Rhino Richards

From what I have read and heard about Bailey is that he is a different coach to ND. I think that is needed. ND was poor in developing leadership and establishing a hard culture amongest the players. DB has been around a whiile in the coaching game and I am sure he will improve on ND in that area. How couldnt he? Al though I do have questions about the leadership choices. As a an all up coach, thec proof is on the W-L ratio when the big season starts. I agree there has been a beautification of DB by posters here beyond his performance. No fault of DB, I just hope those gushing posters are there if start badly to the season and we are 0 and 4.

The bottom three last year know by round 5 they were gone this year. Issues of Carlton's tanking commenced way earlier than Round 15. The prioritisation of the draft is to assist the weaker clubs ahead of the better clubs. The implementation of a lottery especially at round 15 only undermines the drafts objectives.

I dont see the issue with trading a first round draft pick. Either way the Club get the value of the pick either a future star or a quality player to supplement their list. Such restrictions only limit the transfer of players between the Clubs. It would undermine the once in 5 year CJ deals. How many 2nd round picks would Judd be worth? I further dont see a problem with the bottom side getting the No 1 pick and so forth. Its the priority pick conditions that cause the problem. The way to eliminate tanking is to reduce the incentive.....remove the nexus of the priority pick. There is little incentive to tank and differentiate between pick 1 and 3 given you dont know for sure how another Club will choose and it may not be how you would choose your pick preferences. There is a reason if you get access to an additional quality player.

Thanks BBP. You might be right about that. I did recall him missing some and thought it was all. I could be picky and say that only the Hawks games was PSC!

How could we have reduced the risk of the injuries that occurred last year? Do a collective Yze? Injuries that are due to muscle weakness or exert can be mitigated through body development or exercise programs. Injuries arising out match play contact cannot be reasonably reduced by such strategies and whether you do or do not incur such injuries can be good/poor fortune. I accept your frustration but players will need to play pre season games and last year has shown that hiding them from PSC games does not reliably reduce the risk. Here's to a fit 2008.

And you have just realised that?

I know where Nasher is going with this. Last season we had no control over the injuries that occurred during the year which occurred during the course of play. There will be a number of strategies that can be undertaken to seek to mitigate the risk of injury. But this cant protect against the injuries that can and will happen. I hope in the future science would provide better means of preparation and rehabilitation to reduce the impact of these unavoidable injuries. FWIW, we rested Neitz from the PSC and Robbo got lighter duties and both went down with injuries last year at critical times for extended periods

It will be a real achievement for Bailey to do this when it should be the player that is responsible and accountable for those actions. DD is right about old dogs and new tricks. Last year when Yze tried to do this he now lacks the pace to chase and cant make a tackle stick. Why could Yze not chase and put defensive pressure on his opponents in the past five years? Why would Yze avoid the contested ball so often? That's right it was the previous Coach. If anyone got a free ride under Daniher...it was Yze. Yze did not repay the faith put in him. If DD is right and Yze plays at least half the games this year, I hope it is on Bailey's strict terms not on the front running terms he exhibited in recent years. I am confident Bailey will enforce team rules alot better than his predecessor.

With so many new players including Meesen, rookies might struggle for a real run this year.

We dont have the luxury because we have so few senior players left with a large proportion of our list U23/U24. It would not surprise me if they rested Neitz for the pre season cup again.

Why is it when you blood youngsters you have no intent to win? I dont think this is automatically the case. Two years we tried draft pick # 66 Clint Batram in a run with role and what a revelation he was. The Pre Season cup lends itself to experimentation due to the rule changes that are not applicable to the main season like: 1. Number and use of interchanges 2. Nine point goals 3. Boundary throw ins inside the ground playing area; and 4. Carlton actually tries to win a game and does not tank for a priority pick.

I think the pinch hitter argument seals the reason why. At the end of 2007, we cut Brown Ward Bizzell Ferguson from our defence. While ability at AFL level is questionable going forward, there is a fair bit of experience that has gone. We now rely on Rivers and Carroll and the injury prone Whelan up back. Our fall backs are Frawley, Garland,Warnock, Cheney, McNamara. Not much experience. Holland provides both experience and the ability to play on bigger backman. He can take contested marks (a skill diminishing in the AFL) and can play forward. I would have thought Warnock would have gone before Holland.

Firstly I am not that sold on Carroll and think he warms the seat for another better player. Whether that be Frawley or someone else. By the end of the season I would expect that Frawley would be close to pushing for a regular spot in defence. Gouga's option may arise. The Zac Dawson scenario occurred because Zac Dawson was not that good and at the time, he was playing in a team where their midfield were getting beaten regularly and Dawson was forced to play on opponents way bigger than him

Given the youth on the list and the rather high proportion of U23 players I would see many developing over the year. So the best team at Rd 1 may be considerably different in R22. So saying I would expect if fit, Dunn, Bate, Sylvia and McLean and Newton to lay solid claims as AFL footballers and claiming a regular AFL spot. I would expect Davey to be a more mature player this year and better for it. If fit, I would expect Moloney, Bartram Frawley, Pettard and Meesen to make a solid contribution and by season end should be spoken about as regulars in the team. I would not discount Morton and Grimes to get a look at AFL this year. Morton comes higly credential so I am keen to see him go. I would hope we get good/solid years out of the older hands White, Junior, Wheels, Bruce, Green and Neitz. Robbo needs to do more than cameos against crap teams. I think anything we get out of Miller, Yze, PJ, CJ, Holland and Jamar (and I hope we get a bit) is a bonus to the side. By year end I would expect Frawley to usurp Carroll up back. When I look at this list and barring injuries....we should be a better competitive unit with real claims for September action

I think Wheels, Robbo and Yze were already showing the signs of wear and tear and consequential impact on performance in 2006. And Fan is saying is saying he is not expecting much more than they have given. While winning back to back Bluey's Junior played better in 2006 than 2007 but given his age etc I would be hoping for another 2007 type year. And at the very least others to stand up in the midfield to support he and Jones.

If he is in fact left wondering why he is not playing regular AFL footy, then he will not have a hope in 2008. I cant believe he could be not realising whatever many others can see. I trust Bailey will drop some not so subtle hints.

Just like it was for Bate, Pettard, Frawley and Bartram.

If both players are good enough there is room for both of them. Pettard should be there once fit. CJ...well...Nasher summed it one. He makes it at AFL level its a bonus.

Absolutely agree on Schwartz. I have always wondered how he would have gone without the crippling knee injuries. Gerard Healy said when Schwartz turned on an exhibition at the Gabba in 1994, "This is the player you build premierships around". He was good for his first few years when he came back. His performance in the 2000GF was embarrassing and his game deteriorated in 2001 and 2002 and his demeanor soured. I would have rated Allen Jakovich as more talented. A freak of a footballer with a number of attitude and personal shortcomings. Interesting comparison with Merrett. Less of a hitman but more of an athelete than Merrett. Doesnt use his knees as much as Roger. If its any help Benno, family members who followed Melbourne during the 50/60s used to comment that they got sick of winning all the time. Imagine that! In a great team ordinary players do seem better when there are 5 or 6 great players around because the ball winning and usage ability of stars give other players a better opportunity to play to their best because they get to use of the ball to their best advantage. Also a star ability to win a large % of contested ball makes ordinary disposers of the ball look better. For example, Robbie Flower made other teammates look like capable footballers when in most cases they were duds. I dont think your decision was rash as he is the best player you've seen.

Better still, win the midfield and cut the supply to the Hawks forwards. Make Franklin contest for marks. Silky on the lead and the ground but not so much on the contested mark. Slow the movement of the game and get numbers back to assist the defence. Too many capable options up forward to allow an effective double team to work consistently.

Good on you Benno for getting right behind David Neitz. He has been an awesome player over his long career. However while he has not played in a premiership team he has played in sides that have made the finals (including 1 GF) in seven of the years he has been playing. Its a better record that many other teams. Not the greatest ...but not the worst. If you want to focus on a player who was class of the highest order amongst muppets look no further than Robbie Flower who is the only true star I have seen at MFC since the late 60s. Debuted in 1973 but only got to a play finals in his final year in 1987. He was a diamond. Its no wonder that he was named VC in the Team of the Century and kept a six time premiership wingman in Frank Adams on the bench. It was a travesty that Keith Grieg was named ahead of Flower in the AFL team of the century. If you think Neitz is good speak to supporters of an early vintage and asked them about how good Flower was. He is peerless. When you talk of great teams...ask yourself why are they great and what makes them great? Its not good players. Its their best five or six that stand them out and make them great and make more mortal players look better. Just because it was another era, dont deride or cheapen the players in the teams that won five flags in six years (it was an act of thuggery that stopped it being six in a row). Six in a row. A great team with a swag of great players. Brisbane won 3 in a row and look how people worship the Voss and Co of that side. David Neitz has been a very good player for MFC over a long period. But there have been better and have been greater as well. Not a slur at Neitz, but a recognition of the calibre of champions that went before him

That's a pretty good summation of things, Franky.

I think McLean has a lot to prove this year both on the field and off it before he has any claims. *Ducks expecting a missile from Jaded.*

It looks pretty hollow against players that were dominating the competition when Melbourne was in its golden era. You obviously dont go back that far. For mine he was a been a wonderful servant of MFC over a long period but has never dominated his role during that career compared say members of the Team of the Century. I cant see him displacing anyone on the forward line of Mann, Warne Smith Lyon Mueller, Smith, Beames He certainly would not displace Hardeman who was brilliant and underrated CHB. He is on the bench for mine at the expense of Viney. FWIW, I would have had Ridley and Wells ahead of Viney in the Team of the Century.

To be fair to Warnock, alot of Buddy's goals were the loose man overlap where Warnock was drawn to cover other players left loose further up the ground. I dont recall many one on one contests in that last quarter. Nevertheless, Franklin would probably cut Warnock to ribbons in them anyway.