in the third when we made a comeback and knock my (previous broken) knee with a bag full of drink bottles... lucky my dad was there to hold me back from punching him in the face.

GOD I HATE CARLTON!!!!!

You probably would have got 3 weeks Jaded but it would have been worth it.

Boy they turn feral quickly on their own team, my 3 scum left at 3 qtr time because they couldn't stand what they were convinced was going to be a carlton loss. Pathetic 'supporters'.

we better find some unsociable mongrel real quick. Or else imagine what Collingwood will do to us. It will be fairly obvious to all opposition now that this is our achilles heel.

Would hate to watch Watts being unceremoniously bustled out of every contest by the pies, one reason why I hope he gets a rest (Dunn's sudden form is another).

I sat behind a real [censored] scum supporter. After they had the first three free kicks I said "here we go again". He then called two of our players "[censored]" and swore at others. The bloke in the next row wanted to take him on. Every incident in the game was a scum free kick according to him and any we got were [censored] umpiring decisions. Is it any wonder I hate the scum. they are the most arrogant club and supporters in the AFL and I wish them total failure.

Until yesterday I thought bombers' supporters were the worst. Totally agree with you, my obnoxious trio were out of the same mold as your scum supporter. Interestingly, they make filth supporters almost human.

While our third quarter comeback showed some steel, some very dubious umpiring decisions went our way which resulted in Melbourne goals. It also took until after quarter time for us apply any real pressure. What really disturbed me yesterday was the way Carlton confidently came out and bullied us from even before the first bounce. It was very interesting to watch Houlihan just pushing Grimes away from Betts like a schoolyard bully and the other players seemed to be unwilling to do anything about it. Whether they were worried about giving Carlton free kicks in front of goal. Houlihan spent much of the first half just blocking Grimes' path to Betts and it was extremely effective. It also seemed to bamboozle whoever was on Houlihan and freed him up do kick his own goals as well. A brilliant tactic and we had absolutely no counter to it. Grimes was obviously frustrated but didn't have the physical strength to do much about it. Warnock had his hands full, as did Rivers. Meanwhile, up the ground, Carlton were harassing us from Kruezer on Jamar right down to Carazzo on Davey. They had a arrogance and physical confidence about them which probably stems from their good form and the fact they they were bigger than us on average. The guys that normally work as our enforcers (Moloney, Sylvia, McDonald), had too much on their plates around the stoppages to worry about what was happening to Grimes at one end and Watts at the other. Why didn't Miller do something? It would have been worth him giving away a couple a cheap frees on the forward line to give Watts some support. I know Watts has to learn to fend for himself, and that yesterday he was pushed away from the contest like a skinny schoolkid, but Miller should have used his strength to counter what was going on. That's what Carlton did. They used smart intimidation to give there goalkickers an avenue to goal. I would hope that the coaching staff would work on this aspect during the next couple of weeks. While we have young inexperienced players learning the game, the older players need to support them. Jonathon Brown would never stand by and let stuff like that happen.

By the way, Watts does need to go back to Casey for a few weeks and develop some confidence, passion and attack on the ball. Also, we really missed Frawley yesterday for all the reasons above.

I was bullied by their supporters, too...

Agree with you, after watching us against a mature side like Geelong, it is obvious we need to bulk up generally all over the ground. Get Wonaeamirri to cook them all Tiwi turtle once a week!

Why didn't you thank them for Gysberts for McLean.

Also that they got Robert Warnock for $1.6m for 4 years instead of us.

Thanks for that. I was thinking of a few comments like that for after we got on top in the last qtr.

Unfortunately, the obnoxious trio of booz supporters left at 3 qtr time (their faith in their magnificent side having deserted them), and of course we never followed on in the last qtr.

Next time we play them, I'll have your words ready (plus probably a comment on Waite's tribunal record).