Whispering_Jack

Toast, I wouldn't even think of censoring you for the above comments, boorish as they may be. This is a forum and if you want to make a monkey out of yourself, you're free to do so. But if you try using the same coarse language as those who we have had to give a holiday to recently, you'll find that unlike the AFL we're pretty consistent in dealing with those who break our rules. Now please get on with the matters at hand.

The possible charges have been released. There are three of them. Surely, there must be someone at the Age with enough brains to attempt an analysis of how the so-called facts as presented in the media over the past months fit in with those charges. Instead, we get a daily dose of articles regurgitating old stories and innuendo without any understanding of the nature of the offences with which the club might be charged? IMO it's not possible to determine whether the rumoured penalties for our supposed guilt are fair or otherwise without such an understanding.

Until it's clear that we're "guilty" of doing something similar in the eyes of the AFL (remembering that "list management" and other devices used to minimise your chances of losing matches was and still remains "legal" to this very day), I'm loathe to provide the details to them. I also have to think about the person who told me about the "big fish" Carlton were after from another club while, at the same time being quite certain that the Blues would finish bottom again and get the priority pick (and how sending Fev off for premature surgery would help the cause). It's not as if I was told in confidence but on the other hand it would embarrass him. What would you do?

Roos said he was only joking and they let him get away with that?Wow. And what about the comment by Westy who said I wonder why the CEO of West Coast complained about Carlton tanking to get draft picks? Surely, not to help them prize away their former captain? Which reminds me of a similar story about a conversation I had with a former Blues board member a few weeks before the Kreuzer Cup game.

Fear not Biff. The thread will be reopened in the fullness of time. At the moment, it's being used for the purpose originally intended - to keep a record of her utterances on the tanking inquisition (and associated material).In the meantime, this thread exists for discussion on the subject and everyone is free to bring up and critique my posts over there right here. In fact, since you've raised it, I'm pinning the thread so it can be more accessible to posters. I don't have a problem with our moderation here - we have standards to uphold unlike some other fan sites that have little or no moderation at all. Enjoy your day with your journo friends from the Age.

Despite Wilson's assurances that the outcome of the tanking fiasco would be known by Friday and her revelations of the details of that outcome, it's Sunday morning and we're none the wiser. Wilson has done this to death and continues to dig a hole for her sagging reputation as a journalist, so the Age has enlisted a ghost to keep things simmering. It's an old newspaper ploy and poor old Jake Niall drew the short straw so he put this piece together (which tells us nothing new) - Dee great escape The most interesting thing about the article in the link is the message at the top: "FOREVER CURIOUS" with the Age banner underneath. Trouble is, if you're an Age reader and are curious as to the nuts and bolts of the potential charges the Melbourne Football Club is facing, then you are being kept completely in the dark by Wilson and her friends. Back on Wednesday, she conceded that the Demons, who have engaged former Federal Court judge Ray Finkelstein to lead their defence, consider they have a very good case and that "perhaps in legal terms they are correct" (but they still should be punished even if legally innocent). This makes her conclusions about Melbourne's so-called (and supposed) light punishment which has yet to be officially announced so nonsensical that it beggars belief. It also leads to the question why has there been no analysis in the Age (or anywhere else in the media) of the elements of the offences of which Melbourne, Cameron Schwab, Chris Connolly and Dean Bailey potentially stand accused? After all, if there are sanctions to be imposed, how are the charges to be concocted if the crime did "not exist according to Demetriou" and how do you prevent the ensuing Pandora's box from opening and swallowing up clubs like Carlton, Collingwood, West Coast, Richmond et al who presumably committed similar crimes in the past that previously never existed? Instead, we are told by the Age that of course, Melbourne is guilty and even if it is not, it must be punished. There is no arm, no hand and no law. The rival Sunday Sun takes an altogether different tack - Melbourne legal eagles ready for Demons' tanking fight. My take is that the matter will be resolved by consensus and very soon but only because it is in the interests of all parties to settle without incurring enormous legal costs and the other burdens associated with protracted litigation. The difficulty in finalising the terms lies with the way in which the terms of settlement are to be set out. In order to understand this, one needs to have shown more curiosity about the nature of the charges and have done so in the first place, instead of concentrating as the Age has done on the sensational aspects of questionable evidence like the vault story and poor jokes about Zulus and the like. Such things might sell newspapers but in the end they damage reputations.

Strangely enough, I used the words "week, in, week out" on the other thread as well. It's probably our biggest challenge across the baord - not just to improve but to get better consistently and that's where Colin has been such a let down. Perhaps under Mark Neeld ...

Some nice publicity for Colin Sylvia in today's Sunraysia Daily - All fired up: Demons changes give Colin Sylvia a reason to smile this season They've named an Under 15 training squad out Mildura way over our Col and he's just tweeted that it's an "[A]bsolute honor to have a squad named after me." He wasn't a standout yesterday at Casey Fields but he did the odd thing that had "brilliance" and "class" written all over him and he looks to be in great physical shape. It's so frustrating that, after almost a decade at the club, he has yet to turn it on for a whole game week in week out. If he ever did, we would surely have a star on our hands and Colin Sylvia would have lived up to the honour of having that squad of young footballers named after him. I suppose this is a bit of a pipedream but I think he's the one player at the club who, by lifting that notch to where he performs at a consistently high level that we expect of someone with his talent, that we could nudge very close to the middle if not fringe of the top half of the competition this year.

Could everyone who has me on their "ignore button" please let me know.

Sadly, I have to agree. The dream is well and truly over and the main task is to restore his health and well-being which is paramount and will take time.We've seen how things work in the AFL. It's an unforgiving landscape and the talent Liam has won't be enough to reward him with a second chance. The onus from a football perspective is for us all to learn from this experience.

Two good questions.Firstly, it is presumed that the charges will be one, two or all three of bringing the game into disrepute, draft tampering or in the case of Bailey, not allowing his team to play on its merits (the latter is what Demetriou and others at the AFL have called "tanking"). Up till now list management, resting players etc. have never been included under the AFL's definition of tanking. Legally, there must be evidence to prove each element and the AFL can't second guess or use circumstantial evidence which might be equivocal as a basis of a finding of guilt. None of that matters in practical terms because it's fairly clear that the parties are trying to nut out a settlement. The views of you, me and the faux intellegensia on bigfooty matter jack squat about the final details to be nutted out. We will all have our opinions, many of which have already been expressed here. As far as I'm concerned the club should be looking forward to building itself up in the field and therefore what Mark Neeld and the players on the list do next is of paramount importance to me. Notwithstanding that, I'm 99% certain that had this gone to court, we would have creamed the AFL and even Wilson grudgingly concedes this (it's only her bloodlust and hatred of the club that motivates her to produce her regular idiotic rants). The second point is even more interesting. I agree that the general football public is becoming immune to this whole saga. I agree that not many people are interested in the subject as some would believe. It will blow over and the end result of Wilson's bloviating on this and other issues will be that she will have made herself irrelevant in much the same way as has happened to the once beautiful newspaper she works for (which is today very much a sinking ship).

Apologies. I fully accept I wasn't being harsh enough.

That is a load of self-serving bullsh1t.

Great work George. I've always enjoyed these games in the past but things have changed a lot over the years. We all know these hit outs don't really help the average spectator all that much in the context of the season to come because we have no comparison with other clubs until we're into the NAB Cup and the real competition. A couple of things I did note were that many players look fitter than ever before - Watts, Dunn and a few others look in fantastic shape and of course, because we (more than most others) need everyone healthy and on the park to improve and move up the ladder. After all, we have lost a substantial amount of experience - Green, Rivers, Moloney, Petterd, Bate etc. so we need their replacements to come to the fore virtually straight away. In that regard, it was good that 13 out of 14 of the newbies were on the park and the odd man out, Chris Dawes, was being rested. From what I saw, we are likely to get good value from the new blokes from other clubs. I was a bit hesitant about Byrnes and Rodan and, though they won't be 200 game players, they will be ample fill ins for a couple of years while Pedersen and Gillies will add a bit of steel and depth to the line up. The mature age recruits in M Jones and Terlich are interesting - can they make an early impact as James Magner did in the early stages of last year? Time will tell. Of the young blokes, Jack Viney and Jim Toumpas look polished enough to walk straight into the team and fit in as though they've been there for years. If they let Hogan play, I would have included him in that category as well ... Having seen Dean Kent in action for the first time, I like! Strong, hard, good delivery. More ready than I originally thought. Rory Taggert looks a balanced player who I hope gets a good run in the coming weeks. Finally, Dom Barry has the makings but seeing him in person, I think he's destined for a development year to hone his skills along with the Hulk at Casey.

Could we please leave the personal attacks against other posters out of this and concentrate on the subject matter. Thanks

Fairfax Media - once respected - plummets into a deep hole of shame. Media bosses critical of paper's miscalculation

Cost of petrol outside their budget and, unlike a certain other media outlet, they don't purloin their information from unofficial reports on Demonland.

Redleg. I have to issue you with an official warning. We at Demonland regard the issue of bullying very seriously and by asking Ms. Wilson some questions about football (which are outside the bounds of her comprehension) you have clearly crossed the line.You are guilty and should be ashamed of yourself and in future if you have any questions to ask of Ms. Wilson then please confine them to around the water cooler small talk. Thank you.

Wilson mucks up but still blames Melbourne. Muck up to be a stain on Demons Worming her way around the fact that she gotten things horribly wrong as can be seen by her body language on Footy Classified when confronted by some home truths. And let's not think this behaviour is confined to her discussions about Melbourne. Look who she cites on the subject of dobbing in drug cheats - AFL players rally around call to start dobbing in drug cheats. That's right - the former West Coke captain who left them after Carlton conveniently won the Kreuzer Cup in 2007 (surely the AFL will have to investigate that sordid affair now), the Visy ambassador who made pressure points and chicken wings famous.

Now that Caro's back in town and pouring out her usual bile, I've temporarily re-opened this thread to include some updates. Firstly, this article from Mark Robinson which pours water over her allegations that Cam Schwab was "grim faced or "ashen faced" after the club's 2009 win over Port Adelaide - Melbourne Demons adamant they won't tank Caro's source was undoubtedly a dud but there's a fair chance the person involved would have volunteered this rubbish as part of an agenda against the club's CEO. Next, the hysterical lame-duck article that demonstrated the shrew's inability to distinguish between the real issues in tanking and the world of rumour and innuendo in which she lurks - Demons' lame-duck excuses ... and Don McLardy buries the shrew- From the President Eddie McGuire, a true football person, doesn't appear to be as sanctimonious about the subject - Eddie Slams 'Stupid' AFL Rule The bitter backtracker - No draft penalties likely for Melbourne And a far more nuanced piece from the Herald Sun's Jon Ralph - Demons appear likely to dodge draft ban despite seven-month investigation into tanking claims I'll be back with more but in the meantime, savour this - CAROWHINE'S HUMILIATION - http://www.triplem.com.au/sydney/sport/video/garry-lyon-and-caroline-wilson-head-to-head-on-footy-classified/

Relax folks. Wilson's story is based on the unofficial outcome of the tanking investigation as discussed around the water cooler by the receptionists, PA's and cleaning staff in the building four doors to the south of AFL House.

I know one has to be careful when talking about injuries but I think it's been a while since we had a situation like this at this time of year. First interclub and a small group of injured players with no need to draw on Casey to make up the sides. I think they usually get 6 to 8 Scorpions for the intraclub but this time there was no need. Fingers crossed that the trend continues ...

They obviously need extra time to resolve matters relating to the final settlement terms. It happens often when there are negotiations taking pace involving more than one party.

The difference being that Rucci was clearly not being serious while Wilson really thinks she's being serious.

The ladies were wearing red and blue caps with "Casey Demons" on them. Did a great job in the heat too!