Whispering_Jack

Anyone know how long to go till next year's rookie draft?

We know he's 180 cm tall and played for Sandringham this year.

Suggestion is that GWS will pass all of its PSD picks.

Clutterbuck and Tuck - now that would be a great combination!

My guess: 6. Clutterbuck 24. Tuck 42. Couch (I couldn't readily think of anyone else whose name rhymes with Tuck) 59. Pass and look at taking either of the two late additions to the PTT list.

Morning has broken ...

... or was it simply a case of bad timing on his part to arrive at Carlton a few years before the salary cap scandal and a deep financial crisis saw the club plummet into arguably its worst situation since its inception - the Blues had hitherto never been wooden spooners in their entire history. In the beginning, Fevola was fashioned in the image of the then club president who did nothing to discourage the culture of booze, mysogeny and arrogance at the place. When the wheels fell off and Elliott left the scene, Fevola was the club's only star player - he won AA selection, Coleman Medals and the adoration of all the supporters and this gave him licence to get away with behaviour that would not be tolerated at well run professional clubs. His luck ran out under a new regime at the club that aspired to professionalism and introduced new stars. Then came the Brownlow Night at Crown that put an end to it as far as Carlton was concerned. Things only got worse when he arrived at Brisbane and discovered he could still get away with his errant behaviour. There were more incidents until the drunkenness of New Year's Eve got him sacked from the Lions. I think his cards were marked by then. He had lost far too much both physically and mentally and the game was changing. Despite his creditable attempts at rehabilitation and the goals he kicked at Casey and in the NT, his dash was done. As Caroline Wilson pointed out in her recent Age article, players like the Fev and Andrew Lovett have run out of brownie points. Today should confirm that.

To me, the big story of Don Williams was the story of the loss of not just one key player but a number of them over a short period of time during our golden era that could possibly have yielded another two premierships. Don was involved in a dispute over his selection in the 1959 grand final. He went off to WA whilst in the prime of career to miss four years before coming back to play in the 1964 premiership. We lost Stuart Spencer at the end of '56 aged 24 to Tasmania to further his business career. He had just won successive best & fairests. Laurie Mithen retired young after 1960, still at the height of his career. Big Bob Johnson, a 6'6" ruckman/forward also crossed to WA. His career in the WAFL and then the VFL lasted more than another decade. There were probably a few others who left the club and the last of them was Ron Barassi who left to captain coach Carlton at the end of 1964. The announcement was made at around this time 47 years ago. I've often wondered how much more success we could have had and whether it all could have lasted longer had we kept these star players together.

Yeah, it's got hairs on it.

I hope for your sake Adam Fisher is no relation to Andrew Fisher because, if so, your post is doomed to a short lifetime!

I reckon it was all over when they gave jumper #25 to Tom McDonald.

I think you got that right in your treatment of the situation in the Waylen Manson thread but often the distinction gets muddied and then it becomes a problem.

Great stuff guys - are any of you considering applying for a role on the selection committee?

The following is taken from Wikipedia:- Don Williams Born 3 November 1935 Died Late 1990s Recruited from Elsternwick Amateurs Height and weight 182 cm 80 kg Playing career Melbourne (1953-59) (1964-68) 205 games, 5 goals Don Williams was an Australian rules footballer who played for Melbourne during the 1950s and 60s. Williams was a half back flanker and five time premiership player with Melbourne, including their successive triumphs in 1955, 1956 and 1957. After being dropped to the bench in the 1959 grand final he decided to leave the club and spent the 1960 season with West Perth, who won the WAFL Grand Final in that year. He represented Western Australia in the Brisbane Carnival where Western Australia defeated Victoria for the first time. He returned to the Melbourne Football Club in 1964 and played in that year's 4 point Grand Final win over Collingwood. In 2000 he was named on the half back flank in Melbourne's official 'Team of the Century'. I'm none the wiser about Bobby's comment. Perhaps you can elaborate?

Melbourne Football Club Tweet from yesterday:-

Brendan Fevola himself has conceded that it's unlikely he's going to be drafted by anybody and has flagged a possible career as a punter in the NFL. The chance of Melbourne drafting him is as close to zero as you can get. Time to leave this subject alone.

I have a problem with that question because it doesn't touch on the nature of racism which is the subject of this thread. Of course, it's not racism to discuss racial issues and of course we need to have a debate on racism and to understand its nature when someone singles out the traits of a particular racial group in the context of discussing why that group should be discriminated against. Here's a definition of racism:- Racism is the belief that inherent different traits in human racial groups justify discrimination. In the modern English language, the term "racism" is used predominantly as a pejorative epithet. It is applied especially to the practice or advocacy of racial discrimination of a pernicious nature (i.e. which harms particular groups of people), and which is often justified by recourse to racial stereotyping or pseudo-science. The experts say that the best way to overcome racism is through education. Because of the nature of racism its important to discuss the consequences of racist behaviour which can range from none at all, to emotional hurt and pain in some and going all the way to the extremes of murder, genocide and ethnic cleansing. When those extremes are pointed out to some people, they often get on the defensive and claim to be offended for being associated with the mass murderers involved in those practices. But that's not what they're being accused of - rather they're being told that that is a possible consequence of allowing racist conduct to go unchallenged in society. On the other thread, my comments were misconstrued and I was told that I was being extreme for bringing up various instances of genocide and ethnic cleansing. If those things were part of science fiction I would agree but when, during my lifetime and in Europe of all places, 8,000 Muslims could have been butchered under the noses of troops from supposedly civilised countries I have to take offense at being misrepresented. Unfortunately, there is far too much of this behaviour across the world and far too little understanding of the problem and the issues. Why bring up what happens at the extreme? Because history tells us that racism starts at the basic levels and, if it's allowed to breed and gain acceptance in society it can and does become a dangerous force.

TimD, Who said it was racist to consider 'racial' issues?

Yeah ... exactly. It's significant to note jayceebee31's pronouncement on The Freddie Clutterbuck Thread on the JT Board, that Freddie's recruitment to the MFC is unfortunately not going to happen. JCB's sources are usually impeccable and this means we'll thankfully be deprived of the entire genre of Checkeresque music that caused havoc with the youth of the early 1960s. This a good thing for all of us. There are those who maintain that the dance crazes of the Twist and the Clutterbuck were the catalysts for the unhealthy drug culture of the latter half of the 1960s (and possibly Melbourne's long decline which commenced at that very time). I think there's something in that theory. After all, who could ever forget the euphoric days after the release of "Let's Clutterbuck Again Like We Did Last Winter"? There were abundant danger signs in Checker's mystical lyrics, "Do the Clutterbuck, if you cannot get a kick" and "Run and run all day, That is how we play," that served to presage the insouciance of our playing list circa 1965/6. In other words, from then on, we were "Clutterbucked" as a football club. The only antidote to this curse is to get rid of players with overweight parents, make good choices in the rookie draft and feed the team with cheap bananas and, in that respect (thanks to those who have contributed to this thread) we're making good progress.

Gutted Wasted & Sucked Dry GWS

The article was written by the Age's VFL writer. He could have inside information on Tuck or alternatively, he's based what he's written on old news. If it's the latter, his journalism is sloppy.

I was wondering what had happened to Travis Tuck and about the fact that no club seemed to be interested in him. Apparently, we still are - Dons set to draft Liston winner. And good luck to Shane Valenti. He's such a hard worker - he really deserves another chance!

Unfortunately, the problem with that song is that you actually can understand the words.

Austin Winaeamirri quiet and a long way from match fitness. Waratahs slump continues and so does Manson's decline. He kicked the first goal of the game, copped a knock during proceedings and faded right out of it. My correspondent describes his form in the past month as "pathetic" - perhaps he just got carried away with the hype. Fevola stayed at home this week. The situation also highlights the fact that the policy of flying in players from elsewhere and playing them on an ad hoc basis is ultimately counterproductive.

Off to dinner now. If anyone has further updates on Aussie and later Waylen Manson, feel free ...