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In 2010 HT started a thread on ruckmen and necessary sized ruckmen. http://demonland.com/forums/index.php?/topic/19760-ruckmen/?hl=jamar#entry311319 I contributed... "Jamar, Johnson, Meesen et al 200cms isnt big enough for tap dominance and if you cant achieve that then you need another string - mobility, marking etc. 200cms is nowadays good for a forward see Tippet, Fitzpatrick, sheeeeeeat Watts is 196!" http://demonland.com/forums/index.php?/topic/19760-ruckmen/?hl=jamar#entry311319 Maybe stating the obvious - I dont know what the stats say (total team hit outs arent that disproportionate vs effective hit outs) but my impression was that Jamar was smashed on Friday night particularly in the centre circle. Ryder jumped over him. Jamar at least tried to jump in the ruck (novel idea) whereas against North he just stood there. There seems to have been two innovations in ruck - the preemptive jump which effectively knocks the opponent out of the way and in response the non jump in response to the preemptive jump - this last technique was Jamar's main trick. The views of ruck specialists please. I reckon he just isnt big enough anymore and he doesnt offer enough around the ground or below his knees. Rucks like Max Bailey and Pyke (Swans) get a run and kick in elite teams. Pederson (193cm), Sellar (196cm) - not much of an option as a "chop out". When we consistently get 20 goals kicked against us ruck is one place where we can start a contest on closer to equal terms. Time for Gawn and Pencil to earn their salt.